Glock 1st fan
Regular Member
Just curious but what ideas would you have to promote open carry in Oklahoma more? Its so rare now that I would love to see more promotion.
The problem with OC with a CC permit is that people feel they payed for CC and they tend to CC.
Do you have a citation for this claim?
My permit allows me to legally carry in a school zone. But I don't know of anyone who chooses to go looking for school zones in which to carry just because they "payed [sic] for" that ability. Likewise, I don't know anyone who CCs over OCing because they "payed" for a permit. I know a lot of folks who got a permit because they wanted to legally CC or wanted to be legal in schools.
I support OC. Support for OC should not ever equate to hostility to CC. How I carry is as much or more my own business as what I carry or whether I carry at all.
Charles
We have seen it here in the forums, states with permit OC are less active than those with constitutional OC. IIRC there is a thread in the Ok sub forum on this very thought.
:lol::lol::lol: That is hilarious!Reduced activity here does not mean reduced OC activity. It might mean that OC activity is becoming acceptable enough not to warrant posts. How many posts does anyone want to make or read about nothing happening? It might also mean that some who OC and used to post here no longer do for some reason. I have my guesses on why that might be.
I don't believe OC activity in Utah is at all reduced from before we had shall issue permits. Indeed, it is probably higher now than then. But very little to report, and frankly this isn't really the preferred forum for many who are active in Utah.
Even if there is reduced OC activity, that is not proof of your conjecture that people CC over OC because they paid for the ability to CC. It might mean that they OC when they had no legal option to CC and got their permits so as to legally carry in their preferred manner.
My desire is not to get into a stats debate with you.
My desire is to persuade you to stop attacking CC with these kinds of unsupportable comments. Carry as you like. Stop sniping at those who prefer to CC for whatever reason. There is no reason to do that.
Charles
My desire is to persuade you to stop attacking CC with these kinds of unsupportable comments. Carry as you like. Stop sniping at those who prefer to CC for whatever reason. There is no reason to do that.
Charles
:lol::lol::lol: That is hilarious!
Just curious but what ideas would you have to promote open carry in Oklahoma more? Its so rare now that I would love to see more promotion.
Second - There are those in the CC crowd (I did not say all, most or even a few, just some) that snipe at OC all the time and they tend to be very vocal...
There is another forum that I'm a member of where this happens quite a bit. I don't visit it as much as I used to due to this reason. I just got tired of reading post after post of "I support the 2nd Amendment, but..." Pictures being posted of people OCing with discussions on what kind of idiots they are, making fun of their gear or comments on how they are prancing around with something to prove. Heaven forbid something negative purportedly happens to somebody open carrying in the news. It became cumbersome and monotonous defending my position on open carry to members who felt they needed to dictate how I should carry. My involvement in that community went from posting, to just reading, to eventually not even going there.
I don't post here that often because I don't have much to contribute. I've been open carrying for two years and still consider myself green. I read, I research and I learn. I go about my business and open carry. I've had a few comments from people but nothing worthy of a post, being positive or negative.
On the topic at hand, I agree that more people would likely OC if we had constitutional carry or legal open carry without a permit. The reason I suspect this is that open carry is dissuaded and often portrayed as dangerous during the required classes for the permit. This was true in my class and I've read posts from others reporting the same thing in theirs. This seems to propagate the animosity for OC from new carriers that don't know any better and reinforce it for older ones that don't care to.
Sorry, utbagpiper - but on this one, I go with WW.
:lol::lol::lol: That is hilarious!
So you don't actually a citation to back up your assertion that people CC because they "payed" for it.
Your citations show reduced activity here, and from that you make two logical leaps:
1-That there is a corresponding reduction in OC on the streets; and,
2-That the reason for that reduction is because people are CCing rather than OCing because they "payed" for the privilege.
Got it.
Charles
First - I did not see the original post as an attack on CC or CC'ers. Just as a statement of differences of opinion.
There is another forum that I'm a member of where this happens quite a bit. I don't visit it as much as I used to due to this reason. I just got tired of reading post after post of "I support the 2nd Amendment, but..."
The assumption that there is less because there is less, not due to cause and affect is lunacy. That is why it was funny.
You again misread my posts. I offered up alternative theories to your own laughable assertion that people OC less because they "payed" to be able to CC. You've don't nothing to counter my theories. Since neither of us can provide any citation to any study as to whether there even is less OCing, much less why, my theories are at least as sound as yours.
And like recognizing that smokers get cancer rather than thinking that those with cancer take up smoking, it sure seems rational that those who want to CC get a permit, rather than people getting a permit and then the permit or payment thereof making them want to go CC.
Its almost like you are unhappy that some people choose to carry discretely rather than joining you in OCing.
Charles
There is some history beyond the single post.
Charles
And as you can see from subsequent posts, WalkingWolf is overtly hostile to any permit.
WalkingWolf has previously made unsupportable claims about OC being a constitutional right while CC is not. I missed that in my reading of the 2nd amendment.
Charles
You have a vivid imagination, and assume wayyy too much. But it is to be expected as that has been your mantra.
I have never expressed a problem with CC,
but I do defend OC,
Clearly a right fails to be a right if the people have to ask "Uncle Sam may I?".
It is almost like you have a problem with constitutional rights being exercised without government interference.