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OC in courthouses

KyDevilDog

New member
Joined
May 2, 2012
Messages
9
Location
East Ky
I know we can not open carry in courtrooms. My question is concerning the new Pikeville Judicial Center. All the court rooms are on the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th floors. The 1st floor has the drivers license, county clerks office, ect. Upon entering the entrance threw the front doors, you must pass threw a medal detector. Would it be legal to carry in if you are just going to the first floor to license your car or something? I have looked threw different KRS's and cant find any answer as to what is legal or not legal. Any help would be greatly apprecated. A KRS number would be outstanding that covers this.
 

DrakeZ07

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
1,080
Location
Lexington, Ky
I know we can not open carry in courtrooms. My question is concerning the new Pikeville Judicial Center. All the court rooms are on the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th floors. The 1st floor has the drivers license, county clerks office, ect. Upon entering the entrance threw the front doors, you must pass threw a medal detector. Would it be legal to carry in if you are just going to the first floor to license your car or something? I have looked threw different KRS's and cant find any answer as to what is legal or not legal. Any help would be greatly apprecated. A KRS number would be outstanding that covers this.

why would anyone want to put up a medal detector? for that matter, why would anyone try to conceal a medal? Heck, they should be openly carrying their medals!

I dunno about OC in a building that serves as the City/County offices, AND the CoJ and it's offices. Remember, Drivers Licensing is controlled by the Court of Justice [CoJ], as is the Circuit Clerk's office, so those are a BIG NO-NO for Oc/CC. I wish CGM would come back to the forums, he had a whole head-ache fiasco with Morehead's City government using the same building as the CoJ, so he could tell you more of that.
 

flb_78

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2010
Messages
544
Location
Gravel Switch, KY
If the entire building is solely occupied by the courts and offices of the courts, then the entire building is off limits. If there are other offices in the buildings, then only the offices of the courts and the courts are off limits.
 

neuroblades

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2009
Messages
1,240
Location
, Kentucky, USA
OK, first off, not a lawyer here and this is based solely upon what others have learned and encountered. I do not have a KRS for this either but as I've been informed, it is law in Kentucky so take it for what it's worth.

All of these new "Justice Center's" that are going up around Kentucky are completely off-limits, they're supposedly treated the same as Detention Center's, as per the carry of weapon's.

I am currently away from my office for the holiday's so I can't research any of this.
 

davidmcbeth

Banned
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,167
Location
earth's crust
I myself do not see an issue with OC in a courtroom ... why should judge's have preferential treatment?

I know of may instances where judges asked for special marshal protection and they were denied ...

Don't worry folks .. plenty of lawyers will be begging to get into a black robe if, in the unlikely event, a judge is shot on the bench.

Heck, you can just wait for the judge outside, so what's the point?
 

rs3604

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 5, 2013
Messages
60
Location
Liberty
The way I see it, if I have to go thru a metal detector the gun and knife sit in the car. When I first moved here I went to change my DLIC and was told, when I emptied my pockets, that my skoal can had to go to the car. So, I figure if I can't take that in they sure won't let a "weapon" in.
 
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09jisaac

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2011
Messages
1,692
Location
Louisa, Kentucky
The way I see it, if I have to go thru a metal detector the gun and knife sit in the car.

The way I see it, my local school, my local circuit court clerk and all the local court rooms all don't have metal detectors. Your logic may land somebody in jail.

Also some small courthouses may have a metal detector at the entrance to a common hall that leads to both courtrooms and public offices.
 

rs3604

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 5, 2013
Messages
60
Location
Liberty
09jisaac, please don't miss understand. I am not advocating you carry somewhere it is illegal,just saying if there is a detector might as well leave it in the car cause you'll be taking it back there anyway.I know there are places where laws say we can not carry.

Gutshot, I get your point, but even if you are in the right, the cost could be substantial to prove it. Better to start proper dialogue and do it the right way, as I know you have many times, then walk through the door with the gun to "prove a point" and end up spending the night in jail.
 

09jisaac

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2011
Messages
1,692
Location
Louisa, Kentucky
09jisaac, please don't miss understand. I am not advocating you carry somewhere it is illegal,just saying if there is a detector might as well leave it in the car cause you'll be taking it back there anyway.I know there are places where laws say we can not carry.

Gutshot, I get your point, but even if you are in the right, the cost could be substantial to prove it. Better to start proper dialogue and do it the right way, as I know you have many times, then walk through the door with the gun to "prove a point" and end up spending the night in jail.

If I can legally carry there, I will carry there if I need to be in there.

I do not carry to prove a point, I do not carry into places just to carry there. But when I have business somewhere, and I can legally carry there, I will be carrying there.

The metal detectors can be there to enforce the authority that they do have, to restrict concealed carry in their buildings. The officers, the Attorney, and the people in control of the building could know exactly what is going on. The only way to know is to ask.

I would walk up to the metal detectors and ask about it.
 

KyDevilDog

New member
Joined
May 2, 2012
Messages
9
Location
East Ky
If I can legally carry there, I will carry there if I need to be in there.

I do not carry to prove a point, I do not carry into places just to carry there. But when I have business somewhere, and I can legally carry there, I will be carrying there.

The metal detectors can be there to enforce the authority that they do have, to restrict concealed carry in their buildings. The officers, the Attorney, and the people in control of the building could know exactly what is going on. The only way to know is to ask.

I would walk up to the metal detectors and ask about it.
I did ask one of the deputies that work the door. His reply was basically, we can do what we want. I did tell him that according to state law, some offices in there we can open carry. He said he knows the law, he works it every day. I asked if he even read the law. He stated he was the law. BTW, he has only had that job for maybe a month total
 

txtim49

New member
Joined
Dec 20, 2013
Messages
6
Location
somerset
ky ag office yes to open in court house

I know we can not open carry in courtrooms. My question is concerning the new Pikeville Judicial Center. All the court rooms are on the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th floors. The 1st floor has the drivers license, county clerks office, ect. Upon entering the entrance threw the front doors, you must pass threw a medal detector. Would it be legal to carry in if you are just going to the first floor to license your car or something? I have looked threw different KRS's and cant find any answer as to what is legal or not legal. Any help would be greatly apprecated. A KRS number would be outstanding that covers this.

if you read ky attorney generals response to open carry it clear states you can not carry in a court room or a judges chambers ,it says that oc is allowed as long as not in stated above place.
 

KYGlockster

Activist Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2010
Messages
1,842
Location
Ashland, KY
I did ask one of the deputies that work the door. His reply was basically, we can do what we want. I did tell him that according to state law, some offices in there we can open carry. He said he knows the law, he works it every day. I asked if he even read the law. He stated he was the law. BTW, he has only had that job for maybe a month total

Court security officers receive 80 hours of training, with very little training on Ky law. These CSOs can be employed for up to a year before they even receive that training. I know from experience that seasoned officers that work the street are mostly ignorant of most Ky law except for the most commonly enforced statutes -- court security officers really don't know anything about Ky law unless they research it on their own.

Most officers that work court security are NOT deputy sheriffs. Court security officers do not have the same powers as a deputy sheriff. These officers are employed by the Sheriff of the county as CSOs because that is what Ky law requires. The only agencies that can provide court security are a county's sheriff's department or the KSP if the sheriff refuses to do so. Deputy sheriffs can work court security detail, but most sheriffs won't waste the time and money to send a deputy through DOCJT training just to put him in a courthouse.
 

MrOverlay

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2009
Messages
186
Location
Olive Hill, Kentucky, USA
While some of what you say is true, it is also true that many CSO's are retired peace officers with decades of honorable service.

As to their knowledge of firearms law, that differs from individual to individual.

Additionally, the Administrative Office of the Courts can, if necessary, contract with agencies other than the SO or KSP to provide court security. While depending on a particular county this can prove difficult, it is not impossible across the state.
 

KYGlockster

Activist Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2010
Messages
1,842
Location
Ashland, KY
While some of what you say is true, it is also true that many CSO's are retired peace officers with decades of honorable service.

As to their knowledge of firearms law, that differs from individual to individual.

Additionally, the Administrative Office of the Courts can, if necessary, contract with agencies other than the SO or KSP to provide court security. While depending on a particular county this can prove difficult, it is not impossible across the state.

Can you post relevant statutes that allow that AOC to do so? I've never come across them and would like to study them.

I don't know what it is like in your county, but here in mine there are not "many" retired peace officers working as CSOs. CSOs are peace officers themselves while transporting or on the grounds of the courthouse. Here in Boyd County we have CSOs that venture well outside of their jurisdiction. I know of one young guy that knows nothing about relevant and important issues involved in "defending the peace" and will wear his CSO badge while MAKING ARRESTS working for a SECURITY company. This is ILLEGAL! Yet when brought to the attention of "the powers that be" it is ignored. It just doesn't matter what a fellow peace officer concerned with abiding by ALL statutes says.

I'm glad Terry Keelin is leaving. If you don't want more corruption then don't vote for Rob Donta Boyd County residents!
 
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MrOverlay

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2009
Messages
186
Location
Olive Hill, Kentucky, USA
I can't say for sure. I know before I retired, over a year ago, AOC was faced with the possibility due to some SO issues in some counties.

If they every followed through with that, I can't say.
 
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