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OT: question about legality of "license check" in NC

cabarrus

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Jun 10, 2008
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Cabarrus County, North Carolina, USA
I'm sorry if this is too off-topic, but thought there might be some opinions here. I was driving home from work today and had the pleasure of being stopped (along with everyone else driving along Johnson Dairy road ,near NC 3) by an Iredell County Sheriffs deputy. They were just doing a "license check", with which I complied, along with showing my CHP and telling him I did not have a gun with me (trying to follow CHP requirements).

Is such a "license check" legal in NC? I thought not due to NC not being a "stop and identify" state, but does being in the car make a difference?

Thanks for any opinions.
 

MKEgal

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in front of my computer, WI
Hopefully some NC residents will chime in, but to the best of my knowledge unless they have RAS or PC of a crime no they can't stop just to check your license.
"Just say no."
Of course, they could then invent a reason... oh, yeah, we saw you weaving... you didn't signal back there... or [crash] your taillight is broken.

Out of curiosity, did they just glance at it to be sure you're you & the license is current, or did they actually run the license # or your name to see if you had any warrants, etc.?
 

merc460

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North Carolina, USA
I went through that check also. Had my pistol right beside me and he had no issues with it. :D
He just asked for my licence, looked at it briefly and sent me on my way. I think they were/are looking for someone if I had to guess.
 

cabarrus

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It was just a quick glance at it and then I was on my way. It took more time for him to repeatedly say "we're just doing a license check" as I asked him what the stop was about, then for him to actually look at my license and CHP when I produced them.
 
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sultan62

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Clayton, NC
I have yet to discover a legal basis for these license checks. I've only been through one, and that was before I learned more about my rights. At this point, I'd simply say I'd rather not give it, but will if it is demanded. I'd take a different route if not driving, but I'm unsure about the legal issues involved there.
 

elixin77

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Greenville, NC, ,
I guess I can see both sides of the issue here:
-They are, in essence, phishing for people that don't have a license with them, and hoping to raise a little extra money with either people who don't have their license, or those that may have been drinking (it's 5 pm somewhere, right :))
-You technically are obligated to show them your license since you are operating a motor vehicle
-However, they had no RAS to stop you, and since we don't live in a Stop and Identify state, we technically shouldn't have to show the license
-But, this loops back to my earlier statement, in that you are operating a motor vehicle

So, this issue can be a bit tricky. personally, if I'm driving a car, then I would show them my license, just to make them go away. However, if I was walking, and they wanted to see ID, i'd tell them to go pound sand (in a much nicer way, of course)
 

sultan62

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I guess I can see both sides of the issue here:
-They are, in essence, phishing for people that don't have a license with them, and hoping to raise a little extra money with either people who don't have their license, or those that may have been drinking (it's 5 pm somewhere, right :))
-You technically are obligated to show them your license since you are operating a motor vehicle
-However, they had no RAS to stop you, and since we don't live in a Stop and Identify state, we technically shouldn't have to show the license
-But, this loops back to my earlier statement, in that you are operating a motor vehicle

So, this issue can be a bit tricky. personally, if I'm driving a car, then I would show them my license, just to make them go away. However, if I was walking, and they wanted to see ID, i'd tell them to go pound sand (in a much nicer way, of course)

I see your point, but at the same time, they are not allowed to arbitrarily pull vehicles. There still must be RAS to perform a 'Terry Stop', and there is none at a license check.
 

elixin77

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I see your point, but at the same time, they are not allowed to arbitrarily pull vehicles. There still must be RAS to perform a 'Terry Stop', and there is none at a license check.

understood, however, driving a motor vehicle is one of the reasons why we have to show our ID, which loops back to the whole "must show ID when operating a car" argument.

I'd look it up a bit more in depth, but I'm studying for a psych test tomorrow, and I'm just taking a break, lol
 

JoeSparky

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Pleasant Grove, Utah, USA
understood, however, driving a motor vehicle is one of the reasons why we have to show our ID, which loops back to the whole "must show ID when operating a car" argument.

I'd look it up a bit more in depth, but I'm studying for a psych test tomorrow, and I'm just taking a break, lol

Two issues here.... A driver's license is required to operate a motor vehicle on a road AND they can't arbitrarily pull a random car over to check the operator's license status WITHOUT RAS that a crime has been committed, is being committed or just about to be committed by the operator of the vehicle!

STOPPING ALL THE VEHICLES WITHOUT RAS SURE SEEMS TO BE A VIOLATION OF MY "UNREASONABLE SEARCH AND SEIZURE" Constitutional protections!
 

sultan62

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Clayton, NC
Two issues here.... A driver's license is required to operate a motor vehicle on a road AND they can't arbitrarily pull a random car over to check the operator's license status WITHOUT RAS that a crime has been committed, is being committed or just about to be committed by the operator of the vehicle!

STOPPING ALL THE VEHICLES WITHOUT RAS SURE SEEMS TO BE A VIOLATION OF MY "UNREASONABLE SEARCH AND SEIZURE" Constitutional protections!

Agreed.
 

Spearhead

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Jan 29, 2011
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150 miles South of Richmond
I remember reading something about this a while back. The NC courts have ruled that if they are checking everyone at the license check that there is legal. It is only if they single you out for a license check that they need PC or RAS.

I believe they also ruled that the officers did not have to check every car. They could check, say , every third car of every 5th car just so long as it was a uniformly applied pattern. This was because in some high traffic areas stopping every car would impose traffic congestion and a bottleneck.
 
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edrolee

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May 29, 2010
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Loughman,Florida, USA
I remember reading something about this a while back. The NC courts have ruled that if they are checking everyone at the license check that there is legal. It is only if they single you out for a license check that they need PC or RAS.

I believe they also ruled that the officers did not have to check every car. They could check, say , every third car of every 5th car just so long as it was a uniformly applied pattern. This was because in some high traffic areas stopping every car would impose traffic congestion and a bottleneck.

i know that SFs on AFBs used to use some off the wall method of deciding what cars to check, ie. every red car or every 3rd silver car, just to keep things random but have a uniform method of checking (this is gate checks i'm talking about of course and in the 90's)
 

NoGlock4U

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Barbeque Capital of NC, ,
I live in a county that does check points constantly and have a few friends who work for NCDOT Governor's Highway Safety Program. License check points are basically a "license check point". It is required by law that every officer working that check point ONLY ask for your license and you license only from EVERY vehicle that comes through. The same applies to it they asked for "license and registration". If one officer asks for something else, the check point is no longer legal... But it's still required by law that you show your CCW permit. If you come through drunk or with no license or your car is full of drugs or marijuana smoke is rolling out your windows or a dead body in the back seat, well... then that's your own fault...

But coming from military experience, they make their own rule on checking cars whether it be "one two, skip a few" or what not.
 
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