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Please tell me this wasn't on of you..

skidmark

skidmark

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OMFG.

There are words to describe that person. They are found in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual, Vol. V.

While he may be technically correct, he is also several kinds of wrong. There may not be meds for some of those conditions.

I did not (could not force myself to) read to the end. Did he get the guard in front of a magistrate? If that happened was there anything else (like a court hearing) that came afterwards?

stay safe.
 
sharkey

sharkey

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I read the whole thing but did not watch the video. The cops removed the security guard from his presence and let the guard go. I don't know the law there (here in AZ I believe security guards must be licensed to carry on the job) but how can you talk about OC while trying to get a guy arrested for it. And he was angry the security guard that he was FILMING took his picture ... :banghead:
 
Lord Sega

Lord Sega

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He "handed custody" over to the responding LEO, the LEO let the security guard walk.

Oregon does have "citizen's arrest":

133.225
Arrest by private person

(1) A private person may arrest another person for any crime committed in the presence of the private person if the private person has probable cause to believe the arrested person committed the crime. A private person making such an arrest shall, without unnecessary delay, take the arrested person before a magistrate or deliver the arrested person to a peace officer.

(2) In order to make the arrest a private person may use physical force as is justifiable under ORS 161.255 (Use of physical force by private person making citizens arrest). [1973 c.836 §74]

HOWEVER, he did not have RAS let alone Probable Cause (required, see above), and the security guard did not have to show a CHL or prove anything to some guy on the street.
Technically he was right that the security guard, to carry loaded in the city limits of Portland needs a CHL or must OC unloaded.
He didn't appear to illegally detain the security guard (ie keep him from leaving by threat or force), I don't know why the guard voluntarily stayed in the encounter.

The guard should have told him to pound sand and walked away, and if the guy tried to detain (again, no PC) he would be up on illegal detainment (kidnapping?) or assault if he held the guard by any force.

Schrödinger's cat paradox: security guard; legal with CHL, illegal without CHL, doesn't have to show/prove CHL to guy on the street. Guy has no RAS/PC. Guy was wrong.
 
sharkey

sharkey

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Is this true by the way, is a CHL required to open carry in Portland?

The Portland Public Order 14A.60.010 does not exempt citizens with a DPSST license, it makes no mention of a DPSST license at all, so it seems by the law, the only way a private citizen can open carry a loaded weapon in Portland Oregon is via a Concealed Handgun License
Click to expand...

NM, question answered above, thank you Lord Sega.

If someone came up to me questioning my right to carry (cop or citizen), I'd be pretty P.O.'d
 
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davidmcbeth

davidmcbeth

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Lord Sega said:
He "handed custody" over to the responding LEO, the LEO let the security guard walk.

Oregon does have "citizen's arrest":
.
Click to expand...

Citizen's arrest is a common law right .. so unless their is a law banning it, then its legal. Good cite though, looks like OR wanted to limit the right instead of eliminating it...
 
sharkey

sharkey

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davidmcbeth said:
Sounds like "If I cannot OC, then you can't" mentality .... why can cops carry in certain manners and not the public in the same manner in certain states?
Click to expand...

If he was detaining a cop for carrying illegally I'd support him, what he was doing was harassing an individual because he didn't like the fact that he yelled at a teenager for ******* on the sidewalk.

The dual standards is fodder for another thread. :lol:

I found it hilarious when I heard many cops would lose their right to carry for DV even though I think that law is unconstitutional.
 
sharkey

sharkey

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davidmcbeth said:
Citizen's arrest is a common law right .. so unless their is a law banning it, then its legal. Good cite though, looks like OR wanted to limit the right instead of eliminating it...
Click to expand...

I can't speak to common law but in many states statutorily the offense must be felonious or disturbing to the peace. I don't know if carrying loaded in Oregon without a CPH is a misdemeanor or felony.

Regardless the guy who did the citizen's arrest is an idiot. Threatening an open carry protest for someone else carrying a gun is beyond words.

ETA: Since the man doing the citizen's arrest is not LE the 4th doesn't apply to him but he nor LE have the right to search and seize for a permit or to check if the gun is loaded. (I know Cali used to but that was illegal too)
 
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Lord Sega

Lord Sega

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For Oregon: Oregon is an OC state, but the state preemption allows cities (Portland is one of them) to have city ordinance for unloaded OC, a CHL exempts having to unload.

Sharkey, you are right that as a civilian 4A doesn't apply, but ORS 133.225 Arrest by private person requires Probable Cause to perform the "citizen's arrest". (see the ORS in my earlier post).

EDIT, had to add this Citizen's arrest video LINK
 
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D

donny

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Yet another 20-something ******-bag. A seriously uneducated hypocrite too.
 
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