Questionable Handling

rcawdor57 said:

It is a shame too since G.M. supports open carry BIGTIME. But....that store sucks! Every gun I have purchased at Cabelas SHOULD have been purchased at that G.M. Instead I would rather drive the 61 miles EACH WAY to Cabelas and back AND GO BACK AGAIN after 48 hours for my handgun purchases. Let's see...in the past 14 months I have purchased two shotguns, a semi auto .22 carbine, a revolver and several boxes of ammo from Cabelas instead of that G.M. store. All because they have terrible customer service in the firearms department.

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Fletcher Arms in Waukesha is closer. They also are perfectly fine with people carrying in there.

Wow,
I have never seen that in a store before, much less Gander. I have always found everyone dealing with weapons to be professional. I knew better than that at age 10.

I'm in the camp of those who believe this type of disrespect for a firearm is never ever appropriate. Even if you've verified that it is indeed unloaded, the idea is to always treat that firearm with the same respect as one that isn't verified to be so. That way you never get in the habit of bad muzzle control and improper handling. There's no excuse for this garbage.

I actually used to work for Gander Mt. a long time ago. At that time, they had a rather extensive test before hiring someone in the firearms department but after you were hired there wasn't any real type of training for the safe handling of firearms. I bet now there is no such test and still is no training once you are hired. I reach that conclusion not only because of this incident but also from witnessing similar activity myself.

When I worked there, I would verify a chamber was clear and if it wasn't unwiedly; would hand the firearm to the customer with the action open. If by the design of the firearm it would be hard to hand over action open; I would show the customer that the chamber was empty before closing it and handing it over. I never once objected to a customer rechecking it himself and all this was done with proper muzzle control. Although I did receive one complaint for doing so I would be quick to correct a customer on proper handling if I saw it. I received many more letters of praise for my customer service so I never got a hard time from the manager.

Also, when I worked there it seemed that all the employee's were "gun guys (and gals)" who were knowledgable and really liked talking to customers about the subject. Now days; not so much.

Brass Magnet said:

When I worked there, I would verify a chamber was clear and if it wasn't unwiedly; would hand the firearm to the customer with the action open. If by the design of the firearm it would be hard to hand over action open; I would show the customer that the chamber was empty before closing it and handing it over. I never once objected to a customer rechecking it himself and all this was done with proper muzzle control. Although I did receive one complaint for doing so I would be quick to correct a customer on proper handling if I saw it. I received many more letters of praise for my customer service so I never got a hard time from the manager.

Also, when I worked there it seemed that all the employee's were "gun guys (and gals)" who were knowledgable and really liked talking to customers about the subject. Now days; not so much.

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This is why I go to Dam Road Gun Shop in Delavan. They check it and put it on the counter pointing at neither of us, I usually re-check it and then when I'm done I lay it the same way they did on the counter.

In addition, they are a small, locally owned shop who supports constitutional carry.

Even if they are a couple bucks more, I buy from them.

BROKENSPROKET said:

After a firearm has been cleared where the handler and myself know that it is cleared in a controlled environment, where we not assuming it's cleared, but we are confident it is cleared, it does not phase me if the barrel is inadvertantly pointed at me.

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Before I bought my first pistol, while I was discussing setting up a safety lesson & trying on various makes to see if they fit my hand, the safety trainer handed me a pistol (which both he & the counter guy checked to be sure it was clear) & wanted me to point it at him!!! I kept trying to point it to one side or the floor, and it was really wierd to point it AT the safety guy, even though I'd just seen that it was safe & he was telling me to do it. (He wanted to see how it lined up in my hand / wrist.)

kelevra said:

I have had counter people berate me for checking the chamber right after they did.

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When I bought my second pistol, this wasn't a make I'd handled before (more than to shoot a rental at the range & fall in lust with it). So I asked the sales guy to show me how to break it down for cleaning. I saw him clear it before he handed it to me, and started to go on with his instructions about how to take it apart when he stopped me & insisted I also check it. Since it's a Glock this double-check makes sense - have to pull the trigger in order to take it apart.

"All guns are always loaded" is a good rule, with the most allowance for safety. Everyone can make a mistake, and that's an extra layer of oops prevention, when an oops can be pretty painful & messy.

MKEgal said:

"All guns are always loaded" is a good rule, with the most allowance for safety. Everyone can make a mistake, and that's an extra layer of oops prevention, when an oops can be pretty painful & messy.

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You make one mistake, it could be your last.

protias said:

You make one mistake, it could be your last.

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Firearms safety has built in redundancy for a reason. We get distracted. Ever mow the lawn while thinking about the game? Misfires happen. The only thing that keeps a misfire from being an unfortunate accident is having the "don't point a gun rule" ingrained into your subconscious. And the only way I personally know how to do that is never do it. Like anything else in life it's not "if" it's gonna happen. It's "when".

not a scolding just to explain.

BROKENSPROKET said:

I might get schooled for saying this but...

The firearm safety rules that states treat every gun should be treated as if it's loaded is in place because off all the people that have gotten shot with a firearm that was ASSUMED to be empty.

After a firearm has been cleared where the handler and myself know that it is cleared in a controlled environment, where we not assuming it's cleared, but we are confident it is cleared, it does not phase me if the barrel is inadvertantly gets pointed at me.

But If we are hunting or at the range, it bothers me extremely.

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This took place in a public setting, There may have been people presant and saw the firearm cleared, Along with people not presant to see the firearm cleared , in their eyes it may be loaded they just don't know :dude:and leaves a bad impression thats all i'm saying.

While I've not run across any idiots handling guns around me, (knock on wood) my particular habit before handing it to anyone is to check it, hand over and I get back before anyone else touches it. If someone else wants to see it, it gets checked again, even if they just saw me do that. My fear is someone might slip something in to be "funny". Might be unrealistic, but better safe than sorry....

HandyHamlet said:

Went to a sporting goods store last night to shop for holsters. I was told to bring the firearms in to ensure a proper fit. I did (unloaded and no mags).

The young gentleman behind the counter uncased the firearms, checked them, released the slides and hammers, then placed them on the counter. Pointed directly at my ample midsection. I was a bit freaked to say the least so I stepped to the side. He took one pistol and entered the holster isle. While we searched he continually spun my pistol on the palm of his hand. I was so freaked I couldn't even look. I immediately concluded my business and left.

In my day we walked barefoot, up hill, 20 miles in snow just to go to school. So am I being a prude? Or has gun safety and handling changed?

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I would have said... HEY...WTF are you doing ??!!! Play with your own pistol but NOT WITH MINE ! you drop it, scratch it, etc...your store is buying me a new one ! then I would have left, like you did.

With the spinning your gun in his hand, I would have said something to him about disrespecting my property and see where it went from there.

Common sense is that you can't be too careful, especially with something that can take a life. You just don't point a gun at someone unless you intend to use it. I don't care if I just saw someone check that it was clear and then I checked - you don't do it! There is no reason to take a chance like that or to disrespect someone by pointing it at them. (Outside of training purposes.)

springfield 1911 said:

This took place in a public setting, There may have been people presant and saw the firearm cleared, Along with people not presant to see the firearm cleared , in their eyes it may be loaded they just don't know :dude:and leaves a bad impression thats all i'm saying.

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I firmly believe in the ALWAYS & NEVER rules of firearm safety, I'm just saying that if I known it's clear, it just does not bother me if it gets pointed at me. I know I am different. My momma always told me so.

rcawdor57 said:

That Gander Mountain is barely half a mile or so from my house and EVERY time I have gone in that store to the back where all the guns and ammo are I have NEVER been helped by ANY of the staff that actually work in the firearms department. That is the absolute worst firearms department I have ever been to.

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+1. This gun dept. is staffed by horrible salespeople, and if they have any knowledge of firearms whatsoever, they sure don't show it! I get the impression most of them were stocking shelves at Wal-Mart last week.

rcawdor57 said:

The last time I was there the assistant manager told me I couldn't carry in the store....yeah....I took him to the Gander Mountain sign and asked him to read it. I haven't been back but once and that was only because I needed a gun case for a pistol. I refuse to shop at Gander Mountain in Kenosha.

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Occasionally I go there to shop (but not to buy) and I carry in the store. While no one has actually said anything to me, it has resulted in getting some strange looks - from the employees, not the customers! I agree - spend your money elsewhere.

I try to avoid Gander at all possible costs.
The whole store format sucks. They never have what I am lookin for
and they only stock for the season that is currently goin on.
And they are way over priced.

Back when we had a Sportsmans Whorehouse...Ooops,...I mean Warehouse.
I would gladly travel the extra 15 or 20 miles out of the way to patronize them.

Now I would much rather go to Cabela's in Richfield....and try to plan my stops there on the way to my Sis's place on the other side of Appleton.
Only problem is that I usually have to watch my time alot closer so I can still make it up to Sis's in a reasonable amount of time.

I hate spendin a whole day on the road for a 2 hr trip one way.

LR Yote

Went on a scouting mission to Jalensky's in K-Town today.

Nice place. WCI literature is prominently displayed on the counter.

However those who support Constitutional Carry should note that the clerks are of the opinion that:

OCers are idiots. Their words.
OCers after CC is passed are bigger idiots.
CCers after it passes are idiots. But not as bad as OCers.



They are adamantly against Constitutional Carry. I found the clerks at Gander Mountain to be opposed to Constitutional Carry as well.

Just an FYI as to what we are up against.

HandyHamlet said:

Went on a scouting mission to Jalensky's in K-Town today.

Nice place. WCI literature is prominently displayed on the counter.

However those who support Constitutional Carry should note that the clerks are of the opinion that:

OCers are idiots. Their words.
OCers after CC is passed are bigger idiots.
CCers after it passes are idiots. But not as bad as OCers.



They are adamantly against Constitutional Carry. I found the clerks at Gander Mountain to be opposed to Constitutional Carry as well.

Just an FYI as to what we are up against.

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I have been doing business at Jalensky's for years. While the clerks opinions are disappointing, they are just clerks. Its a just job for them not a calling. Most people who work in gun-shops don't even have enough knowledge about guns to sell them, let alone a passion for gun rights.

oak1971 said:

.... let alone a passion for gun rights.

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Is it that or is it a case of "I work in the industry thus you will never know as much as me. You are customer, therefore irritating, and you are interrupting my hourly grab ass session"?

Either way it's a bit disheartening.

HandyHamlet said:

Is it that or is it a case of "I work in the industry thus you will never know as much as me. You are customer, therefore irritating, and you are interrupting my hourly grab ass session"?

Either way it's a bit disheartening.

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Its disheartening, but not much you can do except try to set them straight.

Sure there is a fair amount of arrogance to go with the ignorance. They rarely cop that attitude with me at Jalensky's. I will tell them just how full of **** they are.

HandyHamlet said:

In my day we walked barefoot, up hill, 20 miles in snow just to go to school. So am I being a prude? Or has gun safety and handling changed?

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So you spent about 12 hours/day walking to and from school?

Yes. And another 12 in the fields. And another 12 in the mine. Then, if we were really good, we got to gnaw on raw hide while weaving fishing nets by the light of bear fat candles for a treat.

Ah. The good old daze.