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Drinking (within the drink drive limit) while carrying?

MikeLovell

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
88
Location
Illinois
I'm a little confused about this, I've read summaries that say you can't drink. Others than say you cannot be "impaired".

So I'm entering a tavern, either concealed or I get the owners permission and open carry.

Can I have *a* beer?
 

Teej

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
522
Location
, Wisconsin, USA
Per WI SS 941.237 you may not (class A misdemeanor) carry a handgun onto a place with a class B liquor license (on premise consumption) unless either:

a: You have specific permission for "an event of limited duration" from the person the liquor permit was issued to. (ie, get it in writing that "On May 31, Joe Schmoe is allowed to carry his firearm in Ron's Tavern."), not "Yeah, the manager said it was OK" 941.237(3)(g)

or

b: You have a CCL and are not drinking. 941.237.(3)(cx)

(There's a bunch of other stuff, but those are the important ones)
 
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MikeLovell

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
88
Location
Illinois
Per WI SS 941.237 you may not (class A misdemeanor) carry a handgun onto a place with a class B liquor license (on premise consumption) unless either:

a: You have specific permission for "an event of limited duration" from the person the liquor permit was issued to. (ie, get it in writing that "On May 31, Joe Schmoe is allowed to carry his firearm in Ron's Tavern."), not "Yeah, the manager said it was OK" 941.237(3)(g)

or

b: You have a CCL and are not drinking. 941.237.(3)(cx)

(There's a bunch of other stuff, but those are the important ones)

Maybe I'm mixing it up with not being impaired (generally when carrying).

So you could have a beer when open carrying, if you were doing so with the owners permission. Has anybody open carried in a tavern, if so, how did they obtain permission (and prove they had such)?
 

Teej

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
522
Location
, Wisconsin, USA
Like I said - if you get permission, get it in writing.

As to the under the influence, that's a different subsection. 941.237 is about having a firearm in a bar/tavern.

941.20 covers "endangering safety by reckless use of a weapon" including
(b) Operates or goes armed with a firearm while he or she is under the influence of an intoxicant; or


where "under the influence" is defined not by statute but by jury instructions...typically:

"“Under the Influence‖ has been defined as materially impairing the ability to handle a firearm which is further explained as consuming ―an amount f
alcohol to cause the person to be less able to exercise clear judgment and steady hand necessary to handle a firearm"

The vehicular standard of .08 would probably be the best "solid reference", but if the prosecution gets people to say you were slurring your words, staggering, etc that might hold up.
 

MikeLovell

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
88
Location
Illinois
Like I said - if you get permission, get it in writing.

I can't remember the exact threads, but I have read about people open carrying with the owners permission. I'm pretty sure they didn't get it in writing.
 

MSG Laigaie

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Messages
3,239
Location
Philipsburg, Montana
In my neighborhood some restaurants serve alcohol. I, and my Sweet Baboo, frequent a specific mexican place because the service is great, they like weapons and have great margaritas. With a meal I will drink and greatly enjoy that margarita. Am I impaired? No. Am I armed? Always. I am an adult, I choose not to intoxicate myself in public.
 

JamesCanby

Activist Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2010
Messages
1,480
Location
Alexandria, VA at www.NoVA-MDSelfDefense.com
In my neighborhood some restaurants serve alcohol. I, and my Sweet Baboo, frequent a specific mexican place because the service is great, they like weapons and have great margaritas. With a meal I will drink and greatly enjoy that margarita. Am I impaired? No. Am I armed? Always. I am an adult, I choose not to intoxicate myself in public.

I would like to enjoy a meal-enhancing libation with my meal, but I will not do it while carrying. Not because one glass of wine would have much of an effect on my 200 pound body, but because if an event occurs where I have to use my firearm in self defense, and it goes to trial, I am certain that the prosecutor or plaintiff's attorney will make a big deal out of the fact that I had been drinking. So, I choose not to drink alcoholic beverages when dining out. I, too, am an adult, and I choose to err on the side of caution.
 

MikeLovell

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
88
Location
Illinois
I would like to enjoy a meal-enhancing libation with my meal, but I will not do it while carrying. Not because one glass of wine would have much of an effect on my 200 pound body, but because if an event occurs where I have to use my firearm in self defense, and it goes to trial, I am certain that the prosecutor or plaintiff's attorney will make a big deal out of the fact that I had been drinking. So, I choose not to drink alcoholic beverages when dining out. I, too, am an adult, and I choose to err on the side of caution.

Well yes, there are two sides to that one. I am (like both suggestions) just talking about a drink with a meal.

I was just interested in the legality of it.

It sounds like you pretty much can't do it without planning well in advance or knowing where to go. I just visit Wisconsin, I'm not a resident, so it won't affect me massively either way.

Just curiosity.
 

MAC702

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
6,331
Location
Nevada
Regardless of what the law says, I believe that most on here abstain from imbibing while carrying. The risk is just not worth the enjoyment of your favorite alcoholic beverage.

Now that the Wisconsin law is settled, and the Virginia anti-drinking opinions are coming out, I guess I'll at least make sure to say there are plenty of members here who drink RESPONSIBLY while not being unarmed and defenseless.

I'm glad I live in a state that doesn't treat me like a child and only makes it illegal to carry when DRUNK. To specify, I mean NV, which is where I live most of the time. (It's also legal in UT, with a slightly lower BAC limit)

If I go to a bar and have a drink while watching a game with friends (adults know how many drinks they can have over what time period), I don't leave my gun at home or in the car. I also still keep my knife, and my car keys *horrors!* in my pocket, too.

Those who can't drink responsibly probably shouldn't drink at all.

Depending on local laws, being worried about prosecutors MAY be an issue in your area. Here, they only care if the bad guy was the bad guy and whether or not you are justified in the shooting. Still, I'd rather be educating a jury than my friend educating those who came to my funeral.
 
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MKEgal

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2010
Messages
4,383
Location
in front of my computer, WI
MikeLovell said:
Has anybody open carried in a tavern, if so, how did they obtain permission (and prove they had such)?
Yes, many times before we had cc.
I walked in & asked if it was OK for me to have dinner there.
They look at me funny, but always say yes.
BTW, "tavern" means anywhere you can buy & drink an alcoholic beverage, including both what people think of as a bar, and restaurants such as Olive Garden.

As for the applicable laws...
Here's one place you can search by WI statute number or key word.

941.237 Carrying handgun where alcoholic beverages may be sold and consumed
(2) Whoever intentionally goes armed with a handgun on any premises for which a Class B … license … has been issued under ch. 125 is guilty of a Class A misdemeanor.

(3) Subsection (2) does not apply to any of the following:
(cx) A licensee … if … not consuming alcohol on the premises. [n.b. this does not specify openly or concealed]

(g) The possession or use of a handgun on the premises if authorized for a specific event of limited duration by the owner or manager [n.b. it does not have to be written permission]


941.20
Endangering safety by use of dangerous weapon
(1) Whoever does any of the following is guilty of a Class A misdemeanor:
(b) Operates or goes armed with a firearm while he or she is under the influence of an intoxicant

939.22(42) "Under the influence of an intoxicant" means that the actor's ability to operate a vehicle or handle a firearmor airgun is materially impairedbecause of his or her consumption of an alcohol beverage, hazardous inhalant, of a controlled substance or controlled substance analog ... or any combination ...

885.235(1)(g)(c) The fact that the analysis shows that the person had an alcohol concentration of 0.08 or more is prima facie evidence that he or she was under the influence of an intoxicant

 
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davidmcbeth

Banned
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,167
Location
earth's crust
Drinking responsibly means not spilling a drop . . .

Then I'm a helleva responsible drinker ! Extra-ordinarily so !

I would never find anyone guilty of carry while drinking ... who cares?

I've never shot anyone while drinking. I've been shot down while drinking though.

More crazy not-based-on-fact conclusions.

More "responsible gun owner" legal gibberish.
 
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