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Scenario question

utbagpiper

Banned
Joined
Jul 5, 2006
Messages
4,061
Location
Utah
One may not openly carry (or conceal carry without a CWFL) on his 'own land' unless the land is where he lives.

Thank you.

I use the term curtlidge, which may not be the most precise, but I generally want to distinguish "property" alone vs property plus out buildings"; and "property one owns" from "at his home".

It was the use of term curtilage that had me wondering as that is generally more restrictive than "residential land" or something similar.

So, ignoring residences with common property (apartments, condos, town homes, etc), under Florida State law a person may OC or CC without a permit in his own home or business and the land on which that sits (and outbuildings on the same land) that is under his exclusive control. Whether he has a 1/10th acre sub-urban lot, or a 10,000 acre ranch, if his home/business sits on it and the land is his, the owner may OC or CC without a permit. Is that correct?

Can the owner grant visitors the same privilege? Or is it restricted to just the owner and his family?

Thanks again for the education.

Charles
 

notalawyer

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2012
Messages
1,061
Location
Florida
Thank you.



It was the use of term curtilage that had me wondering as that is generally more restrictive than "residential land" or something similar.

So, ignoring residences with common property (apartments, condos, town homes, etc), under Florida State law a person may OC or CC without a permit in his own home or business and the land on which that sits (and outbuildings on the same land) that is under his exclusive control. Whether he has a 1/10th acre sub-urban lot, or a 10,000 acre ranch, if his home/business sits on it and the land is his, the owner may OC or CC without a permit. Is that correct?

Can the owner grant visitors the same privilege? Or is it restricted to just the owner and his family?

Thanks again for the education.

Charles

Yeah it's a little hard to define without going into a verbose technical explanation.

the owner may OC or CC without a permit. Is that correct?
Anyone that lives/works there, Yes (as long as it is one piece of property unlike the OP's case where he had another parcel down the road a piece)

Can the owner grant visitors the same privilege?
No. One cannot 'grant' anyone else the right/privilege to violate the law.
However if there was some other exempted activity occurring on that property, like hunting, fishing, camping, target practice, etc. Then visitors/invitees could carry openly or concealed without a CWFL.

And before someone calls me on it, all of this is contingent upon the individual not be prohibited from firearms possession by either state or federal law, 18 years of age of older (or younger with parental permission/adult supervision - or not depending on the situation), not 'drunk' (only applies to holding a loaded firearm or shooting it), etc., etc., etc.
 
Last edited:

utbagpiper

Banned
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Jul 5, 2006
Messages
4,061
Location
Utah
Anyone that lives/works there, Yes (as long as it is one piece of property unlike the OP's case where he had another parcel down the road a piece)

No. One cannot 'grant' anyone else the right/privilege to violate the law.

Thank you.

Charles
 

notalawyer

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2012
Messages
1,061
Location
Florida
Would not the "property" a farmer or rancher uses to raise his crops or animals be his "place of business".?

Probably. I didn't think about it that respect.

Getting there (the OP's question) is a problem. While the statute make provisions for going to/from hunting, fishing, camping, and the range; it makes no such exception for going to/from home/work.
 

Maverick9

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
1,404
Location
Mid-atlantic
If you have a 'Sheriff' why not talk to him and get a 'permission slip'? You're asking for a limited ability to deal with your separate properties. Carry that slip in writing on your person so if you're stopped you can present it to the litigiously-minded officer(s).

Present it to the Sheriff as a hypothetical and if he seems to agree ask him to sign off on a form such as 'I give permission of (the OP) to open carry his rifle and handgun in whatever manner he wishes in the vicinity of his properties and a mile radius thereof... /signed/ Sheriff of Nottingham County; /date/ on this date _________.

Now, as you know it's often better not to ask and be turned down, but if you're nervous about it this would probably fly, especially with an elected official. Maybe you can establish a relationship with him beforehand. Buy him flowers or something?

HTH.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
9,315
Location
here nc
If you have a 'Sheriff' why not talk to him and get a 'permission slip'? You're asking for a limited ability to deal with your separate properties. Carry that slip in writing on your person so if you're stopped you can present it to the litigiously-minded officer(s).

Present it to the Sheriff as a hypothetical and if he seems to agree ask him to sign off on a form such as 'I give permission of (the OP) to open carry his rifle and handgun in whatever manner he wishes in the vicinity of his properties and a mile radius thereof... /signed/ Sheriff of Nottingham County; /date/ on this date _________.

Now, as you know it's often better not to ask and be turned down, but if you're nervous about it this would probably fly, especially with an elected official. Maybe you can establish a relationship with him beforehand. Buy him flowers or something?

HTH.

nawlll, visit the sheriff, explain the situation, and if they are in agreement, get him to give you their business card which he signs...that carrys more clout in more situations..

ipse
 

notalawyer

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2012
Messages
1,061
Location
Florida
If you have a 'Sheriff' why not talk to him and get a 'permission slip'? You're asking for a limited ability to deal with your separate properties. Carry that slip in writing on your person so if you're stopped you can present it to the litigiously-minded officer(s).

Present it to the Sheriff as a hypothetical and if he seems to agree ask him to sign off on a form such as 'I give permission of (the OP) to open carry his rifle and handgun in whatever manner he wishes in the vicinity of his properties and a mile radius thereof... /signed/ Sheriff of Nottingham County; /date/ on this date _________.

Now, as you know it's often better not to ask and be turned down, but if you're nervous about it this would probably fly, especially with an elected official. Maybe you can establish a relationship with him beforehand. Buy him flowers or something?

HTH.

No one can authorize anyone else to violate the law. :eek:
 

ixtow

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2006
Messages
5,038
Location
Suwannee County, FL
Probably. I didn't think about it that respect.

The only problem with looking at a certain angle to find legality, is that there are so many angles from which it can be seen contrary.

You can be certain that a government as corrupt as ours will never be looking for the legitimizing angle.

Homeless people are always camping, or on the way to or from such... Do you really expect that interpretation if homeless people decide to open carry?
 
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