• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

Suspiciously "matching the description"

sudden valley gunner

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
16,674
Location
Whatcom County
My guess making it up. It is one thing I feared, now they are getting educated that we are getting educated they need RAS, they are going to start trying to make up RAS as they go along. Supposedly the last time they ran me, I was involved in a hit and run, I checked the records there were no accident hit/run reports that day.
 

Lovenox

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2010
Messages
538
Location
Olympia
My guess making it up. It is one thing I feared, now they are getting educated that we are getting educated they need RAS, they are going to start trying to make up RAS as they go along. Supposedly the last time they ran me, I was involved in a hit and run, I checked the records there were no accident hit/run reports that day.

Arent those call (911) a mattter of public record? If they start making stuff up they could run up against a citizen armed with information and call them out on the carpet. Right?
 

amlevin

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2007
Messages
5,937
Location
North of Seattle, Washington, USA
Arent those call (911) a mattter of public record? If they start making stuff up they could run up against a citizen armed with information and call them out on the carpet. Right?

Some of the information is not routed through "911". For example, the description might have been the result of an interview after the officers arrived. THAT would not be on any tape. Some calls are originated by being flagged down where the officer may merely tell dispatch that he/she is out at a location.

Until officers are "wired for sound" and every word while on duty is recorded there is a lot that isn't part of any public record.
 

BigDave

Opt-Out Members
Joined
Nov 22, 2006
Messages
3,456
Location
Yakima, Washington, USA
Is Paranoia creeping into every scenario now? It seems so many encounters take this path of suspicion "there out to get me"

Officers were on a call before you even entered the area but you assume it is all about violating your rights or trying to locate a perpetrator?
You assume they are looking at your gun instead of your attire and description but took offense to a simple question, what happened to being good stewards in normalizing open carry. All this is doing is making it normal to have attitude thrown at them when they come in contact with someone who openly carries.

Can we say "copaphobia" see I can make words up too ! :monkey
 

Lovenox

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2010
Messages
538
Location
Olympia
Some of the information is not routed through "911". For example, the description might have been the result of an interview after the officers arrived. THAT would not be on any tape. Some calls are originated by being flagged down where the officer may merely tell dispatch that he/she is out at a location.

Until officers are "wired for sound" and every word while on duty is recorded there is a lot that isn't part of any public record.


Good to know. Thanks.
 

Lovenox

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2010
Messages
538
Location
Olympia
Is Paranoia creeping into every scenario now? It seems so many encounters take this path of suspicion "there out to get me"

Officers were on a call before you even entered the area but you assume it is all about violating your rights or trying to locate a perpetrator?
You assume they are looking at your gun instead of your attire and description but took offense to a simple question, what happened to being good stewards in normalizing open carry. All this is doing is making it normal to have attitude thrown at them when they come in contact with someone who openly carries.

Can we say "copaphobia" see I can make words up too ! :monkey


I know what you are saying, BigD. However, do you honestly believe that all LEOs are: one, educated and properly trained on OC. Two, "comfortable" with citizens OCing. As Goose has stated our members have had "run ins" with LEOs. I dont think one should be paranoid, but being defensive with a benign posture isnt a bad place to station ones self.
 

BigDave

Opt-Out Members
Joined
Nov 22, 2006
Messages
3,456
Location
Yakima, Washington, USA
When they stop harassing OC citizens, we'll stop calling them out on it. Why should his attire matter? OC doesn't have a dress code.

Citing:
Tom Brester Inceident
SVG's Incident
Kurby's Incident (This will be overturned)
SigFan's Incident *The one at the marina* (I've seen the video)

I can name a few more, but will digress

In a case where a crime has been committed and a description is made, attire does matter along with other descriptors, nothing was said about his gun according to his account, just his suspicion.

Kurby's Incident hopefully it will be over turned, and for the record I am not implying that some incidents officers are out of line, just not the majority or all of them attitudes and have become prevalent by some on the board.

SigFans Incident from what I have read, this is the normal routine if it was gun related or not. As to the video did you get popcorn with it :) I have been and will continue to be in the "Show Me" attitude when it comes to making an opinion on something, if he offers to show it great if not oh well.
Do note that once the video was shown things were straighten out, did the officers get that benefit at the encounter?
 

BigDave

Opt-Out Members
Joined
Nov 22, 2006
Messages
3,456
Location
Yakima, Washington, USA
Goose we are discussing the op post, in this thread, where did the officer/s attempt to violate his rights?
Officers do have a responsibility to respond to a crime and to gather what information they can and with in their purview as an officer and this may include stopping someone and asking them questions although it may not be clear to you why they are asking.

Does not one accept some responsibility in assisting Police in their work? Or have some taken the attitude of look the other way when a crime may have been committed and become a large part of the problem.
Do we not have a sense of community to look after our neighbors in the time of need?
As of now in this situation we are discussing, no one here knows all the facts available including the OP, what if that assault just occurred to a close neighbor and you had the information to help officers in finding the perp, do we just shun them and look at them in disgust, I do not think so.

As to Toms incident, Tom did real well and even though they were requiring more then allowed by law, Tom complied and addressed the issue later, which I feel be it publicized or not has and will make a difference, I remember reading on of the threads recently where Federal Way has adjusted their contact procedures.

Nobody said this Right we exercise was going to be easy but we all can succeed at it.
 

Deleted_User

Guest
Joined
Aug 30, 2010
Messages
807
Sigfan: I'd have done the SAME thing and ignore them with the past history of how "we" are treated. Otherwise, you'd be waiting a year for your gun back, again!
 
Last edited:

Fallschirjmäger

Active member
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
3,823
Location
Cumming, Georgia, USA
Police lie. That's just a statement of fact, there are no laws nor policies against it and I believe there is case law that the "police must be allowed to retain their arts and methods to do their jobs", or words to that effect.

If you did not call the police, and they are not there in response to you, then Officer Friendly is looking to arrest someone and there's no reason for him to think that someone isn't you. He's going to ask questions and see if he can get someone to admit guilt or culpability.

It's not bashing. No more than your Mom saying "I know you ate those cookies," even if she hasn't dusted for prints and was out of the house when those cookies mysteriously disappeared. Get over it and just smile, you know what the game is as well as they do.
 
Last edited:

BigDave

Opt-Out Members
Joined
Nov 22, 2006
Messages
3,456
Location
Yakima, Washington, USA
Police lie. That's just a statement of fact, there are no laws nor policies against it and I believe there is case law that the "police must be allowed to retain their arts and methods to do their jobs", or words to that effect.

If you did not call the police, and they are not there in response to you, then Officer Friendly is looking to arrest someone and there's no reason for him to think that someone isn't you. He's going to ask questions and see if he can get someone to admit guilt or culpability.

It's not bashing. No more than your Mom saying "I know you ate those cookies," even if she hasn't dusted for prints and was out of the house when those cookies mysteriously disappeared. Get over it and just smile, you know what the game is as well as they do.

So then you walk into your home and find a family member has been assaulted, does it make a difference then?

A better word for this is being "shortsighted" and we know even on this board people lie but not all do.
 
Last edited:

1245A Defender

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2009
Messages
4,365
Location
north mason county, Washington, USA
well,,,

So then you walk into your home and find a family member has been assaulted, does it make a difference then?

A better word for this is being "shortsighted" and we know even on this board people lie but not all do.

you are an unabashed, full time, unwavering, no matter what, lying COP apologist!

sigfan goes home to find cops standing around, for no good reason.
they describe his appearance as the suspect in a crime.
he continues on his lawful way, they dont investigate the alleged crime.
they leave!
seems to prove that they lied, in a fishing attempt, no more, no less!
 

Dave_pro2a

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 28, 2007
Messages
2,132
Location
, ,
As do Contractors, Accountants, Doctors, Lawyers, Politicians, Teachers, Mechanics, Real Estate Agents, News Reporters, and so on.

The only reason we all survive is that they don't ALL lie. Just those that represent a small portion of every segment of society.

I believe his point was that Police officers are allowed, and often trained, to lie in the performance of their job.

Iirc SCOTUS has ruled that deception on the part of police officers is perfectly ok. In the course of an 'investigation,' an officer can be a low down, lying, son of a bitch, right to you face... and it's totally legal. Not moral, not ethical, but legal.

Teachers: not allowed by policy, trained and encouraged to lie in the performance of their job
Doctors: not allowed by policy, trained and encouraged to lie in the performance of their job
Mechanics: not allowed by policy, trained and encouraged to lie in the performance of their job
Real estate agents: not allowed by policy, trained and encouraged to lie in the performance of their job
News reporters: not allowed by policy, trained and encouraged to lie in the performance of their job
Accountants: not allowed by policy, trained and encouraged to lie in the performance of their job

Politicians: Well, in theory... ;)
Lawyers: Well, in theory... ;)
 
Last edited:

BigDave

Opt-Out Members
Joined
Nov 22, 2006
Messages
3,456
Location
Yakima, Washington, USA
you are an unabashed, full time, unwavering, no matter what, lying COP apologist!

sigfan goes home to find cops standing around, for no good reason.
they describe his appearance as the suspect in a crime.
he continues on his lawful way, they dont investigate the alleged crime.
they leave!
seems to prove that they lied, in a fishing attempt, no more, no less!

ROFLOL, am I suppose to say ouch now! :lol: There is no doubt there are bad cops as there are bad people in general and those who lie in here as well but to group an entire group with all this cop bashing is BS as it would be if all of it went toward us for carrying firearms, which by the way we still see to often from all walks of life and professions.

It is not surprising that this thread as gone awry and trying to gather other incidents and issues to support this copaphobic attitudes displayed by some.
Are there some bad cops, of course as there is in any field, get the idea?
This incident I do not see it that cops were doing anymore or less then their job, he asked a question, so what, big deal.

  • "Do you live here?"
  • He took another extended look at my Steelers shirt and said "There was an assault on someone by a Steelers fan."

Does not seem out of line.
 
Top