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I wish I could design the perfect (for me) .380 sub compact

Goingdef

Regular Member
Joined
May 12, 2012
Messages
29
Location
Norfolk VA
I have shot the 84f and like it. I'm still considering it. It's just a little big. A little fat. Not tooo bad though.

it is a little wide I think if you found a thinner set of grips other then the wood ones it comes with( at least mine) it may help cut that down some, but you can't beat 13rnd mags in that small of a package.
 

twoskinsonemanns

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 12, 2012
Messages
2,326
Location
WV
it is a little wide I think if you found a thinner set of grips other then the wood ones it comes with( at least mine) it may help cut that down some, but you can't beat 13rnd mags in that small of a package.

Oh the additional rounds are a great plus also the real problem. If it wasn't for the double stack mag it might be perfect.
To be honest I've never given to much weight to the amount of rounds for a carry gun. I try to read every instance of successful self defense I can find and by far the majority, in my recollecting impressions, one or two shots were all that were fired. A tiny few were up to 5. I don't think I've ever read one where the victim/self defender had to reload.
 

ship4brains

New member
Joined
Jun 13, 2012
Messages
3
Location
Kansas
I have the .380 CC model bought around 1 year ago brand new, and I have a rather extreme love hate .


I have one also. I've put about 500 rounds of cheap FMJ and 100 JHP through it with no failures of any kind. I also fired a full box of Critical Defense through it. No problems. Guess I'm fortunate.
 

berettabone

Banned
Joined
Jun 11, 2012
Messages
57
Location
West Allis
Don't be surprised by that last part - it's called tucking tail.

On a civilized note, it's actually funny that this conversation came up. My new-to-carry uncle just went through a similar search. He was convinced that he needed some sort of external hammer, small caliber,da/sa mess. He already owns and carries (with the safety off) a Walther ppk. Then he went out and bought a frame-cracking tomcat before doing his research.

If you go up in caliber, there are plenty of options. If you settle for a safer, more modern action, there are plenty of options. What is it about the .380 that some people love so much?

It's a firearm that you can have complete control over, and not a hard recoil, and you can put follow up shots right where you need them....and.....cheap Winchester WB...955fps...190flbs......17 in. pen. in 10% gel...51% first shot stoppage. Only bad thing, .380 ammo is pricing itself out of the market....
 

twoskinsonemanns

Regular Member
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Apr 12, 2012
Messages
2,326
Location
WV
I've been pondering for a long time now about the SA/DA issue as it applies to drawing to fire. Does anyone train to draw and cock the hammer of a SA/DA pistol in the one-in-the-chamber, safety off pull and shoot condition?

I was just thinking, the 1911 (and other) crowd talk about pulling and flipping the safety as one motion. Does anyone pull and cock in one motion?
 

Michigander

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2007
Messages
4,818
Location
Mulligan's Valley
Does anyone pull and cock in one motion?

The biggest reason not to practice this way for self defense shooting is retention. That'll leave you with 2 or 3 fingers, depending on the gun, loosely gripping your frame while you cock the hammer.

Or if you're going for a 2 handed grip at the time of cocking the hammer, that'll leave you with your thumb in the way of the slide, either causing you to shoot hastily and injure your thumb, or wait till you have a proper grip to fire. Meanwhile you could have already had a shot off.

And what if you're still pointing at your leg as you're drawing, being in the process of cocking the hammer but not having totally cleared your holster, and then you end up fighting to retain your gun from a grab? Will your trigger finger not get involved and potentially grab the trigger and pull a Tex Grebner? I do believe it could happen, and that's why I don't practice this way with my Sig, nor do I suggest you do.

1911's and other guns with thumb safeties are set up so that you can grip the gun convulsively, as you would in a fight, as you deactivate the safety. There is a reason that they're by where your thumb naturally grips, and not on the back of the slide.
 
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hogeaterf6

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2010
Messages
381
Location
, ,
Wow, I love my Bersa's! My 1st was a Thunder + 380. Holds 15 rnds. Its a awesome very accurate gun. Never had any FTF or anything. Carried it a few yrs then bought the Sub compact 40 cal. Love it! Not as accurate as the thunder but great gun. Also no failures. Never had to alter or polish anything on them. Have not been on bersachat in awhile but dont recall alot of problems.
 

j4l

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2011
Messages
1,835
Location
fl
The biggest reason not to practice this way for self defense shooting is retention. That'll leave you with 2 or 3 fingers, depending on the gun, loosely gripping your frame while you cock the hammer.

Or if you're going for a 2 handed grip at the time of cocking the hammer, that'll leave you with your thumb in the way of the slide, either causing you to shoot hastily and injure your thumb, or wait till you have a proper grip to fire. Meanwhile you could have already had a shot off.

And what if you're still pointing at your leg as you're drawing, being in the process of cocking the hammer but not having totally cleared your holster, and then you end up fighting to retain your gun from a grab? Will your trigger finger not get involved and potentially grab the trigger and pull a Tex Grebner? I do believe it could happen, and that's why I don't practice this way with my Sig, nor do I suggest you do.

1911's and other guns with thumb safeties are set up so that you can grip the gun convulsively, as you would in a fight, as you deactivate the safety. There is a reason that they're by where your thumb naturally grips, and not on the back of the slide.


Awful lot of assumptions there... let me add one more to them: If you are close enough to your foe for the possibility of a "grab" while you are trying to draw and fire, you're already neck-deep in the doo-doo, and should be working out some method of putting some kind of distance between you and the enemy-even if just arm's -length, for a moment.

As to thumbing hammer while drawing, in general, it can be mastered with practice, like anything else. As can the DA/SA transition of trigger pulls. Accuracy at the point-blank ranges of your scenarios above isnt likely to be much of an issue-One should hope. If you cant reasonably accurately put 1-2 rounds into someone at arm's-length or less, you should probably consider sticking to knives, or hand-to-hand.

As to the DA/SA transition, believe me, when the time comes, and the adreniline is pumping- you wont be having the touch-sensitivity or manual dexterity, usually, to notice the difference. Fine motor skills just arent as fine , under duress, as they are at the local range poking holes in paper.

Come to think of it- 1st chance I get when back home/ time and weather permitting, I'll try to make and post a vid demonstrating, draw/DA 1st round- SA second round(with a .45) . It's really not that difficult to do well, and with reasonable accuracy, if you include such a drill into your training routines.
 
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Michigander

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2007
Messages
4,818
Location
Mulligan's Valley
Awful lot of assumptions there... let me add one more to them: If you are close enough to your foe for the possibility of a "grab" while you are trying to draw and fire, you're already neck-deep in the doo-doo, and should be working out some method of putting some kind of distance between you and the enemy-even if just arm's -length, for a moment.

I do believe we're in agreement on everything but this.

Distance from assailants is always desirable. Think miles. The problem is that it isn't always available, for one reason or another. When this happens, and unfortunately it happens frequently, assuming that you're not foolishly turning your back without the ability to run faster than the assailant and make it to minimum safe distance from weapons, you'll need your drawing hand to draw and bring the gun back to a far back hip shooting position, while the other arm if needed can deflect the assailant or perhaps do strikes.

In the event of a powerful grab attempt, techniques such as a kick to the knee and a 2 handed retention grip such as the CAR system uses come in handy.
 
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