OCTA(orange county transportation authority)

realityfatality · Mar 24, 2011

Took a bus ride down to newport beach from my house with my best friend while he open carried a model 21 glock and I open carried a ka-bar. Had no issue getting out there, but when we tried to get home we had some problems, the bus driver back home to central OC where I am from all of the sudden said we couldn't enter the bus unless we disarmed ourselfs, we loked at the driver puzzled and asked him to elaborate, he said he had just got off the phone with corprate (I didn't even see him on the phone..) and that they had said NO weapons were allowed on the bus, even tho me and my friend have been carrying on the bus since last year and it wasn't posted anywhere He told us to conceal our weapons so other people on the bus wouldn't see them, so we under duress followed as he asked and put them in my backpack, we had no ride back from the beach and would've been stuck for who knows how long. Anyway, overall crappy expirience.

Does anyone know if OTCA has such a policy?

ConditionThree · Mar 24, 2011

realityfatality said:
Took a bus ride down to newport beach from my house with my best friend while he open carried a model 21 glock and I open carried a ka-bar. Had no issue getting out there, but when we tried to get home we had some problems, the bus driver back home to central OC where I am from all of the sudden said we couldn't enter the bus unless we disarmed ourselfs, we loked at the driver puzzled and asked him to elaborate, he said he had just got off the phone with corprate (I didn't even see him on the phone..) and that they had said NO weapons were allowed on the bus, even tho me and my friend have been carrying on the bus since last year and it wasn't posted anywhere He told us to conceal our weapons so other people on the bus wouldn't see them, so we under duress followed as he asked and put them in my backpack, we had no ride back from the beach and would've been stuck for who knows how long. Anyway, overall crappy expirience.

Does anyone know if OTCA has such a policy?

Unless the person with the Glock had a license to carry concealed or the bag was a fully enclosed locked container, you commited a misdemeanor. The bus driver should have been advised that concealing without a license or some other exemption to 12025 is illegal and STILL violates what they claim is OTCA policy.

I'm not going to even bother advising you to delete your confession, since you have been carrying since last year and have had plenty of opportunity to both study and follow the law.

realityfatality · Mar 24, 2011

ConditionThree said:
Unless the person with the Glock had a license to carry concealed or the bag was a fully enclosed locked container, you commited a misdemeanor. The bus driver should have been advised that concealing without a license or some other exemption to 12025 is illegal and STILL violates what they claim is OTCA policy.

I'm not going to even bother advising you to delete your confession, since you have been carrying since last year and have had plenty of opportunity to both study and follow the law.

That's exactly what I'm mad about! They forced me and my friend to break the law or we would have been stranded away from home. I even informed the bus driver they were forcing me and my friend to break the law and he said basically, he didn't care, if we wanted to get on the bus we had to do it. Then my friend informed him he would be doing it under duress and proceeded with no other choice.

Fyi: person with the glock has applyed for ccw, but nada.

moonbootmatt · Mar 24, 2011

You found a bus route that doesn't pass through any GFSZ??

Assuming that's even true, what if the driver decided to take a different route because of construction, accident, etc?

ConsideringOC · Mar 24, 2011

dont know if it was posted... but remember the new law 171.7 pc

realityfatality · Mar 24, 2011

moonbootmatt said:
You found a bus route that doesn't pass through any GFSZ??

Assuming that's even true, what if the driver decided to take a different route because of construction, accident, etc?

Just so everyone knows, the bag we put it in was a hiking style backpack with a key padlock, keeping the firearm from being immediately retrieved by anyone. But the bus driver had no idea of that, and had no way of knowing. The bus route didn't change either. And I was 99.9 percent sure the route didn't violate the school zone restrictions.

hgreen · Mar 24, 2011

ConsideringOC said:
dont know if it was posted... but remember the new law 171.7 pc

A bus is not a "sterile area" with "a posted sign that provides reasonable notice."

Of course "reasonable notice" is what the judge says it is.

ryanburbridge · Mar 24, 2011

realityfatality said:
Just so everyone knows, the bag we put it in was a hiking style backpack with a key padlock, keeping the firearm from being immediately retrieved by anyone. But the bus driver had no idea of that, and had no way of knowing. The bus route didn't change either. And I was 99.9 percent sure the route didn't violate the school zone restrictions.

99.9%?!!!

It should be more like 110%!!!!

Risking alot IMO.

Sometimes questions should be asked with less detail. ie. Dose anyone know the policy on something? No need to admit to some things.

"If squirt guns are outlawed, only outlaw squirts will have guns!"

James Taranto

realityfatality · Mar 24, 2011

ryanburbridge said:
99.9%?!!!

It should be more like 110%!!!!

Risking alot IMO.

Sometimes questions should be asked with less detail. ie. Dose anyone know the policy on something? No need to admit to some things.

"If squirt guns are outlawed, only outlaw squirts will have guns!"

James Taranto

I'm not worried about it, I stated it was under duress already, I told that to the bus driver too. And I'll tell it to anyone else that asks me about it.

ryanburbridge · Mar 24, 2011

realityfatality said:
I'm not worried about it, I stated it was under duress already, I told that to the bus driver too. And I'll tell it to anyone else that asks me about it.

I'm not sure if saying you broke the law because you were under duress works in court.

Did you get the conversation on your audio/video recording device?

"If squirt guns are outlawed, only outlaw squirts will have guns!"

James Taranto

realityfatality · Mar 24, 2011

ryanburbridge said:
I'm not sure if saying you broke the law because you were under duress works in court.

Did you get the conversation on your audio/video recording device?

"If squirt guns are outlawed, only outlaw squirts will have guns!"

James Taranto

As a defense, a defendant is arguing that he or she should not be held liable because, even though the act broke the law, it was only performed because of extreme unlawful pressure. [2] In criminal law, a duress defense is similar to a plea of guilty, admitting partial culpability, so that if the defense is not accepted than the criminal act is admitted.

My friend probably still has the audio, but I won't be talking to him again till next week. No video.

Lawful Aim · Mar 25, 2011

Misdemeanors like this one need to be witnessed first hand by a law enforcement officer in order for one to be subject to it.

1245A Defender · Mar 25, 2011

well,,,,

ConditionThree said:
Unless the person with the Glock had a license to carry concealed or the bag was a fully enclosed locked container, you commited a misdemeanor. The bus driver should have been advised that concealing without a license or some other exemption to 12025 is illegal and STILL violates what they claim is OTCA policy.

realityfatality said:

Just so everyone knows, the bag we put it in was a hiking style backpack with a key padlock, keeping the firearm from being immediately retrieved by anyone. But the bus driver had no idea of that, and had no way of knowing. The bus route didn't change either. And I was 99.9 percent sure the route didn't violate the school zone restrictions.

Click to expand...

a locked back pack is not a concealed gun!
that method of transport is the correct way to transport an unloaded
handgun in a gfsz and most other places, Legally!!
no law was broken,
only sadness...

ryanburbridge · Mar 25, 2011

Lawful Aim said:
Misdemeanors like this one need to be witnessed first hand by a law enforcement officer in order for one to be subject to it.

Please site!

I am not in disagreement just would like to know where you find this.

Is that because it's a misdemeanor?

"If squirt guns are outlawed, only outlaw squirts will have guns!"

James Taranto

Decoligny · Mar 25, 2011

ConditionThree said:
Unless the person with the Glock had a license to carry concealed or the bag was a fully enclosed locked container, you commited a misdemeanor. The bus driver should have been advised that concealing without a license or some other exemption to 12025 is illegal and STILL violates what they claim is OTCA policy.

I'm not going to even bother advising you to delete your confession, since you have been carrying since last year and have had plenty of opportunity to both study and follow the law.

Misdemeanor for the concealed handgun, possible Felony for the concealed K-Bar.

realityfatality · Mar 25, 2011

Decoligny said:
Misdemeanor for the concealed handgun, possible Felony for the concealed K-Bar.

I had a rawhide bone inside the backpack I purchased near the beach for my german shepherd. I might as well say that was my caveman club and get a felony for blunt force instrument too, right? Lol.

Lawful Aim · Mar 26, 2011

It is because it is a certain type of misdemeanor. I haven't located a cite but I did come across this post on glocktalk by member, ateamer;
"In CA, generally can't arrest for a misdemeanor not committed in our presence. We can only make a misdo arrest on PC for: Misdemeanor domestic violence battery, juvenile offenses, violation of a domestic violence restraining order and for DUI at the scene of a crash. We can accept a citizen's arrest for a misdo that occurred in the citizen's presence, but if we determine that there was not probable cause for the arrest, we can refuse to accept the arrest." http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1266662

ryanburbridge said:
Please site!

I am not in disagreement just would like to know where you find this.

Is that because it's a misdemeanor?

Decoligny · Mar 26, 2011

realityfatality said:
I'm not worried about it, I stated it was under duress already, I told that to the bus driver too. And I'll tell it to anyone else that asks me about it.

Sorry, but duress is something like "Do it or I'll shoot you in the knee!", not "Do it or I won't give you a ride home!"

Decoligny · Mar 26, 2011

realityfatality said:
I had a rawhide bone inside the backpack I purchased near the beach for my german shepherd. I might as well say that was my caveman club and get a felony for blunt force instrument too, right? Lol.

A rawhide bone can "sometimes" be a billy under 12020.
A K-Bar fixed blade knife is ALWAYS a dirk or dagger under 12020, and when carried comcealed it is always a crime, USUALLY a felony.

I suggest you put a few more years under your belt before risking your carry right for the rest of your life based on a high school freshman's understanding of CA Penal Code. A 16 year old doesn't have the experience base to make sound judgement, at least from your attitude this particlular 16 year old doesn't.

realityfatality · Mar 26, 2011

Decoligny said:
A rawhide bone can "sometimes" be a billy under 12020.
A K-Bar fixed blade knife is ALWAYS a dirk or dagger under 12020, and when carried comcealed it is always a crime, USUALLY a felony.

I suggest you put a few more years under your belt before risking your carry right for the rest of your life based on a high school freshman's understanding of CA Penal Code. A 16 year old doesn't have the experience base to make sound judgement, at least from your attitude this particlular 16 year old doesn't.

I like how you said from my "judgement", Sir I think you have confused this forum with the "true tales of self defense" forum. I never asked anyone what I did wrong because I knew what I did from the very beginning, and had practicularlally no choice (under duress mentioned many times) Maybe you should read the entire post and maybe try answering the question at hand before donating your $0.02 to somebody that read and understands the penal codes the same as you do. For your information, duress means extreme unlawful pressure. Also instead of being billy bad ass and throwing age around like you've expirienced the walk of life, maybe you should go read the meaning of duress, and undue influence too. Duress is no more limited to violence than free speach to a quill pen. I'm curious who the "freshman" remarks are too, I've been in junior college since last year. Graduated early.

Thanks.

In jurisprudence, duress or coercion refers to a situation whereby a person performs an act as a result of violence, threat or other pressure against the person. Black's Law Dictionary (6th ed.) defines duress as "any unlawful threat or coercion used... to induce another to act [or not act] in a manner [they] otherwise would not [or would]". Duress is pressure exerted upon a person to coerce that person to perform an act that he or she ordinarily would not perform. The notion of duress must be distinguished both from undue influence in the civil law and from necessity.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duress

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