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**patriot act rejected**

Tomas

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2010
Messages
702
Location
University Place, Washington, USA
Possibly, just possibly, one of the Political Action groups I'm involved with and the many letters and phone calls to our legislators about this helped in letting it expire as it should.

We are still pushing on this, since undoubtedly there will be some who will keep pushing on the other side too, and keep trying to reduce our rights and freedoms.
 

44Brent

Regular Member
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
772
Location
Olympia, WA
Jaime Herrera Beutler likes the police state

Unfortunately the "un" Patriot Act is not dead. Although the House was short a few votes of a 2/3 majority needed to fast track the abomination, there are plenty of votes to pass it with a simple majority.

My congresswoman Jaime Herrera Beutler voted for bill. I made the mistake of voting for her in the primary and general elections. She failed her first big test, so I will not vote for her in 2012.
 

sudden valley gunner

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
16,674
Location
Whatcom County
Isn't DHS (Department of Homeland Security) part of the patriot act? Would this mean they would be gone too? (hoping fingers crossed, and probably getting tagged and monitored for speaking my mind on a public forum about it).
 

skiingislife725

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 26, 2009
Messages
400
Location
Lake Stevens, WA
Yah like Brent44 said, H.R. 514 is definitely NOT dead. They just passed House Resol 79 yesterday allowing for another vote on it, this time only requiring a simple majority. Meaning it'll almost definitely pass because we keep voting in D's and R's and expect them to deliver different results. I'd say our legislature sucks but we did vote them in after all.

H Res 79 voted on yesterday, Feb 10: http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2011/roll029.xml
 
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Kryteon

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2009
Messages
78
Location
Gig Harbor, Washington, USA
Not so sure I'm happy about it

"The Patriot Act bill would have renewed the authority for court-approved roving wiretaps that permit surveillance on multiple phones. Also addressed was Section 215, the so-called library records provision that gives the FBI court-approved access to “any tangible thing’’ relevant to a terrorism investigation.

The third deals with the “lone-wolf’’ provision of a 2004 anti-terror law that permits secret intelligence surveillance of non-U.S. people not known to be affiliated with a specific terrorist organization."

I guess if another attack happens, and these measures could have prevented it, those of us who wanted these "authorities" removed, are partially responsible (and to blame) for what happens because of it.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Kryteon
 

HandyHamlet

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2010
Messages
2,772
Location
Terra, Sol
I guess if another attack happens, and these measures could have prevented it, those of us who wanted these "authorities" removed, are partially responsible (and to blame) for what happens because of it.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Kryteon

If I don't do my job right I get fired and they bring in someone who can.

They don't keep me on, pat me on the head, and then introduce me to the new guys in the new dept they created to cover my ineptitude.
 

sudden valley gunner

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
16,674
Location
Whatcom County
"The Patriot Act bill would have renewed the authority for court-approved roving wiretaps that permit surveillance on multiple phones. Also addressed was Section 215, the so-called library records provision that gives the FBI court-approved access to “any tangible thing’’ relevant to a terrorism investigation.

The third deals with the “lone-wolf’’ provision of a 2004 anti-terror law that permits secret intelligence surveillance of non-U.S. people not known to be affiliated with a specific terrorist organization."

I guess if another attack happens, and these measures could have prevented it, those of us who wanted these "authorities" removed, are partially responsible (and to blame) for what happens because of it.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Kryteon

What other inalienable rights are you willing to give up for safety?
 
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BigIrish

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2010
Messages
76
Location
edmonds, wa, ,
some what understandable......

"The Patriot Act bill would have renewed the authority for court-approved roving wiretaps that permit surveillance on multiple phones. Also addressed was Section 215, the so-called library records provision that gives the FBI court-approved access to “any tangible thing’’ relevant to a terrorism investigation.

The third deals with the “lone-wolf’’ provision of a 2004 anti-terror law that permits secret intelligence surveillance of non-U.S. people not known to be affiliated with a specific terrorist organization."

I guess if another attack happens, and these measures could have prevented it, those of us who wanted these "authorities" removed, are partially responsible (and to blame) for what happens because of it.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong.


Kryteon

Are you in the service? I get it for a military members stand piont. From a ordinary person, they are an infringment of my civil liberties! It sounds horrible but its what makes us strong! Besides the attack on 9/11 was either completely an inside job.....or........the only thing the Patriot ACT does is TAKE! It doesn't give me any security...my 12ga. Does....it doesn't do anything but take. Are you saying that this has kept America more safe? Nope....ok then what about the cristmas day "underwere bomber" help from our gov. The x-mas tree bomber in Portland. The fbi self incriminated themselfs stating that the entraped him.....the young kid in N.C. same thing!....just saying bro..... wake up

P.S. sorry for typos and miss spells....on my phone....and a little angry....I'm over it....
 

skiingislife725

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 26, 2009
Messages
400
Location
Lake Stevens, WA
Speaking of good quotes....

"[On ancient Athens]: In the end, more than freedom, they wanted security. They wanted a comfortable life, and they lost it all – security, comfort, and freedom. When the Athenians finally wanted not to give to society but for society to give to them, when the freedom they wished for most was freedom from responsibility, then Athens ceased to be free and was never free again. "
— Edward Gibbon
 

Kryteon

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2009
Messages
78
Location
Gig Harbor, Washington, USA
Are you in the service? I get it for a military members stand piont. From a ordinary person, they are an infringment of my civil liberties! It sounds horrible but its what makes us strong! Besides the attack on 9/11 was either completely an inside job.....or........the only thing the Patriot ACT does is TAKE! It doesn't give me any security...my 12ga. Does....it doesn't do anything but take. Are you saying that this has kept America more safe? Nope....ok then what about the cristmas day "underwere bomber" help from our gov. The x-mas tree bomber in Portland. The fbi self incriminated themselfs stating that the entraped him.....the young kid in N.C. same thing!....just saying bro..... wake up

P.S. sorry for typos and miss spells....on my phone....and a little angry....I'm over it....

I did my time in the Army. 8th Infantry 1972-1975 to be exact.

I understand the natural tendency to oppose the Patriot Act. I would ask three things:

1. What exactly has changed in your everyday life because of the Patriot Act?
2. Are you willing to personally except the consequences for its repeal?
3. How would you protect the counrty from radical Islamic or other terrorists?

It's fun to ponder things intellectually. But in the real world it means nothing when the metal meets the meat.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Kryteon
 

Gilead_Gunslinger

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 5, 2008
Messages
80
Location
mid-world (somewhere between tacoma and seattle)
I understand the natural tendency to oppose the Patriot Act. I would ask three things:

1. What exactly has changed in your everyday life because of the Patriot Act?
2. Are you willing to personally except the consequences for its repeal?
3. How would you protect the counrty from radical Islamic or other terrorists?


1. not much... but I feel better about habeous corpus (sp?) right at the moment...
2.yes...
3. if I came across anyone, not just a radical islamic, in the process of commiting a terrorist act, I would do whatever was in my power to stop it... wouldn't you?
 

Kryteon

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2009
Messages
78
Location
Gig Harbor, Washington, USA
I understand the natural tendency to oppose the Patriot Act. I would ask three things:

1. What exactly has changed in your everyday life because of the Patriot Act?
2. Are you willing to personally except the consequences for its repeal?
3. How would you protect the counrty from radical Islamic or other terrorists?


1. not much... but I feel better about habeous corpus (sp?) right at the moment...
2.yes...
3. if I came across anyone, not just a radical islamic, in the process of commiting a terrorist act, I would do whatever was in my power to stop it... wouldn't you?

I think there's a lot of misunderstanding on what the Patriot Act can and cannot do, the safeguards in place to protect individual rights, and what it has done to guard the U.S.

http://www.askheritage.org/what-are-the-facts-on-the-patriot-act/

Some of these misunderstandings are niave, (no offense intended), and maybe even dangerous.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Kryteon
 

BigIrish

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2010
Messages
76
Location
edmonds, wa, ,
My opinion is....

1: you mentioned "roving wire taps" that is (just by the numbers) is one area it has effected my life. I'd like to add that I know this implies so much in as " well why would you care, if you have nothing to hide" I dont, and intend to keep it that way. Its not the point of hiding anything. It is that I feel this is any example you can see and touch of how Gov. Encroches on your life. I will list examles if needed?

2: am I willing to accept responsability? Yes I am. I feel an obligation to do so. I also feel the same about big government taking away civil protectors like Habeous Corpus. (Wich was not set to "sunset" yet...I.e. still by by..)

3: first. Its not just islamic extreamists......load of poo.....secondly I would help to pass legislation barring extremist from entering the U.S. entirerly. And the people that are know to be "homegrown" i'd alreadry have recived promission from a Judge to survielle them. Do some reserch on these "terror plots" that the F.B.I. thworted....by entrapment ( self omitted ) or why eyewitness's to the "undewhere bomber" have come forth to testify that they witnessed a State Dartment Official ushering this bomber threw security!!!!!!.... these witnesses are lawers...they understand the ramifications of lying under oath and perjuring a police statment ect... or how the Portland Or. X-mas tree bomber was supplied the bomb and detination device....the F.B.I. statment stated that exactly.....sure it shows intent. But why then did they mold this YOUNG man into an extreamist and supply him with an F.B.I. mentor?? Who taught him how to make bombs!!!...you have got to be kidding me right??

So where is your leg to stand on now? Don't get me wrong....I like pirates

And I hope that you know that this only comes from a well intentiond place. We are all gentelmen here. So pleas don't take any of this personal either.
 
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BigIrish

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2010
Messages
76
Location
edmonds, wa, ,
That is one persons opinion.

I think there's a lot of misunderstanding on what the Patriot Act can and cannot do, the safeguards in place to protect individual rights, and what it has done to guard the U.S.

http://www.askheritage.org/what-are-the-facts-on-the-patriot-act/

Some of these misunderstandings are niave, (no offense intended), and maybe even dangerous.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Kryteon

Ask who the writer works for?
Who funds the webpage?
What are they're politicol veiws?
Ask who does over sight on the that court?
What are they're politicol motives?
Whats they're track record?
Ect....ect....

And when did big government get in the habit of telling the truth
 
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