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Malls tracking shopper's cell phones?

j4l

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2011
Messages
1,835
Location
fl
For those out there with fantasies of government "big brotherisms" , here's a far more-likely item for you...

NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- Attention holiday shoppers: your cell phone may be tracked this year.

Starting on Black Friday and running through New Year's Day, two U.S. malls -- Promenade Temecula in southern California and Short Pump Town Center in Richmond, Va. -- will track guests' movements by monitoring the signals from their cell phones.

3210121Print CommentWhile the data that's collected is anonymous, it can follow shoppers' paths from store to store.

The goal is for stores to answer questions like: How many Nordstrom shoppers also stop at Starbucks? How long do most customers linger in Victoria's Secret? Are there unpopular spots in the mall that aren't being visited?

While U.S. malls have long tracked how crowds move throughout their stores, this is the first time they've used cell phones.

But obtaining that information comes with privacy concerns.

The management company of both malls, Forest City Commercial Management, says personal data is not being tracked.

"We won't be looking at singular shoppers," said Stephanie Shriver-Engdahl, vice president of digital strategy for Forest City. "The system monitors patterns of movement. We can see, like migrating birds, where people are going to."

Still, the company is preemptively notifying customers by hanging small signs around the shopping centers. Consumers can opt out by turning off their phones.

0:00 / 1:45 Avoid costly mistakes on Black Friday
The tracking system, called FootPath Technology, works through a series of antennas positioned throughout the shopping center that capture the unique identification number assigned to each phone (similar to a computer's IP address), and tracks its movement throughout the stores.

The system can't take photos or collect data on what shoppers have purchased. And it doesn't collect any personal details associated with the ID, like the user's name or phone number. That information is fiercely protected by mobile carriers, and often can be legally obtained only through a court order.

"We don't need to know who it is and we don't need to know anyone's cell phone number, nor do we want that," Shriver-Engdahl said.

Manufactured by a British company, Path Intelligence, this technology has already been used in shopping centers in Europe and Australia. And according to Path Intelligence CEO Sharon Biggar, hardly any shoppers decide to opt out.

"It's just not invasive of privacy," she said. "There are no risks to privacy, so I don't see why anyone would opt out."

Now, U.S. retailers including JCPenney (JCP, Fortune 500) and Home Depot (HD, Fortune 500) are also working with Path Intelligence to use their technology, Biggar said.

Home Depot has considered implementing the technology but is not currently using it any stores, a company spokesman said. JCPenney declined to comment on its relationship with the vendor.

Why Apple and Google need to stalk you
Some retail analysts say the new technology is nothing to be worried about. Malls have been tracking shoppers for years through people counters, security cameras, heat maps and even undercover researchers who follow shoppers around.

And some even say websites that track online shoppers are more invasive, recording not only a user's name and purchases, but then targeting them with ads even after they've left a site.

"It's important for shoppers to realize this sort of data is being collected anyway," Biggar said.

Whereas a website can track a customer who doesn't make a purchase, physical stores have been struggling to perfect this kind of research, Biggar said. By combining the data from FootPath with their own sales figures, stores will have better measurements to help them improve the shopping experience.

"We can now say, you had 100 people come to this product, but no one purchased it," Biggar said. "From there, we can help a retailer narrow down what's going wrong."

0:00 / 1:58 Black Friday survival guide
But some industry analysts worry about the broader implications of this kind of technology.

"Most of this information is harmless and nobody ever does anything nefarious with it," said Sucharita Mulpuru, retail analyst at Forrester Research. "But the reality is, what happens when you start having hackers potentially having access to this information and being able to track your movements?"

Last year, hackers hit AT&T, exposing the unique ID numbers and e-mail addresses of more than 100,000 iPad 3G owners. To make it harder for hackers to get at this information, Path Intelligence scrambles those numbers twice.

"I'm sure as more people get more cell phones, it's probably inevitable that it will continue as a resource," Mulpuru said. "But I think the future is going to have to be opt in, not opt out."
 

golddigger14s

Activist Member
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Apr 27, 2010
Messages
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Location
Lawton, OK USA
Almost all malls prohibit guns, so since my wallet is attached to my holster I won't be in any mall. They can track all the sheep they want.
 

Jack House

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Jun 12, 2010
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I80, USA
"It's important to know this data is already being recorded anyway"

Just because something is already happening doesn't make it right.

Posted using my HTC Evo
 

09jisaac

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2011
Messages
1,692
Location
Louisa, Kentucky
Almost all malls prohibit guns, so since my wallet is attached to my holster I won't be in any mall. They can track all the sheep they want.

I would like to have a wallet literally attached to my holster. But it wouldn't do me any good right now though. I am down here in TN, where you have to have a permit to carry..... But I am going back to KY tomorrow.

They want you to get used to all these acts. They ease you into it slowly. Most people wouldn't mind if I took one dollar from 'em everyday, but they would be outraged if I took 365 once every year. Because you can slowly take anything away from most americans.
 
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since9

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jan 14, 2010
Messages
6,964
Location
Colorado Springs, Colorado, USA
I would like to have a wallet literally attached to my holster.

I carry my firearm on my right. I carry my wallet on my right. To sales people who notice I'm carrying and are nervous, I would much rather allay their fears by reaching well around to my back pocket and paying the bill than reaching towards my holstered firearm.

They appreciate that! HALF of our existence involves expanding public appeal. That will never happen with an "IN YOUR FACE!!!" approach.

OC for sure. If you're the resident right-wing nutcase barking left and right, you're not helping the overall OC/CC/WC (whatever carry) cause. That's human sociology 101.
 

Daylen

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 29, 2010
Messages
2,223
Location
America
Not sure what is the big deal. Its conducted on private property and it is passive monitoring of signal location. If they broke the encryption on the signal then there would be a problem (criminal eavesdropping most likely), but as it is this is not so bad. If you don't like it turn off your phone.
 

Kirbinator

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2010
Messages
903
Location
Middle of the map, Alabama
Cell phones periodically send their unique identifier (IMEI) to the tower. All they have to do is listen for that at different ends of the mall. No black magic. Your phone announces it's presence to the network all the time.
 
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Dreamer

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2009
Messages
5,360
Location
Grennsboro NC
Not true.

Actually it is. A solid majority of malls (over 60%) prohibit weapons of any kind by policy, and in some states that have de-facto carry bans (through administrative difficulty or outright impossibility of obtaining permits, like NY, MD, NJ, and HI) ALL the malls prohibit carry because carry simply isn't legal--except to a privileged, anointed few...

The majority of malls in the US are owned by one of about 5 companies, three of which are owned by foreign concerns. Two of those are British, and one is French, and ALL are owned by notorious, Globalist, gun-grabbing neo-feudalists...

It IS, in fact true, that "most malls prohibit carry".
 

Daylen

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 29, 2010
Messages
2,223
Location
America
Actually it is. A solid majority of malls (over 60%) prohibit weapons of any kind by policy, and in some states that have de-facto carry bans (through administrative difficulty or outright impossibility of obtaining permits, like NY, MD, NJ, and HI) ALL the malls prohibit carry because carry simply isn't legal--except to a privileged, anointed few...

The majority of malls in the US are owned by one of about 5 companies, three of which are owned by foreign concerns. Two of those are British, and one is French, and ALL are owned by notorious, Globalist, gun-grabbing neo-feudalists...

It IS, in fact true, that "most malls prohibit carry".

60% is not almost all. Your new statement is too ambiguous to bother with.
 

09jisaac

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2011
Messages
1,692
Location
Louisa, Kentucky
I carry my firearm on my right. I carry my wallet on my right. To sales people who notice I'm carrying and are nervous, I would much rather allay their fears by reaching well around to my back pocket and paying the bill than reaching towards my holstered firearm.

They appreciate that! HALF of our existence involves expanding public appeal. That will never happen with an "IN YOUR FACE!!!" approach.

OC for sure. If you're the resident right-wing nutcase barking left and right, you're not helping the overall OC/CC/WC (whatever carry) cause. That's human sociology 101.


Yea, naturally you can't just have a wallet attached to your holster with a chain or something. It has to be right there, so you have to grab your gun to get to your wallet. Maybe connect it to my gun even, just skip the middle man. Have it tethered to the muzzle or something.

Because you have to be a right-wing nutcase that is always in someone's face to make a point.

You don't have to comment everytime someone say something that you don't fully understand.
 
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