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Arrested as a result of Open Carry

Fallschirjmäger

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3,823
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Cumming, Georgia, USA
This incident began last year.

An Alabamian attending college in Georgia was sitting at a McDonald's enjoying their fine dining cuisine with his wife and children when he was approached by two officers of the Columbus Police Department. Officers Baldwin and Mills demanded to know if Stubbs had a license to carry a firearm. Stubbs affirmed to the officers that not only did he possess a license but was also exempt from being required to possess one by virtue of OCGA 16-11-130 (the same section of Georgia law that permits law enforcement officers to carry firearms). Stubbs declined to produce his license as no suspicion of illegal conduct was made.
The officers then met with McDonald's employees and came back to say that McDonald's wished for Stubbs to leave the premises. When Stubbs began to gather up his wife, children and belongings the officers informed him it was too late for that and arrested him for criminal trespass.

Stubbs retained Georgia lawyer John R. Monroe who filed this complaint under 42 U.S.C. § 1983.
 

davidmcbeth

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Jan 14, 2012
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earth's crust
sounds like the question is NOT a question of carry but one of trespass. You cannot dilly dally ...

If told someone to leave your land, how quick would you want them off?
 

eye95

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Jan 6, 2010
Messages
13,524
Location
Fairborn, Ohio, USA
If the facts are as presented in the OP, it sounds as if the cops were spoiling for trouble, and the OCer was willing to do what was necessary to avoid trouble.

If the victim posts here, if the facts turn out to be essentially correct, and if the victim creates a defense fund, this is precisely the kind of case to which I will make a small contribution and encourage others to help.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk.

<o>
 

randian

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Mar 10, 2011
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Phoenix, AZ
sounds like the question is NOT a question of carry but one of trespass. You cannot dilly dally ...
It's not clear that they did. The cops didn't ask them to leave until after they talked to McDonald's staff. No mention is made of them being asked to leave before that. Since Stubbs obeyed the request to leave, only pausing to gather up his family and belongings (which seems reasonable), it looks to me like an abusive arrest i.e. the officers decided that "didn't leave within a second of being asked" equals "trespass".
 

MKEgal

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in front of my computer, WI
I agree that as presented it sounds like the police expected him to instantly teleport to somewhere outside the building, and since he didn't they arrested him.
John Monroe will tear them to pieces. :lol:
I have a good supply of popcorn... need to get some soda/pop to go with it though. BRB
 

conandan

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Nov 5, 2012
Messages
235
Location
florida
Doesn't the management need to ask him to leave personally. How does he know that the officers didn't force the manger to push the trespass. I've seen posts on here that show the same thing cops show up and then go to the owners or management to try and get a trespass charges when they have nothing else to violate the oc'er. And then not giving him time to collect his things and family is bs.
 

Fallschirjmäger

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I agree that as presented it sounds like the police expected him to instantly teleport to somewhere outside the building, and since he didn't they arrested him.
John Monroe will tear them to pieces. :lol:
I have a good supply of popcorn... need to get some soda/pop to go with it though. BRB
Hot and buttered for me, thank you!
Speaking of Mr. Monroe, although he's been a member of Glocktalk.com since May 2007 (5-6 years?) it was this incident that prompted him to make his very first post there.

Someone questioned the events and suggested that perhaps Mr. Stubbs caused a disturbance which prompted the officer's actions. JRM did not directly link to the police report but attested that the full and complete text of the official report was as follows...
"On 07-09-12, at approximately 1323 hours, Corporal K.L. Baldwin and Officer R.S. Mills came in contact with the aforementioned arrested person who was inside McDonald's, 1436 Manchester Expressway with a loaded weapon carried in his waistband. The weapon Springfield 45 caliber will be logged into Property & Evidence for storage. Investigation continues."
 

Fallschirjmäger

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Cumming, Georgia, USA
Doesn't the management need to ask him to leave personally. How does he know that the officers didn't force the manger to push the trespass. I've seen posts on here that show the same thing cops show up and then go to the owners or management to try and get a trespass charges when they have nothing else to violate the oc'er. And then not giving him time to collect his things and family is bs.
OCGA 16-7-21 (- contents partially snipped for clarity - )
Georgia Code - Crimes and Offenses - Title 16, Section 16-7-21
(b) A person commits the offense of criminal trespass when he or she knowingly and without authority:
...
(3) Remains upon the land or premises of another person ... after receiving notice from the owner, rightful occupant, or, upon proper identification, an authorized representative of the owner or rightful occupant to depart.

Technically, one must be identified as an authorized representative of the owner but I suppose courts don't have much objection to the notice to leave being relayed through the authority of a police officer.

Perhaps, in light of recent happenings at Gary Pirkle Park and the Columbus McDonalds (and the fact that police are in no way legally bound to tell the truth about such matters if they believe that withholding the truth will assist in apprehending a miscreant) that should be looked at again with a fresh eye?
 
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conandan

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florida
I have no problem leaving if asked to leave. But to charge him with trespass while getting his family and things together so he could leave is over the line IMHO. I open carry in Georgia and I will be in Columbus in a few weeks. Hopefully I won't have the same trouble with the leos there.
 

Fallschirjmäger

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Location
Cumming, Georgia, USA
I have no problem leaving if asked to leave. But to charge him with trespass while getting his family and things together so he could leave is over the line IMHO. I open carry in Georgia and I will be in Columbus in a few weeks. Hopefully I won't have the same trouble with the leos there.
Sadly, the more I read the the police report and the more I read comments from purported police officers on various forums, the more I am convinced this was more a case of, "Boy, I'ma gonna arrest you and make your evening miserable while I go home, have a steak and a beer, and watch me some TeeVee." that it is about trespass or disorderly conduct.
Mr Stubbs done gone and disrespected some police officer's 'authoritah'.

If you ever do have any "difficulties" with our beloved public servants, I highly recommend John R. Monroe. The mere mention of his name strikes fear in the hearts of evil doers.
 
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MKEgal

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in front of my computer, WI
Fallschirmjäger said:
Mr Stubbs done gone and disrespected some police officer's 'authoritah'.
Exactly. If there had been any sort of disturbance, it would be in their report.

If you ever do have any "difficulties" with our beloved public servants, I highly recommend John R. Monroe. The mere mention of his name strikes fear in the hearts of evil doers.
+1,000,000 And not just in GA.
 

jegoodin

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Jul 9, 2006
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337
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Stafford, Virginia, USA
It's not clear that they did. The cops didn't ask them to leave until after they talked to McDonald's staff. No mention is made of them being asked to leave before that. Since Stubbs obeyed the request to leave, only pausing to gather up his family and belongings (which seems reasonable), it looks to me like an abusive arrest i.e. the officers decided that "didn't leave within a second of being asked" equals "trespass".

This crap happens all too often at McDs. We should boycott...
 

Grapeshot

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Valhalla
Boycott to not support those with money.

Why penalize McD's who as not taken a negative stance?

The problem would seem to stem from an errant officer who intimidated a McD employee. IMO better to go through corporate and/or franchise channels to retrain the employee that allowed for this..........if in fact he/she did so.

I have been to untold numbers of McDonalds in numerous states and never had a problem with their management regarding legal carry.
 

wrightme

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Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Messages
5,574
Location
Fallon, Nevada, USA
Why penalize McD's who as not taken a negative stance?

The problem would seem to stem from an errant officer who intimidated a McD employee. IMO better to go through corporate and/or franchise channels to retrain the employee that allowed for this..........if in fact he/she did so.

I have been to untold numbers of McDonalds in numerous states and never had a problem with their management regarding legal carry.

No, that isn't what I advocate. I simply responded to a 'why boycott' general question. This wasn't about McD as near as I can tell.
 
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