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Virginia to stop honoring some out-of-state concealed handgun permits
- Thread starter TFred
- Start date
Va. will once again recognize concealed carry permits from other states
https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...8c0240-c5d8-11e5-9693-933a4d31bcc8_story.html
Copy headline, paste. Copy URL, click on link icon, paste.
We must remember to thank McAwful, Herr Herring and of course Lori, w/o whom this would not have come to fruition. Kind of brings a tear to my eye.
TFred
Regular Member
Read the fine print. Look at the last paragraph of the WAPO article linked above. Another provision of this agreement would apparently end private sales at gun shows unless a background check is conducted by the VA State Police. Governor has agreed to provide state police at every gun show for this purpose. There's also a provision to deny reciprocity to any individual who has a permit from another state VA recognizes, but had previously been denied a VA permit. Not sure how they're going enforce that.
Actually rather clever on the part of the governor. He gets gun control enacted that would never otherwise make it through the GA (closing the gun show "loophole") while gun owners regain lost reciprocity they may well get back anyway if unilateral recognition of all state permits passes and withstands the governor's veto. Furthermore, such an agreement might well take the wind out of the sails of much of the pro gun legislation currently under consideration, such as permitless carry.
Actually rather clever on the part of the governor. He gets gun control enacted that would never otherwise make it through the GA (closing the gun show "loophole") while gun owners regain lost reciprocity they may well get back anyway if unilateral recognition of all state permits passes and withstands the governor's veto. Furthermore, such an agreement might well take the wind out of the sails of much of the pro gun legislation currently under consideration, such as permitless carry.
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Nope - it is voluntary, but a very slippery slope.
Yes, it says "voluntary", but I can't imagine the governor agreeing to any such thing. I'm still concerned that this agreement will stall good legislation like unilateral recognition. If VA unilaterally recognizes all permits, we'll not only get back the states lost, but likely gain 3 more (CO, GA and NH) that we never had.
Then there's the provision that forces anybody under a permanent protective order to liquidate or surrender all firearms within 24 hours. Who knows what other gun control is going to get hung on this tree.
I can't really see this as a win for gun owners.
Repeater
Regular Member
Because it's not.
Marco
Regular Member
^1+
Our elected officials have allowed the camels nose under the tent.
They should have waited McDouche out of office. Instead both sides can now claim victory, at freedom expense.:cuss:
The mere fact McDouche and Red are now willing to accept the same chp holders they claimed weren't qualified to carry under VA law shows the issues was truly a non starter.
I'll bet McAwful and Red will be looking for the next chink in the gun laws in VA for another round of concessions..
I suspect the voluntary gun show private sales background check will be changed to mandatory.
Chippers can Rejoice in their hollow victory.:shocker:
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taurusfan
Regular Member
One thing I don't get is, if you sell a handgun privately and the State Police do a background check does the chain of ownership still lead back to the last FFL and not the private seller?
Thundar
Regular Member
This horrible legislation should be sent to McAwful only after all other pro gun legislation is sent to him. Early veto of Constitutional Carry or Agency Preemption = no compromise bill only the well deserved F0&D.
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Marco
Regular Member
^emphasis mine:
You got to be kidding.
There are many VA CHP'rs (probably not a problem limited to VA) that believe those without a CHP are felons and insist on folks showing them a CHP to conduct a private sale as a defacto background check.
This is one of many found on VAGT.
The owner of the same site at one time urged folks to ask the sellers to request that buyers produce a CHP prior to a firearm sale.
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TFred
Regular Member
You seem to misunderstand how this is happening. Legislation, both new bills and changes to previously filed bills is the solution.
Last two paragraphs of the WaPo article:
Delegate Lingamfelter's bill:
HB 1386 Firearms shows; voluntary background checks by Department of State Police.
The format never carries over nicely, but the text is here:
HOUSE BILL NO. 1386
Offered January 22, 2016
A BILL to amend the Code of Virginia by adding a section numbered 54.1-4201.2, relating to firearms shows; voluntary background checks; penalties.
----------
Patron-- Lingamfelter
----------
Referred to Committee on Militia, Police and Public Safety
----------
Be it enacted by the General Assembly of Virginia:
1. That the Code of Virginia is amended by adding a section numbered 54.1-4201.2 as follows:
§ 54.1-4201.2. Firearm transactions by persons other than dealers; voluntary background checks.
A. The Department of State Police shall be available at every firearms show held in the Commonwealth to make determinations in accordance with the procedures set out in § 18.2-308.2:2 of whether a prospective purchaser or transferee is prohibited under state or federal law from possessing a firearm. The Department of State Police shall establish policies and procedures in accordance with 28 C.F.R. § 25.6 to permit such determinations to be made by the Department of State Police.
Unless otherwise required by state or federal law, any party involved in the transaction may decide whether or not to have such a determination made.
The Department of State Police may charge a reasonable fee for the determination.
B. The promoter, as defined in § 54.1-4201.1, shall give the Department of State Police notice of the time and location of a firearms show at least 30 days prior to the show. The promoter shall provide the Department of State Police with adequate space, at no charge, to conduct such prohibition determinations. The promoter shall ensure that a notice that such determinations are available is prominently displayed at the show.
C. No person who sells or transfers a firearm at a firearms show after receiving a determination from the Department of State Police that the purchaser or transferee is not prohibited by state or federal law from possessing a firearm shall be liable for selling or transferring a firearm to such person.
D. The provisions of § 18.2-308.2:2, including definitions, procedures, and prohibitions, shall apply, mutatis mutandis, to the provisions of this section.
2. That the provisions of this act shall become effective only if approval is received from the U.S. Department of Justice for the Department of State Police to implement the policies and procedures set out in this act.
3. That the provisions of this act may result in a net increase in periods of imprisonment or commitment. Pursuant to § 30-19.1:4, the estimated amount of the necessary appropriation cannot be determined for periods of imprisonment in state adult correctional facilities; therefore, Chapter 665 of the Acts of Assembly of 2015 requires the Virginia Criminal Sentencing Commission to assign a minimum fiscal impact of $50,000. Pursuant to § 30-19.1:4, the estimated amount of the necessary appropriation is $0 for periods of commitment to the custody of the Department of Juvenile Justice.
Offered January 22, 2016
A BILL to amend the Code of Virginia by adding a section numbered 54.1-4201.2, relating to firearms shows; voluntary background checks; penalties.
----------
Patron-- Lingamfelter
----------
Referred to Committee on Militia, Police and Public Safety
----------
Be it enacted by the General Assembly of Virginia:
1. That the Code of Virginia is amended by adding a section numbered 54.1-4201.2 as follows:
§ 54.1-4201.2. Firearm transactions by persons other than dealers; voluntary background checks.
A. The Department of State Police shall be available at every firearms show held in the Commonwealth to make determinations in accordance with the procedures set out in § 18.2-308.2:2 of whether a prospective purchaser or transferee is prohibited under state or federal law from possessing a firearm. The Department of State Police shall establish policies and procedures in accordance with 28 C.F.R. § 25.6 to permit such determinations to be made by the Department of State Police.
Unless otherwise required by state or federal law, any party involved in the transaction may decide whether or not to have such a determination made.
The Department of State Police may charge a reasonable fee for the determination.
B. The promoter, as defined in § 54.1-4201.1, shall give the Department of State Police notice of the time and location of a firearms show at least 30 days prior to the show. The promoter shall provide the Department of State Police with adequate space, at no charge, to conduct such prohibition determinations. The promoter shall ensure that a notice that such determinations are available is prominently displayed at the show.
C. No person who sells or transfers a firearm at a firearms show after receiving a determination from the Department of State Police that the purchaser or transferee is not prohibited by state or federal law from possessing a firearm shall be liable for selling or transferring a firearm to such person.
D. The provisions of § 18.2-308.2:2, including definitions, procedures, and prohibitions, shall apply, mutatis mutandis, to the provisions of this section.
2. That the provisions of this act shall become effective only if approval is received from the U.S. Department of Justice for the Department of State Police to implement the policies and procedures set out in this act.
3. That the provisions of this act may result in a net increase in periods of imprisonment or commitment. Pursuant to § 30-19.1:4, the estimated amount of the necessary appropriation cannot be determined for periods of imprisonment in state adult correctional facilities; therefore, Chapter 665 of the Acts of Assembly of 2015 requires the Virginia Criminal Sentencing Commission to assign a minimum fiscal impact of $50,000. Pursuant to § 30-19.1:4, the estimated amount of the necessary appropriation is $0 for periods of commitment to the custody of the Department of Juvenile Justice.
ETA: Also, SB610 was amended to add the disqualifying clause about Virginia permits being revoked:
A. A valid concealed handgun or concealed weapon permit or license issued by another state shall authorize the holder of such permit or license who is at least 21 years of age to carry a concealed handgun in the Commonwealth, provided [...] (iii) the permit or license holder has not previously had a Virginia concealed handgun permit revoked.
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TFred
Regular Member
He's saying that you are incorrect in your assessment that the State Police will be bored, because many CHP holders will not sell privately to anyone who does NOT have a CHP. But with this option, they would use the voluntary background check to eliminate risk of their sale.
TFred
Marco
Regular Member
http://www.vaguntrader.com/forums/u...438/Re:_Universal_Background_Check#Post992438
Just one of many found on VAGT.
rightwinglibertarian
Regular Member
http://www.redflagnews.com/headlines-2016/dems-lose-va-to-honor-conceal-carry-reciprocity-again
Not that you need a permit to bear arms but in general this is tolerable
Not that you need a permit to bear arms but in general this is tolerable
That is an opinion of matter.
rightwinglibertarian
Regular Member
you're the big fan of baby steps and legal dances. Be grateful you didnt have one this time. It isnt often the government gives you freedom after they steal it.
Sent from my HTC Desire 626s using Tapatalk
Sent from my HTC Desire 626s using Tapatalk
Big fan is an overreach. Small steps are not unreasonable when we can't get all that we want and are in a position of having some control.
This camel has a pointy and very cold nose.
utbagpiper
Banned
Amen. The problem with denying RKBA based on protective orders is that it is far too easy to get protective orders. At the very least, ex parte protective orders--handed out like candy in this part of the world, I hope your courts are more reasonable--should never impact RKBA.
Charles