I just got the new VCDL alert

[jmelvin]

...and I don't think this discription fits VCDL. (not saying you do or don't, but I don't)

Nah I don't think VCDL fits the description. I think the VCDL has been a good orgainization and I also realize that VCDL doesn't have the power to introduce bills in the GA (although they could prep some and ask members to introduce them), as that's the responsibility of GA members. I have been pleased to see many VCDL executive type members open carrying and am glad for their support as I'm confident that having the public seeing guns in everyday life is what allowed for permit free concealed carry in places like AZ where OC has been the norm for ages. It is my hope that VCDL will continue to support further expansion of unlicensed OC and further expansion of unlicensed CC, such as the expansion of unlicensed CC now in secured containers within vehicles.

 

[Sailorcurt]

My guess is you put the alert together anyway.

Your guess would be incorrect.

I have nothing to do with producing or sending out the VA Alerts.

They do make mistakes and one of them was sending you over here to discuss it with me.

Again, incorrect. No one sent me here, I'm not a regular here (although I've been a member for years, I don't "do" the forum format much) and only found this thread through Google news alerts, which I have set up to keep up with what the anti's are saying and doing...is it ironic that this thread popped up in that context? Or just "par for the course" for a community that regularly "eats its own"?

It just firmed up my feelings about this!

Well, I'm sorry you feel that way...but the unfortunate fact is that some people just won't be reached. As I said before: I wish you well and hope you much success in securing Virginians' gun rights.

 

[peter nap]

Your guess would be incorrect.

I have nothing to do with producing or sending out the VA Alerts.




Again, incorrect. No one sent me here, I'm not a regular here (although I've been a member for years, I don't "do" the forum format much) and only found this thread through Google news alerts, which I have set up to keep up with what the anti's are saying and doing...is it ironic that this thread popped up in that context? Or just "par for the course" for a community that regularly "eats its own"?



Well, I'm sorry you feel that way...but the unfortunate fact is that some people just won't be reached. As I said before: I wish you well and hope you much success in securing Virginians' gun rights.

You finished now?

 

[VCDL President]

Lucky me, I just found this thread

Where do I begin?

First - Curt WAS NOT SENT HERE TO FIGHT MY BATTLES. The implication is insulting. He did a good job, but I am used to defending myself and so I shall.

Second - Why do I have to learn of complaints like this by having to skim over OCDO? I do have an email address: president@vcdl.org. Granted I get a lot of emails all day long, but I read them all.

Third, Peter you are reading way, way too much into those alert items. Yes, what was written to the State Fair should have had a note from me in the alert pointing out that open carry is equally legal. Rick had taken action on something and the points that I wanted to make with that item were:

1. Their own mission statement contradicts their policies, as Rick caught
2. Here was another activist trying to make a difference. His email correspondence did a good job, but he did only quote half of the legal ways to carry a handgun. Just too much going on and it slipped by me.

Fourth, Thundar, I don't even know where to begin with your comments. Sorry about the bruise on your head, but it is a self-inflicted wound.

Fifth, HeroHog, "The issue most HERE will have with them is that they, as an organization, are anti-OC for the most part." I don't know whether to laugh or cry at that comment. However, I can't let misinformation like that about VCDL slip by. Open carry is near and dear to VCDL's Board and EMs - take a look at photos of VCDL events sometime or attend a meeting the next time you are back in Virginia. The Board made a decision long ago to fully defend open carry. And it was VCDL that started pushing OC in restaurants back in the late 90's so people could stay armed. That had a big impact on jump starting the OC trend in VA. "They tend to treat it like a dirty little secret that they just have to live with and will always try to steer one to CC with a permit." I have no idea where you got that idea from - see my previous comments.

Sixth, Peter, back to you - licensed carry is the only carry allowed in Texas (Chappell Hill story) - they don't have open carry at all, so I'm not sure what you are going to tell that bank manager, except, "thanks!"

 

[peter nap]

Philip, I don't have a fight with you and I think you know it. An occasional disagreement but they have always been mild, nor do I have a fight with VCDL. As you know with my long gone NRA membership, I don't belong to groups that I hate.

Curt is another matter and personal, so we won't discuss him.

Rick's story was bad. I can't say anything good about it. He went on about our heritage and traditions accompanied by that statement.

The Chappell Hill story Hill storywas just moonshine on the campfire. It doesn't matter if it's NC or Texas, it was in a Virginia alert.

As far as P4P, that is a sore spot and last year is over. No need to go on about VCDL's support about it until we see what this year brings.

We're still getting mileage out of VDOF and You know as much about that as I do, but you have worked on it and it's finally starting to pay off a little. Another week or so and we should see how much.

 

[Sailorcurt]

Curt is another matter and personal, so we won't discuss him.

I know I should probably just let this go, but I'm truly confused.

What, specifically, did I say that offended you so personally?

 

[Sailorcurt]

I know I should probably just let this go, but I'm truly confused.

What, specifically, did I say that offended you so personally?

Oh...never mind. I just figured it out.

I've harmed Mr. Nap's fragile ego before on this board.

I had completely forgotten about an exchange we had around seven months ago. Apparently he hasn't forgotten about it.

Someone doesn't like being criticized.

In his defense, I was rather testy in that exchange. Apparently I was having a bad day.

At any rate, mystery solved.

 

[67GT390FB]

Oh...never mind. I just figured it out.

I've harmed Mr. Nap's fragile ego before on this board.

I had completely forgotten about an exchange we had around seven months ago. Apparently he hasn't forgotten about it.

Someone doesn't like being criticized.

In his defense, I was rather testy in that exchange. Apparently I was having a bad day.

At any rate, mystery solved.

Ha Ha doesn't sound to me like you harmed peter's ego, more like you pissed him off, and instead of letting sleeping dogs lie you attempt to stir him up some more good move there chief.

Joe

 

[peter nap]

edited

 

[peter nap]

Edited

 

[ProShooter]

I've harmed Mr. Nap's fragile ego before on this board.

I've never thought of Peter Nap as "fragile".

He's always been more of a soft, gentle, furry, woodland creature in my eyes...

 

[jmelvin]

This is pretty good, two days in a row we have EM's stirring the poo. At least it's not "my" thread today.

Poor, poor, fragile Mr. Napp.

 

[HeroHog]

Guys, you are right and I was wrong. I was having a brain fort when I posted that and I apologize. You guys know me and know I am 100% Pro VCDL but I dropped the ball here BIG time. What I had in my mind were some incidents involving individual VCDL members who, on THR.com and TFL.com where strongly against OC. This is not and was not the VCDLs position as you well pointed out, the heads of this organization OC regularly and are leaders of the OC movement. I simply don't know WHERE my head was when I posted that.

I will say I am very glad that y'all straightened this out and corrected me and again, I apologize for making statements that were out and out wrong.

PS: No, no one contacted me. I was just reading what was up and discovered I had dropped the ball big time and wanted to get that fixed ASAP.

 

[ed]

I'm an EM and I OC almost everywhere I go. I would like to see Constitutional Carry too. I hold (almost) monthly OC dinners.. I go to public events (like Bob McDonnell's town hall) and pick up litter 4 times a year while open carrying. Maybe this year VCDL can even make more restrictions go away.

VCDL is not 5-6 guys at the top. VCDL is the MEMBERSHIP. When the Alert comes out that says write your senator.... it is the THOUSANDS of emails, cards and letters they get which makes progress.

I would encourage any Virginia gun owner to be a member. Even if you don't agree with them 100% of the time (I don't), but I agree with them more times than not and that is good enough for me.

 

[VCDL President]

Philip, I don't have a fight with you and I think you know it. An occasional disagreement but they have always been mild, nor do I have a fight with VCDL. As you know with my long gone NRA membership, I don't belong to groups that I hate.

Curt is another matter and personal, so we won't discuss him.

Rick's story was bad. I can't say anything good about it. He went on about our heritage and traditions accompanied by that statement.

The Chappell Hill story Hill storywas just moonshine on the campfire. It doesn't matter if it's NC or Texas, it was in a Virginia alert.

As far as P4P, that is a sore spot and last year is over. No need to go on about VCDL's support about it until we see what this year brings.

We're still getting mileage out of VDOF and You know as much about that as I do, but you have worked on it and it's finally starting to pay off a little. Another week or so and we should see how much.

The Chappell Hill story was just something that I wish we would see more of in Virginia and everywhere else.

I have my fingers crossed on the VDOF issue. It should be positive. Hopefully State Parks and DGIF should get some improvement on OC, too.

 

[Bulldog1967]

The VCDL is a great group supporting all gun owners. The issue most HERE will have with them is that they, as an organization, are anti-OC for the most part. They tend to treat it like a dirty little secret that they just have to live with and will always try to steer one to CC with a permit.

Please support your assertions with proof of this, otherwise I call bullshit.

Matt
VCDL Executive Member.

 

[Thundar]

Where do I begin?.....


Fourth, Thundar, I don't even know where to begin with your comments. Sorry about the bruise on your head, but it is a self-inflicted wound......

Well Philip pejorative statements do not become you and are usually used by those that cannot refute with clarity and logic that which they do not agree.

The two heads with bruises on them are the rule of law in Virginia and Virginia gunrights.

This past year was a major failure in the Virginia Senate. There were no gun rights victories this year, except for glove box carry. The Senate made up rules as they went along to ensure gun rights legislation was killed in an illegal sub committee.

Many in VCDL do open carry at public events. That is not the point. The point is that open carry is the right and concealed carry is a priveledge. We have seen how VCDL puts more emphasis on enhancing the priveledge than it does protecting the right.

I know that VCDL gives a much higher priority to Perks for Permittees than it does to gun rights. The evidence is right there on the VCDL Legislative tracking tool. Priveledge enhancement was strongly supported while the Virginia Firearms Freedom Act was only supported. Quite a pitty really.

VCDL could easily change this by making constitutional carry a top priority this year. It would however mean that some on the VCDL board who earn part of their livelihood as Concealed Carry Instructors would lose part of their livelihood.

Disagree with me? Thats OK, I promise not to make belittling statements about you on a public forum. If you wish to respond just tell me what major gun rights victories we had in the Legislative session this year and tell me why the major gun rights legislation was not strongly supported.

 

[Thundar]

Please support your assertions with proof of this, otherwise I call bullshit.

Matt
VCDL Executive Member.

Look at the VCDL Legislative Tracking Tool.

 

[Thundar]

I'm an EM and I OC almost everywhere I go. I would like to see Constitutional Carry too. I hold (almost) monthly OC dinners.. I go to public events (like Bob McDonnell's town hall) and pick up litter 4 times a year while open carrying. Maybe this year VCDL can even make more restrictions go away.

VCDL is not 5-6 guys at the top. VCDL is the MEMBERSHIP. When the Alert comes out that says write your senator.... it is the THOUSANDS of emails, cards and letters they get which makes progress.

I would encourage any Virginia gun owner to be a member. Even if you don't agree with them 100% of the time (I don't), but I agree with them more times than not and that is good enough for me.

IMHO, if you are looking for a more hard core gun rights group then VGOF is the group to join.

 

[Thundar]

Sailor Curt, your VCDL statement is confusing.

Or, sometimes, you can't please anyone.




We didn't get to where we are overnight and in one fell swoop and we're not going to get back that way either. VCDL is a no-compromise group in the sense that we will never stop pushing for full and complete recognition of the right to keep and bear arms in the state of Virginia. In the process of that work, however, in order to make progress toward that goal, some incremental compromises must be made to achieve success. Then we can build upon that success in the future.

Is VCDL a No Compromise Group or an incremental compromise group?