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SWATing.

BB62

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Aug 17, 2006
Messages
4,069
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
Stop acting like a child, he was not defamed, he was not even approached by LE. The caller reported a man with a gun, that was not a lie. The dispatcher screwed up by not telling him he was abusing 911, and OC is legal. The only persons who suffered was the tax payers.

This continued arguing over the stupid stuff is the reason I used to laugh at you. It is no longer funny but pathetic, please seek help.

Grapeshot forgive me, but it is really getting old.
+100,000
 

Ezek

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 19, 2015
Messages
411
Location
missouri
i would recommend sending a letter to the chief for reprimand of the dispatcher, and maybe some changes in policy in regards to responding to legal MWAG calls, since OC is legal, and 9 officers where nto required for a simple "check it out" outside of that, the only thing of malicious intent i can see is the caller lieing about the lack of a CDW so as to instigate a confrontation with LAC's however the dispatcher confirmed it was holstered and visible, and therefore legal. so dispatch did the job of dispelling the lie, but failed in the dispatch of LEO's to the scene.

could still send someone for observation in the investigation of the call, and initiate contact only if he did something that actually was illegal, otherwise, mosey on down the road.

this is a failure by the PD and dispatch with an over-reaction, but again no real legal grounds fro defamation, or anything since the officers DID ACT APPROPRIATELY ONCE ON SCENE.
 

OC for ME

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,452
Location
White Oak Plantation
i would recommend sending a letter to the chief for reprimand of the dispatcher, and maybe some changes in policy in regards to responding to legal MWAG calls, since OC is legal, and 9 officers where nto required for a simple "check it out" outside of that, the only thing of malicious intent i can see is the caller lieing about the lack of a CDW so as to instigate a confrontation with LAC's however the dispatcher confirmed it was holstered and visible, and therefore legal. so dispatch did the job of dispelling the lie, but failed in the dispatch of LEO's to the scene.

could still send someone for observation in the investigation of the call, and initiate contact only if he did something that actually was illegal, otherwise, mosey on down the road.

this is a failure by the PD and dispatch with an over-reaction, but again no real legal grounds fro defamation, or anything since the officers DID ACT APPROPRIATELY ONCE ON SCENE.
Really.

What a load of BS. The nitwit cop just couldn't help himself could he. It's in their DNA it seems. Anti-liberty fool.
Regarding:
... Before leaving they had asked the employees if they were ok with it (me open carrying) and they said "yes".
Why ask if they acted appropriately.
 

twoskinsonemanns

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 12, 2012
Messages
2,326
Location
WV
Any legal action is such a crap-shoot it's not worth the effort. Having his name and # it would probably be justice to post some very creative and disturbing ads it the personals section of the areas craigslist. Of course I don't recommend or condone such deserving actions.
 

Ezek

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 19, 2015
Messages
411
Location
missouri
Really.

Regarding:Why ask if they acted appropriately.

well.. MOSTLY appropriately.. if the employees said no they wherent' he could then leave the premises to avoid a trespass violation, so they still wouldn't be able to pin a charge.

they COULD have showed up all swatted out with M16's and BPV's and Kevlar helemts yelling "GET ON THE GROUND!"
 

Dario

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2013
Messages
204
Location
Larimer County, CO
I am disgusted with the busy body mentality. I'm not really sure the problem is necessarily anti gun but anti individualism. I read an article yesterday that was basically the author whining that he couldn't get an airline flight attendant to do anything about someone he suspected to be covertly 'vaping' an e-cigarette a few seats over in a plane.
It's the collectivist, you-will-be-assimilated, see-something-say-something, it-takes-a-village, anti-liberty cancer that is the real problem I think.

+1

There are far too many Nosey Nancy's in this world who take it upon themselves to be the CEO of the Council of Overly Concerned Citizens Brigade.
 

color of law

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Messages
5,936
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
To get back on subject matter....

Unlike Cincinnati, Louisville's 911 only allows calls for:

In an emergency, call 911 immediately from any wired or wireless phone. An emergency is any situation that requires immediate assistance from the police, fire department or emergency medical personnel. Examples include:

A fire
A crime
A car crash, especially if someone is injured
A medical emergency.

https://louisvilleky.gov/government/emametrosafe/when-call-911
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
9,315
Location
here nc
Last edited:

STLDaniel

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2015
Messages
86
Location
Saint Louis
A “defamatory statement” is any statement that an ordinary person would find damaging to their reputation and character. If you're OC'ing, it would be hard to argue stating you considered stating you had a firearm is damaging to your reputation. Saying you do not have a permit... well, that may hurt your rep on opencarry.org, but doubt most people consider that damaging to your rep or character.

Intentionally lying about that to the dispatcher in saying you didn't have a permit... they could go after him for a false report, but that's completely up to them, and in this case it would probably be hard to show clear intent, since he answered honestly on everything else, and would simply say that's what he thought you said (Which is actually rather easy in this case, as human nature tends to hear "it's not needed" as "No, because it's not needed). I don't see how you could claim any actual damages, so any civil action would be pointless.

W/O knowing the department procedures, my assumption would be 9 cars would have needed dispatch instructions to go there. Those out on patrol usually don't have a set path, and sometimes pass by or near other calls, or head there if they aren't on another dispatched call. (I have heard on the scanner officers reporting to dispatch that they will also respond, and that being acknowledged by dispatch) but I think typical stay within designated sectors or areas to ensure broad coverage of the jurisdiction, unless they are specifically dispatched. So I'm guessing the dispatcher probably directed multiple to the area. A lot of that may just depend on how slow the night is going for them. If there aren't any other calls needing attention, why not be a little over prepared?
 

STLDaniel

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2015
Messages
86
Location
Saint Louis
In Cincinnati people are encouraged to call 911 when they see a gun.
http://www.cincinnati-oh.gov/police/contact-us/911/

Dial 911 for Emergencies Only

Appropriate uses of 911 are instances of immediate danger or there is a crime in progress, such as:

...
vehicle accident
person with a weapon (gun/knife)
suspicious situations
...

If that's their policy, make it a training exercise for dispatch, and at the same time show how stupid this is. Hold a small OC walk, have a friendly caller report it... and encourage as many people to call it in as you can! All reporting it very friendly and with full facts. That individuals have firearms, holstered and are simply walking calmly and peacefully. After awhile they should get tired with dispatching officers and finally start asking for more detail to determine if there's criminal activity or responding to the callers that there's nothing illegal about OC'ing properly.
 

poetdante

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2014
Messages
449
Location
Louisville, KY
Intentionally lying about that to the dispatcher in saying you didn't have a permit... they could go after him for a false report, but that's completely up to them, and in this case it would probably be hard to show clear intent, since he answered honestly on everything else, and would simply say that's what he thought you said (Which is actually rather easy in this case, as human nature tends to hear "it's not needed" as "No, because it's not needed). I don't see how you could claim any actual damages, so any civil action would be pointless.

Again, I did answer his initial question with that I did have my license and added that in KY I do not need one for open carry and said that what I was doing, openly carrying, was not needing a license in KY.
 

DeSchaine

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2013
Messages
537
Location
Kalamazoo, MI
An interesting article on Fox News today.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/09/0...permit-holders-putting-lives-at/?intcmp=hpbt2


In an era in which individuals are being allowed to carry loaded guns on our streets with no permit, background check or required training, it is common sense for concerned citizens to call 911 when they see an armed individual whose intentions are unclear. These [open carry] laws guarantee that we—and law enforcement—will have no idea about the criminal and/or mental health background of these individuals until they actually commit a crime; and by then it could be far too late. We have full confidence in our men and women in blue to assess these situations.

Gun-toters who are truly law-abiding and mentally competent have nothing whatsoever to worry about. Their conversations with law enforcement will be brief and professional. As for those who are dangerous and have something to hide which would not withstand the scrutiny of a background check or permitting process, they should expect to face some tough questions as a result of these 911 calls. And that makes us all safer.

--- Ladd Everitt, director of communications for the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence.

Thats it, go on, lie and mislead the media some more, you sub-moronic cretin. Ignore the fact that every state has laws governing the purchase of firearms. Cover your ears and close your eyes to every instance where cops have misused and abused their authority, or just plain acted criminally in their own right. I want to take a printed version of the Michigan code, shove it in their face and scream "READ THE HIGHLIGHTED PARTS!!!"
 

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,317
Location
Valhalla
An interesting article on Fox News today.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/09/0...permit-holders-putting-lives-at/?intcmp=hpbt2




Thats it, go on, lie and mislead the media some more, you sub-moronic cretin. Ignore the fact that every state has laws governing the purchase of firearms. Cover your ears and close your eyes to every instance where cops have misused and abused their authority, or just plain acted criminally in their own right. I want to take a printed version of the Michigan code, shove it in their face and scream "READ THE HIGHLIGHTED PARTS!!!"
Nah - remain calm, cool and collected. No need to take on any of the attributes of the antis.......and smile a lot - that confuses and worries them. We take the high road with decorum and dignity.

Keep on working though to smother the flames they leave smoldering behind them with facts and details. Educating the people one at a time and collectively.

An "Army of One" becomes huge when multiplied thousands of times over.
 

davidmcbeth

Banned
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,167
Location
earth's crust
An interesting article on Fox News today.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/09/0...permit-holders-putting-lives-at/?intcmp=hpbt2




Thats it, go on, lie and mislead the media some more, you sub-moronic cretin. Ignore the fact that every state has laws governing the purchase of firearms. Cover your ears and close your eyes to every instance where cops have misused and abused their authority, or just plain acted criminally in their own right. I want to take a printed version of the Michigan code, shove it in their face and scream "READ THE HIGHLIGHTED PARTS!!!"

The old "don't worry, trust us" argument. That worries me even more.

People should be filing those no-contact notices now .... well?, get to it !
 

color of law

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Messages
5,936
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
Are you kidding me???? Your Supreme Court has just ruled that they don't care what the state constitution says; we ain't going to enforce it. So, what makes you think the courts will punish a 911 lawbreaker when it comes to reporting a law abiding citizen carrying a gun?
 

willy1094

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 12, 2013
Messages
201
Location
Nothern KY
As others have explained, officers ought to make sure dispatch isn't wasting limited resources sending out 9 officers on bogus calls. There was a day in this nation when a couple of largish black men walking in certain neighborhoods was considered appropriate justification to dispatch police regardless of how the men were dressed or comporting themselves. Thankfully, those days are (most?) over. A couple of black men walking on a sidewalk is not, of itself, reason for police to even do a drive by.

The same should be true of someone who is peacefully OCing a properly holstered sidearm, lacking any overt indications of violations of some law. (And most--if not all--laws making such conduct a crime need to be rescinded.)

(And I chose my example very deliberately. LAC gun owners need to start recognizing bigotry and discrimination against themselves for what it is: and it is every bit as small minded, dangerous, and ugly as racism.)

Charles

I don't disagree with anything you say other than it is dispatch making those calls. It is the PD's SOP's that dictate who and how man go to calls. A dispatcher can't MAKE 1 officer go to a call if the PD has a policy saying they don't respond to this or that situation.
 

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,317
Location
Valhalla
I don't disagree with anything you say other than it is dispatch making those calls. It is the PD's SOP's that dictate who and how man go to calls. A dispatcher can't MAKE 1 officer go to a call if the PD has a policy saying they don't respond to this or that situation.
Varies from LEA to LEA, but it is getting better. Most responses in my state, if made, are simple drive by checks.
 
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