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Campus carry bill filed in Ky. House

gutshot II

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Rep. Tim Moore has introduced HB 194 to remove the authority for public colleges and universities to restrict firearms on their campuses. Rep. Moore has filed bills in the last few years that remove almost all restrictions on locations where firearms are now restricted. Looks like he has decided to try to take smaller bites from this apple.

HB 194 can be seen here:


https://apps.legislature.ky.gov/recorddocuments/bill/19RS/HB194/bill.pdf
 

Ghost1958

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Well, that is conceal carry. What law disallows open carry on college campuses?
Technically none. The KY constitution plainly only gives the state legislature to prevent concealed carry.

Actually the whole ccdw permit scheme violates the KY constitution

It only gave the legislature power to prevent cc, or allow it. Not to regulate cc or create a bunch of regulations using cc as an excuse.
 

color of law

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Technically none. The KY constitution plainly only gives the state legislature to prevent concealed carry.

Actually the whole ccdw permit scheme violates the KY constitution

It only gave the legislature power to prevent cc, or allow it. Not to regulate cc or create a bunch of regulations using cc as an excuse.
What about an open carry walk across University of Louisville campus? Is it not public property?
 

Ghost1958

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What about an open carry walk across University of Louisville campus? Is it not public property?
While it wouldn't be illegal, in Louisville, at the UOL, probably the most liberal place in the state it's almost a guarantee one would be Swatted on campus. And probably shot by a nervous Nellie swat team as a, mass shooter.

I have OCed in the Derby quite a bit but had no occasion to go to UOL campus.
 

color of law

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237.115 Construction of KRS 237.110 -- Prohibition by local government units of carrying concealed deadly weapons in governmental buildings -- Restriction on criminal penalties.
(1) Except as provided in KRS 527.020, nothing contained in KRS 237.110 shall be construed to limit, restrict, or prohibit in any manner the right of a college, university, or any postsecondary education facility, including technical schools and community colleges, to control the possession of deadly weapons on any property owned or controlled by them or the right of a unit of state, city, county, urban-county, or charter county government to prohibit the carrying of concealed deadly weapons by licensees in that portion of a building actually owned, leased, or occupied by that unit of government.
Open carry would not be allowed on college campuses.
 

gutshot II

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Open carry would not be allowed on college campuses.
What you have quoted is existing law. The new, proposed language is in bold font and underlined. If you read that new, proposed language you will see that open carry is not excluded, although the carrier will have to be licensed.
 

Ghost1958

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Open carry would not be allowed on college campuses.
You will note that the statute your quoting is about concealed deadly weapons. Not a peep about OC.

Because there cannot constitutionally be in KY. KY makes a stab at preventing carry in bars OC but it wouldn't survive a serious challenge.

The only thing UOL could do is trespass the carrier. Legally.

Anyway it's a bad law. It would be the first time in KY that a permit was necessary to carry a firearm openly anywhere save for the fed thing on schools.

End run around the KY constitution in a first step to begin making permits nessacary to OC.

That cannot be allowed.
Where the effort should be is supporting permitless carry or "constitutional carry".
 
Last edited:

poetdante

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Moore has contacted me with an update on this bill. Keeping it hush hush for now but the NRA is being difficult with this bill. Trying to play smarter not harder. Hopefully something can be done before the session ends
 

Ghost1958

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Moore has contacted me with an update on this bill. Keeping it hush hush for now but the NRA is being difficult with this bill. Trying to play smarter not harder. Hopefully something can be done before the session ends
Any bill that in anyway makes a permit required for OC is
1 A violation of the ky constitution
2 An unconstitutional and illegal act by the legislators passing it as they HAVE NO authority to require a permit to OC at all period.

Do us all a favor and let this illegal end run around the ky constitution die.

It won't survive a the court challange its guaranteed to get.

Hush hush is the only way you can play it because few if any Ky gun owners will stand for a permit required to OC anyplace .
 

poetdante

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Any bill that in anyway makes a permit required for OC is
1 A violation of the ky constitution
2 An unconstitutional and illegal act by the legislators passing it as they HAVE NO authority to require a permit to OC at all period.

Do us all a favor and let this illegal end run around the ky constitution die.

It won't survive a the court challange its guaranteed to get.

Hush hush is the only way you can play it because few if any Ky gun owners will stand for a permit required to OC anyplace .
The campus carry bill would be for removing the universities' statutory authority to prohibit weapons entirely. It may be tailored to prohibiting universties from prohibiting concealed carry. That said, from all I can gather the policies are not enforced and students/faculty carry anyway because it is not a crime to carry a firearm on post-secondary education campuses in KY
 

Ghost1958

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The campus carry bill would be for removing the universities' statutory authority to prohibit weapons entirely. It may be tailored to prohibiting universties from prohibiting concealed carry. That said, from all I can gather the policies are not enforced and students/faculty carry anyway because it is not a crime to carry a firearm on post-secondary education campuses in KY
Understood. However this apparently is in the bill.

Gutshot 2 said. What you have quoted is existing law. The new, proposed language is in bold font and underlined. If you read that new, proposed language you will see that open carry is not excluded, although the carrier will have to be licensed.

Now if I'm misreading that correct me but it states a person must be licensed to open carry on campus.

The state constitution is very clear the general Assembly only has authority to prevent CC. They do NOT have the authority to require a licence to OC anywhere in this state.

The bill, if it as Gut said requires a license to OC on campus is blatantly unconstitutional and completely outside the General Assembly authority create and or even consider.

That little end run around the Ky Constitution concerning firearms can't be allowed to stand if the GA has the audacity to pass it.
 

poetdante

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Understood. However this apparently is in the bill.

Gutshot 2 said. What you have quoted is existing law. The new, proposed language is in bold font and underlined. If you read that new, proposed language you will see that open carry is not excluded, although the carrier will have to be licensed.

Now if I'm misreading that correct me but it states a person must be licensed to open carry on campus.

The state constitution is very clear the general Assembly only has authority to prevent CC. They do NOT have the authority to require a licence to OC anywhere in this state.

The bill, if it as Gut said requires a license to OC on campus is blatantly unconstitutional and completely outside the General Assembly authority create and or even consider.

That little end run around the Ky Constitution concerning firearms can't be allowed to stand if the GA has the audacity to pass it.
I understand what you are saying now, yes. I'll see what I can find out
 

gutshot II

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I think the passage of constitutional carry has thrown this bill into chaos. How can you require a license when licenses are no longer required to conceal? I suggest a serious and thoughtful rewrite. I have the utmost confidence in and respect for Tim Moore, perhaps more confidence and respect than some of his colleges have.
Representative Moore was center stage last year in an effort to force Speaker of the House, Jeff Hoover, to resign from the House of Representatives. He eventually did resign as Speaker but remains in the House today. Some of the members(including Hoover) still hold a grudge against Rep. Moore over that incident. I was surprised to see that he retained his Committee Chairmanship this year. Hoover may not be Speaker any more but he is still a powerful force to be reckoned with. I was surprised to see that Rep. Moore was not present for the vote on constitutional carry. I'd love to hear an explanation of that.
 

Ghost1958

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I think the passage of constitutional carry has thrown this bill into chaos. How can you require a license when licenses are no longer required to conceal? I suggest a serious and thoughtful rewrite. I have the utmost confidence in and respect for Tim Moore, perhaps more confidence and respect than some of his colleges have.
Representative Moore was center stage last year in an effort to force Speaker of the House, Jeff Hoover, to resign from the House of Representatives. He eventually did resign as Speaker but remains in the House today. Some of the members(including Hoover) still hold a grudge against Rep. Moore over that incident. I was surprised to see that he retained his Committee Chairmanship this year. Hoover may not be Speaker any more but he is still a powerful force to be reckoned with. I was surprised to see that Rep. Moore was not present for the vote on constitutional carry. I'd love to hear an explanation of that.
That and the legislature has no authority to require a permit to OC anywhere in the state.

As far as Moore not being present for the vote on permitless cc, his penchent for licensed carry probably explains that.
 
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