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Congressmen Urge the UN to Trample the US Constitution

scott58dh

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Oct 16, 2011
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why?
UN arms treaty could put U.S. gun owners in foreign sights, say critics

“It cheapens our rights as American citizens, and weakens our sovereignty.”
- Wayne LaPierre, National Rifle Association

UNITED NATIONS – A treaty being hammered out this month at the United Nations -- with Iran playing a key role -- could expose the records of America's gun owners to foreign governments -- and, critics warn, eventually put the Second Amendment on global trial.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/0...-in-foreign-sights-say-critics/#ixzz20OJMnOqJ

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/0...-in-foreign-sights-say-critics/#ixzz20OIwmcCz

:arrow:http://a57.foxnews.com/global.fncst...g/fn-latino/news/660/371/Chavez Iran 2012.jpg
 
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Gil223

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Jan 5, 2012
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Weber County Utah
They have been trying to do this for the last 20 yrs .. getting some goofy treaty to limit our rights. It goes nowhere, ever.

If it actually ever comes to the US Senate only a senator who wishes non-reelection would vote for it. Its a 100% political death run to vote for it. I would guess 98-2 against

Apparently you are still under the impression that our "votes" count for something... and that may be true in some cases, but only when the votes happen to coincide with what "They" want. Yes, it's the amorphous "They" again. They, for the most-part, are very careful to maintain anonymity and remain behind the curtain (with The Great and Powerful Oz). However, recently (since November 2008) some have become emboldened enough to hint at their presence and purpose. Among the power brokers we find George Soros (Soros, was a Hungarian immigrant, who enjoyed and took full advantage of the things our country had to offer [and now despises it], "is the founder and chairman of a network of foundations that promote, among other things, the creation of open, democratic societies based upon the rule of law, market economies, transparent and accountable governance, freedom of the press, and respect for human rights" - as he sees those things), and a virulent proponent of Draconian anti-gun laws. Then there's Michael Bloomberg (current left-wing mayor of NYC, and rabid anti-2A activist), who is a self-made billionaire who has obviously forgotten which social construct enabled him to become a billionaire, and Barack Hussein Obama, whose leadership experience is non-existent, whose birthplace and educational background is murky at best, and whose mentors, heroes and cabinet members are all leftist/Marxist/Communist activists and revolutionaries. Soros had pretty-much remained low-key prior to November 2008, Bloomberg has been "outed" since his election as mayor of NYC in 2003. And Obama? He covered himself in a cloak of altruism in 2008, ran a campaign financed by God only knows who, and then turned his back on all things true Americans believe in when he was elected. Bigger government facilitates the "Nanny State", where the indolent "grasshoppers" are sustained by the hard-working "ants". Borrowing the country into what is essentially a financial 'black hole', with promises of recovery, helps to insure the willing cooperation of the sheeple majority. A world tour spent apologizing for our successes, demeans and weakens us in the eyes of "the global community". Don't misunderstand though... Obama is anything but ineffective. He is highly effective in furthering his goals, even though they run counter to the best interests of the citizens of the United States of America.

But, regardless of which political party controls the House, Senate and the Oval Office, the function of government is always control of the masses by the elitists. There are probably thousands of "conspiracy theories" floating around the internet, and each may contain a particle (at the atomic level) of truth. It is the process of picking and choosing the correct particles of truth in order to properly complete the puzzle (and form the "Big Picture"), that is problematical. Those who would destroy our Republic, have a unique opportunity to do so during the Obama administration. As far as committing political suicide by voting to accept the UN SATT goes, those who are "true believers" don't really care. They are certain "the machine" will reelect/appoint them. Just my thoughts. :) Pax...
 

jrob33

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Dec 17, 2010
Messages
60
Location
oklahoma
The procedure for the ACA, and UN Treaty are not the same, although, they both can end at the Bench--as did ACA. Also, the UN Treaty requires a greater number of Congress to vote Yea, than did the ACA.

You can sleep well tonight...and tomorrow night, the Nazi's aren't coming for you just yet.

I sleep well every night because I have made my peace, and I am prepared to do my best to defend myself and my family..the rest is out of my hands. As for the UN, Im watching this very closely, but i will say regardless of what uniform you are wearing if you want my guns come get them, because by the time you take them they will be no good to me anymore.
 

TFred

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Oct 13, 2008
Messages
7,750
Location
Most historic town in, Virginia, USA
Yes I can.

Reid v. Covert, 354 U.S. 1 (1957),
Thanks! That is a very reassuring opinion to read, as long as it is still the prevailing precedent. Some of it is so good, I'm going to paste a couple paragraphs here below.

TFred


U.S. Supreme Court - Reid v. Covert, 354 U.S. 1 (1957)

(The case here is about a woman who was accused of killing her husband who was in the armed forces, while they were stationed together overseas, and whether the executive agreement between the US and the foreign government overrode the trial rights of the accused afforded under the US Constitution, compared to the UCMJ. The court treated this executive agreement as a ratified treaty for this case.)

[snip]


II.

At the time of Mrs. Covert's alleged offense, an executive agreement was in effect between the United States and Great Britain which permitted United States' military courts to exercise exclusive jurisdiction over offenses committed in Great Britain by American servicemen or their dependents. 29 For its part, the United States agreed that these military courts would be willing and able to try and to punish all offenses against the laws of Great Britain by such persons. In all material respects, the same situation existed in Japan when Mrs. Smith [354 U.S. 1, 16] killed her husband. 30 Even though a court-martial does not give an accused trial by jury and other Bill of Rights protections, the Government contends that Art. 2 (11) of the UCMJ, insofar as it provides for the military trial of dependents accompanying the armed forces in Great Britain and Japan, can be sustained as legislation which is necessary and proper to carry out the United States' obligations under the international agreements made with those countries. The obvious and decisive answer to this, of course, is that no agreement with a foreign nation can confer power on the Congress, or on any other branch of Government, which is free from the restraints of the Constitution.

Article VI, the Supremacy Clause of the Constitution, declares:
"This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land;... ."

There is nothing in this language which intimates that treaties and laws enacted pursuant to them do not have to comply with the provisions of the Constitution. Nor is there anything in the debates which accompanied the drafting and ratification of the Constitution which even suggests such a result. These debates as well as the history that surrounds the adoption of the treaty provision in Article VI make it clear that the reason treaties were not limited to those made in "pursuance" of the Constitution was so that agreements made by the United States under the Articles of Confederation, including the important peace treaties which concluded the Revolutionary [354 U.S. 1, 17] War, would remain in effect. 31 It would be manifestly contrary to the objectives of those who created the Constitution, as well as those who were responsible for the Bill of Rights — let alone alien to our entire constitutional history and tradition — to construe Article VI as permitting the United States to exercise power under an international agreement without observing constitutional prohibitions. 32 In effect, such construction would permit amendment of that document in a manner not sanctioned by Article V. The prohibitions of the Constitution were designed to apply to all branches of the National Government and they cannot be nullified by the Executive or by the Executive and the Senate combined.
 

dudeman351

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2012
Messages
15
Location
Apopka Florida
I wrote to my rep and both senators. I actually got a good reply from Congresswoman Sandy Adams. District 24 of Florida

Congress of the United States, House of Representatives, Washington, DC 20515
adams.house.gov 216 Cannon House Office Building
(202) 225-2706

July 11, 2012


Dear Louis:

Thank you for contacting me regarding the UN Small Arms Treaty.

As you are aware, this treaty would apply international gun control standards on Americans. The Second Amendment to the United States Constitution states, "A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed." The meaning of this amendment seems very clear to me, and to the United States Supreme Court, that Congress shall not infringe on the individual right of the people to own firearms.

Although there are many opinions offered about this constitutional right, the fact remains the founders of our republic intended for people to protect themselves from the threat of government oppression and intrusion. The Second Amendment enshrines in the social conscience of our nation the most basic of individual rights, to have the means and opportunity to protect yourself and your property from those who would do you harm, or who wish to take away your rights and liberties.

I would like you to know, while the Obama Administration announced in May 2011 its support for the UN Small Arms Trade Treaty, I am very cognizant of its potential effect on our Second Amendment rights. Rest assured, as your representative in Congress, I will continue to be an advocate for the right of the people to keep and bear arms, just as the founders intended.

Thank you again for contacting me; it is a privilege and a pleasure to serve you. Should you need anything, please do not hesitate to contact my office. For more information, or to stay informed on important issues, I encourage you to sign up for my electronic newsletter at http://adams.house.gov.




Sincerely,
(signed)
Sandy Adams
Member of Congress


I'm glad I voted for her in 2010 and I will vote for her again this year. People like Rep Adams are the people we NEED in congress.
 

Gil223

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Jan 5, 2012
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Weber County Utah
I too have contacted my Reps and Senators. I do so on every issue with which I have any concerns, and without fail I get replies from them all, although never as casual and personalized as the one received by dudeman. Here's what I get from Senator Orrin Hatch's office...
Thank you for contacting me. I appreciate the time you took to express your views on the important issues facing our nation. It is important to me to hear your thoughts, so I can better represent you in the United States Senate. I will keep your thoughts in mind as my colleagues and I debate crucial economic, domestic, and foreign policy issues.

As you might expect, I receive a large volume of correspondence. I want to assure you that I will respond to your specific concerns as quickly as possible.
The initial reply goes on to explain that it "is an automated response", as it always does. Very impersonal... almost to the point of withdrawn. As robotic as the initial reply sounds, Senator Hatch (more likely a Hatch staff member, over Hatch's signature) invariably replies in a professional, detailed manner (probably "boilerplate" approved by Hatch) - indicating that somebody in D.C. is actually reading and paying attention to the concerns of the politician's constituency. Unfortunately, we can't "bet the farm" that it was the person who actually has the power and casts the votes. It's all smoke and mirrors. :( Pax...
 

Beretta92FSLady

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Dec 14, 2009
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I sleep well every night because I have made my peace, and I am prepared to do my best to defend myself and my family..the rest is out of my hands. As for the UN, Im watching this very closely, but i will say regardless of what uniform you are wearing if you want my guns come get them, because by the time you take them they will be no good to me anymore.

I will make you a deal, the first UN-boot that steps off the chopper to invade the U.S., I will...well, let's just say I wouldn't want to be the poor suckers stepping off the chopper to invade. Because I don't know about anyone else here, but the second that happens, all other political issues are pushed to the side, and aiding in stopping the invasion becomes my number one priority.
 
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Trip20

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Nov 16, 2006
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526
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Wausau Area
I will make you a deal, the first UN-boot that steps off the chopper to invade the U.S., I will...well, let's just say I wouldn't want to be the poor suckers stepping off the chopper to invade. Because I don't know about anyone else here, but the second that happens, all other political issues are pushed to the side, and aiding in stopping the invasion becomes my number one priority.

Therein lies the problem. No one will get off their keister until they see a reenactment of Red Dawn in their backyard. The threat will not come in the form of choppers, foreign dressed jackboot thugs...etc. The threat will come in the form of federal and state level elected officials ratifying treaties, passing laws, and creating agencies to swiftly enforce those laws.

If one were to take on the gargantuan task of revamping a Constitutional Republic, it only makes sense that an endeavor of this magnitude would be implemented in a phased approach with much smaller supporting tasks/goals. Maybe they'd take the form of a small arms treaty. Maybe they'd take the form of the U.N. itself.

Nonetheless... Those that cry fowl of those happenings are labeled conspiracy theorists, alarmists, drum beaters. It is the way of things.
 

The Airframer

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Mar 3, 2012
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Location
Virginia Beach
Nonetheless... Those that cry fowl of those happenings are labeled conspiracy theorists, alarmists, drum beaters. It is the way of things.

It's a shame that the media isn't touching the ATT. I've asked several people if they have heard about it and what they know about it and all too often, people are clueless to what is going on right now. They give me that conspiracy theorist response and label me as paranoid when I encourage them to do a little research. It's amazing how many people are unaware of our Second Amendment rights being debated and dissected by foreign "Allies" and liberal scoundrels. We won't see it on the news until it's too late.
 

Beretta92FSLady

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Dec 14, 2009
Messages
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Therein lies the problem. No one will get off their keister until they see a reenactment of Red Dawn in their backyard. The threat will not come in the form of choppers, foreign dressed jackboot thugs...etc. The threat will come in the form of federal and state level elected officials ratifying treaties, passing laws, and creating agencies to swiftly enforce those laws.

If one were to take on the gargantuan task of revamping a Constitutional Republic, it only makes sense that an endeavor of this magnitude would be implemented in a phased approach with much smaller supporting tasks/goals. Maybe they'd take the form of a small arms treaty. Maybe they'd take the form of the U.N. itself.

Nonetheless... Those that cry fowl of those happenings are labeled conspiracy theorists, alarmists, drum beaters. It is the way of things.

Basically, you have no control...I agree. Just enjoy your life, and let the Government do whatever it's going to do.
 

scott58dh

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Oct 16, 2011
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why?
Therein lies the problem. No one will get off their keister until they see a reenactment of Red Dawn in their backyard. The threat will not come in the form of choppers, foreign dressed jackboot thugs...etc. The threat will come in the form of federal and state level elected officials ratifying treaties, passing laws, and creating agencies to swiftly enforce those laws.

If one were to take on the gargantuan task of revamping a Constitutional Republic, it only makes sense that an endeavor of this magnitude would be implemented in a phased approach with much smaller supporting tasks/goals. Maybe they'd take the form of a small arms treaty. Maybe they'd take the form of the U.N. itself.

Nonetheless... Those that cry fowl of those happenings are labeled conspiracy theorists, alarmists, drum beaters. It is the way of things.

This is a step in the right direction. If WE do our part, one step at a time then things will start to add up, as a Group effort.

Link;:arrow:>>>http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/showthread.php?104669-E-Mail-Your-Senators-About-U-N-Arms-Trade-Treaty
 

Gil223

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Jan 5, 2012
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