CCH Charge While OC'ing

imported post

wow, i can tell this one is going to go on for quite a while.

im so glad i have a CCH permit............ :?

imported post

BRobb19 wrote:

im so glad i have a CCH permit............ :?

Click to expand...

I have one as well but that's not the point.

imported post

I have a real question, no bullstuff. If I am in my car and open carry at my right kidney, that would be out of sight. When the LEO approaches and I say "I have a weapon". Is it still concealed?

imported post

2offroad wrote:

I have a real question, no bullstuff. If I am in my car and open carry at my right kidney, that would be out of sight. When the LEO approaches and I say "I have a weapon". Is it still concealed?

Click to expand...

Good question. Does informing relieve you of having it in plain sight?

imported post

glock30 wrote:

Good question. Does informing relieve you of having it in plain sight?

Click to expand...

IANAL: But I don't think so. In plain sight is in plain sight. simpyl telling an officer that one is under your coat doesn't suddenly make it "in plain sight" - but it might be exculpatory at your tiral, i.e. that you had no intent to "conceal" its presence...

I have a real question, no bullstuff. If I am in my car and open carry at my right kidney, that would be out of sight. When the LEO approaches and I say "I have a weapon". Is it still concealed

Click to expand...

Ask six guys on here and you will get six different answers. Personally, I would say no, because while you are in the car, it is not in "plain view."

Just my $.02

imported post

partemisio wrote:

My police department considers it concealed if they can not see it from a full 360* view.

Click to expand...

What's the legal standard of concealed in NC? I bet its somthing like "concealed from ordinary observation."

Ordinarily, nobody can see what you are doing inside your car till they get right up on the car and look in.

Ordinarily, even someone on foot is not going to be displaying their gun visible 360 degrees around them.

imported post

There's a simple solution for all of the OC'er's who do not have a CCH permit.

If you get pulled over, simply take the handgun AS you are pulling your car towards the side of the road and place it atop of your dashboard in plain view. That way, there is no debating whether it is concealed on your hip, or concealed on your passenger seat while obscured behind the center console, or whatever else you might deem arguable.

This is useful for those of you who just love to argue and will respond with things like "well what if he doesn't notice it there at first then that means its concealed on your dashboard" or "what if his eyes are closed- then its not openly in plain sight to him!".

The slightest amount of common sense will tell you that most likely no police officer or other human being is going to be able to see the handgun that is clipped to your hip while they are standing outside of your vehicle. If you have the common sense to realize this, then you should have the common sense to realize that you have to do something about it so that you aren't concealing your handgun to them.

In response to this, some of you are thinking something like, "Well if I'm walking down the street, and a LEO is sitting on a bench to my left side, and I have a gun strapped to my right side, then even that would be concealed to him since he can't see it!" The difference that separates the officer sitting on the bench as you walk by from the officer who just pulled you over that is walking up to your car is quite simply a legal term that is called "being approached by a law enforcement officer in an official manner".

While walking down the street past the officer, you are not being approached in any official manner by that officer, and therefore you have no responsibility to care whether or not they notice your openly carried sidearm. While sitting in your car being pulled over by an officer, you are "being approached by a law enforcement officer in an official manner", and therefore it IS your responsibility to care whether or not they notice your sidearm.

I can tell that this thread is going to go on for a LONG time.

imported post

This whole story sounds like just another instructor trying to discourage open carry.

The police as a rule don't care for open carry and will also attempt to bully you into not doing it again. If you are not willing to study the law, challenge unlawful police intimidation and ignore some of the ignorant instructors THEN OPEN CARRY IS NOT THE BEST OPTION FOR YOU.

EXBIT (A)

Fuquay Varina police will tell you it's illegal.

Cary police will threaten you with arrest.

One local instructor in Fuquay is basically teaching that "open carry is illegal because the police chief said so."

imported post

How about a better solution to this problem, how about if everyone who wants to be open carrying in vehicles or in public places just go down to their local sheriff's office and apply for their CCW permit. Then all of this debating over whether or not a person is concealing or plain view would not be of existence......

imported post

Wrong!

How about we get LEO's up to speed on what is legal and what is not. I will not sacrifice one of my liberty's for the sake of convenience.



Mr. Glock wrote:

How about a better solution to this problem, how about if everyone who wants to be open carrying in vehicles or in public places just go down to their local sheriff's office and apply for their CCW permit. Then all of this debating over whether or not a person is concealing or plain view would not be of existence......

Click to expand...

imported post

Easier solution....

Make a SS card a valid CC permit by default, then all americans are covered from birth.
You wouldn't need to worry about registration of guns, since you already have the carry permit.
You aren't singled out because all citizens have the card.
If BHO tries to take away your SS the liberal left would sceam murder.

There is no draw back, might need a system for green card holders, but that
is a very small percentage of people that can be worked out, just treat green cards
the same way.

imported post

SlackwareRobert wrote:

Easier solution....

Make a SS card a valid CC permit by default, then all americans are covered from birth.
You wouldn't need to worry about registration of guns, since you already have the carry permit.
You aren't singled out because all citizens have the card.
If BHO tries to take away your SS the liberal left would sceam murder.

There is no draw back, might need a system for green card holders, but that
is a very small percentage of people that can be worked out, just treat green cards
the same way.

Click to expand...

Lol!

imported post

Just for S 'n Giggles: Can anyone tell me where in any car is a spot where a firearm would be visible from a full 360 degrees, particularly when being approached from the rear? Please remind all local LEO's that there job is to enforce the law, not interpret it.

imported post

.40 Cal wrote:

Just for S 'n Giggles: Can anyone tell me where in any car is a spot where a firearm would be visible from a full 360 degrees, particularly when being approached from the rear? Please remind all local LEO's that there job is to enforce the law, not interpret it.

Click to expand...

On the roof. I have a sunroof, so I supposed I could put a holster up there so if I get pulled over, I could reach up and slip my pistol in there.

imported post

gutshot wrote:

DreQo wrote:

.40 Cal wrote:

Just for S 'n Giggles: Can anyone tell me where in any car is a spot where a firearm would be visible from a full 360 degrees, particularly when being approached from the rear? Please remind all local LEO's that there job is to enforce the law, not interpret it.

Click to expand...

On the roof. I have a sunroof, so I supposed I could put a holster up there so if I get pulled over, I could reach up and slip my pistol in there.

Click to expand...

No, that's no good either. If the cop crawled under the car it would still be concealed to him.

Click to expand...

Crap you're right. I guess we have to carry our guns ON the cops! lol

imported post

Your making things to complicated, just put a gun on every side of the car.
Have never heard them claim the "same" gun must be visible. Just the gun.:what:

How about a painting of a gun on the doors so you can see it from the outside?
Course you won't be able to pick up your child in school anymore.:banghead:

imported post

Dummy cord it to the officer.

imported post

partemisio wrote:

glock30 wrote:

partemisio wrote:

My police department considers it concealed if they can not see it from a full 360* view. That doesn't mean my department will charge somebody though. In most cases after they check out the entire situation, they will warn to keep it somewhere else(most say on the dash).

Click to expand...

I'd love the chance to try my very expensive lawyer on this. I imagine we could make it very expensive for your police department as well as start someone off on a new career path.

Click to expand...

Read the second paragraph in my edited post above as well as the rest of that post where I said "That doesn't mean my department will charge somebody though. In most cases after they check out the entire situation, they will warn to keep it somewhere else(most say on the dash)."

And if you just want to throw money around(and don't have a ccw), be my guest and come get pulled over like that and get them to charge you for it by doing something stupid while pulled over. I would love to see the outcome. I would imagine they could make you spend your money on that expensive lawyer and some of your "free time" in cuffs.

Click to expand...

Your entire department needs to get educated. Your job is to enforce the law, not to write it as you see fit.

LEO cannot continue to intimidate citizens by warning them of a crime that haven't committed.

"I will let you go this time, but next time you better have a CCH permit"....WTF!!:cuss:

I carry a gun because a cop is too heavy.

My 2A right and the laws of this state say that I do NOT have to have a CCH permit to have a firearm with me. LEO want to charge people with terror to the public and BS concealed charges (or at least threaten with it) and it is sad.

I am tired of hearing people whine and say "just get a CCH permit and you won't have to worry". I don't have to have a CCH permit to carry my gun, and that is STATE LAW!!!:banghead:

If your department ever charges someone for concealing a handgun and it is on the passengers seat, I hope you guys have other skill sets because you will be looking for new jobs.

I have the utmost respect for police, and I have always been and will always be polite and kind to them. They have tough jobs and I don't envy them. This is just one time that you and your department are wrong.

imported post

Maybe I'm being ridiculous but to me, "concealed" has everything to do with intent. I would not charge someone with misdemeanor CCW if they have their Glock sitting on their black leather passenger seat. If he has it in the center console or stuffed between the seats, it's concealed. Either way, I always tell an officer that I have a weapon in the car unless it's in the trunk.