Open Carry Protest at Arts Beats And Eats?

Small Arms Collector said:

Nothing really organized, just show up, and mil around, maybe listen to the music, the protest is simply being there, the goal being simply to show witz, and l brooks patterson that they can't push us around, and educate the public that were just normal people.

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Bailenforcer said:

I am not getting your point here. Is this some personal war against Jon Witz? You keep pointing him out in both of your posts as if you have some personal grudge against him that has nothing to do with open carry. You just joined this site and the only 2 posts are Jon Witz bashing posts and some crazy sounding call to arms psychobabble. He lost we won PERIOD! So why all the hate words, and foul language? I suspect there is something very personal between you and Jon Witz going on here that has nothing to do with open carry. You are sounding like some agent provocateur. Yes I said it! I find it odd that in all the forums that I have built, ran, and manage for others, I have yet to see someone come in and in and instantly start a hate campaign unless he had deep personal issues with the target mentioned, or an agent provocateur. Frankly you are starting to worry me that you might be that idiot who in Warren Michigan promotes the idea that all gun owners should be killed. Your writing echos his mentality, and writing style. Yes I am calling you out! I know you are not what you claim to be, whatever that is. I don't subscribe to a commando mentality when we are winning our arguments, and I don't think you are as pro open carry as your promote yourself as. If this upsets you then so be it, your tactics smell fishy. Why did you post in the Ohio forum asking for help? This is weird, are you Timothy Alan Campbell?

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Bailenforcer said:

In the Ohio threads he is calling for people with rifles to show up. Please do not show up with long guns at AB&E this is a bit odd for someone to join the site and suddenly call to arms in his only two posts.

http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/s...chigan-needs-your-help.&p=1342833#post1342833

I just rated both of his threads as terrible.

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dougwg said:

You guys need to stop with the conspiracy theory also.

Small Arms Collector (S_A_C) has been around for awhile, albeit on other message boards.

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Small Arms Collector said:

No, I am not, I cross posted because I'm trying to create the largest turn out possible, and yes I suppose that I am taking it kind of personal with witz, he pissed me off, so "ruining" his event from his perspective makes me smile personally, however that does not change the fact that a gathering even informal in an event with as many people, and as well covered/known as this one would be a net positive in my view, a very large number of people would see us, and see that we are not dangerous, and are just like them, is that not the goal? All I'm planning is showing up Friday before 5PM, wandering through for awhile, maybe stop, and listen to some music, then go home, and that's all I'm trying to encourage others to do, I'm sorry if I fail at bringing that across.

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eastmeyers said:

Us?
First of, you are either a troll, or someone with issues. Your first and second posts on this forum are, "protests", and advocating "long gun carry". Dude you are NOT one of us. If you were, you would have introduced yourself, you are obviously one of the fallowing:
1 - Member of the media who wants "gun nuts" to show up to ABE so you have a "story"
2 - An "Anti" 2nd ammendment supporter, and wants a bunch of people to show up, and piss people off so you and the other "anti's" have fuel to goto Lansing, and HELP Witz change the laws
3 - Just a completely retarted troll
4 - All of the above.

I am going with #4. So please troll just go home. Go back under your rock. You are not one of us. If you were, you would have joined the forum before now, you would have posted in the ABE thread, you would have shown your support when it mattered. We already won. What you are doing is trying to stir controversy. That is it. Their are legal routes to go after Witz, and Royal Oak, wrighting our reps and other things, not what you are doing.

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detroit_fan said:

You guys are giving people crap about OC'ing long guns, I'm assuming that's because you don't think it casts OC in a positive light and works against the cause?

There are tons of gun owners and people with cpl's that feel OC of a handgun portrays guns in a negative light and works against the cause.

What is the difference in these two? They are both legal actions, why do some of you defend one but not the other?



I"M NOT ENCOURAGING LONG GUN CARRY TO ABE!!!!

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Jerbear1098 said:

Two thumbs up.....

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Small Arms Collector said:

Same here, I know it's more "aggressive", but I don't really see a difference, if someone doesn't have a pistol, or is from out of state what other option do they have?, I was just putting it out there as an Option in Ohio, for the non CCW holders who wanted to come, I never told them they should do it, and I didn't suggest it, I just put it out there as an option, and showed that yes indeed it was legal if they wanted to do it, and I used Lansing as an example. As you know you have to register pistols in Michigan, and if you don't live in Michigan you cant, so the only way an Ohio resident could carry a pistol here, concealed, or not is if they have an Ohio CCW as there is an exception for CCW holders, but if they don't have a CCW than what option do they have?

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Small Arms Collector said:

I never had a reason to join before now, if you guys think I'm something I'm not fine, we'll see Saturday when I post my video of my trip.

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PDinDetroit said:

S_A_C - Welcome to OCDO.

As has been stated here, I believe there is no reason to protest at ABE right now and to do so would be counterproductive to our efforts. The main objective was to get the contract provision changed. This has been accomplished. We were professional, polite, firm, and backed by LAWS/FACTS in our efforts. Our conduct for this effort has truly been unassailable, leaving only emotional arguments to be made.

I am not happy with certain things also. The City and Jon Witz had to be dragged "kicking and screaming" to remove the unlawful provision. The City passed a resolution in an attempt to usurp power and ban firearms from Public Buildings. The media attempted to spin the issue as about Open Carry instead No Firearms. Jon Witz is actively working against our rights in an attempt to create a new PFZ for festivals. The ABE Open Carry Alcohol Zone actively violates People's Rights, MI Laws, and Royal Oak Ordinance Provisions. I fought for rights that I myself will not be able to exercise due to recent surgery.

The effort now is to come together to defend rights and remove/alter the LAWS/ORDINANCES that undermine them. PERIOD.

To this end, I created the first of what I hope to be regular Open Letters to the MI Legislators that WE ALL will participate in creating. This Open Letter is posted here on OCDO and MGO as a separate thread and directly attacks the City and ABE's roles/position in the situation. I hope this effort has laid the foundation for further efforts to be built on. These actions are where we focus efforts, with the Lawmakers that can ACTUALLY CHANGE THINGS FOR THE BETTER.

I strongly encourage people to treat the ABE Festival just as they would any other day - carry on as you determine the best method of doing so.

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eastmeyers said:

You never had a reason? Really? How about to show your support when it mattered the most, when we were facing the Royal Oak city commission? Yeah how about that? Did you goto the meetings? I did, 3 of 4. I went to the first, second, and forth meetings. I don't rememeber meeting anyone who said their s/n was S_A_C, thats becasue I didn't. So yeah, you would of had a reason to join before IF you were one of US! Not now just to be a TROLL!

TROLL

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Bronson said:

I wasn't at any of the meetings, am I a troll?

Could it be possible that the publicity from the ABE affair piqued the interest of a fellow gun owner who has never considered open carry but realizes the fight was about more than that?

Way to welcome the possible new folks.

Bronson

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