Then shoot me... If I'm stealing your money by threat of force then shoot me...

[EMNofSeattle]

Finally, Iv'e answered the point of your point of the thread. I have no intentions of taking anything from anyone because I willingly pay taxes by living in my state/country. In fact, I pay more in taxes then alot of guys make (per week) and I'm ok with that. I've accepted that to enjoy the many many freedoms I get, I have to pay something into it. Freedom isn't free....

No, no, no, true freedom is being illiterate living in a mudhut cooking your food with a dung fire and having access to plenty of weapons to protect yourself from roaming banditos, and the wealthy can live in oceanreef while you are in your mudhut. Anything else is pure statism and you hate freedom you filthy commie.
:lol:

 

[stealthyeliminator]

Only to the extent that you could argue that any tax anyone pays is a tax on all activities in which they participate. meh.

Taxes are necessary. There are functions of government that are necessary and must be funded.

While I agree that the feds do way too much (most should not be done at all by any level of government, but quite a bit of it is appropriate for local and State governments), they need to tax to fund what they should do. So the questions are only what kind of tax, and at what level, not whether there should be taxes.


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<o>

Necessity isn't moral justification

Much evil has been done in the name of utility

 

[Primus]

No, no, no, true freedom is being illiterate living in a mudhut cooking your food with a dung fire and having access to plenty of weapons to protect yourself from roaming banditos, and the wealthy can live in oceanreef while you are in your mudhut. Anything else is pure statism and you hate freedom you filthy commie.
:lol:

You got me. You figured me all out. :lol:

 

[Fuller Malarkey]

Why are you so terrified of the .gov? We can't make you any less paranoid or fearful. You see the threat of force in EVERYTHING. No matter how many examples we give, you just keep going back to it.

The taxes thing... I already showed examples of dudes owing thousands (hundreds) of dollars and NEVER GETTING SHOT and only sometimes ARRESTED.

Just be a soverign citizen. Refuse to register your car, refuse to pay taxes, refuse to educate your kids, refuse to buy insurance. Hang a little cardboard sign on your rear window, and then when you get pulled over for it go ahead and get rowdy. That my friend is when you will unfortunately see force applied. Just do everyone else a favor and don't get anyone else hurt with your paranoid delusions, to include your family if all possible. So leave your children at home and the wife and take back your money as others have said on here.

I'll cut to the end. You'll lose. You will be hurt at the very least. You can instead do like the other 99% of intelligent guys on here and focus on voting or participating in the political process to actually PEACEFULLY change things. That way you'll not be just chalked up as another guy who went nuts and accomplished nothing. Instead you can be part of a group that actually gets back rights and helps everyone.

Isn't promoting or encouraging illegal activity a violation of forum protocol? This is the second time I've found this poster inciting illegal activities, the other taunting a new member to shoot at police officers.

 

[eye95]

Swapping one tax for another does nothing and will do nothing starve the beast.

Functions of a government being necessary, who decides this?

The functions of a minarchist government even one by the founders could easily be funded without anything more than a 2% tariff.

Starving the beast is a different battle from the one that the Fair Tax is designed to fight. One can be for BOTH goals.

As far as the feds go, that was decided by the States and the People late in the 18th century. As far as State and local governments, they can spend on whatever the People will tolerate them spending on. If you don't like the spending in your town or State, vote with your feet.


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<o>

 

[Primus]

Isn't promoting or encouraging illegal activity a violation of forum protocol? This is the second time I've found this poster inciting illegal activities, the other taunting a new member to shoot at police officers.

No sir, it was not. Since this is not a Diplomatic agency, we do not have or observe protocols. http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Protocal

We instead have forum rules. Yes it may be interpreted as an infraction of said rules, possibly. If it is I have no qualms with the Mods taking that post out.

To me it was more if a suggestion on how the Sovereign Citizen movement works and he could comply with their ideals and their actions.

As far as the shooting of LEOs, sure I said it because again the other poster said "that would be a perfect case to use deadly force since you can't call the police to stop the police". Since he originated the idea, I guess we may have been both in violation of said rule. Not sure anyone else is keeping track besides yourself though.

 

[Fuller Malarkey]

No sir, it was not. Since this is not a Diplomatic agency, we do not have or observe protocols. http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Protocal

We instead have forum rules. Yes it may be interpreted as an infraction of said rules, possibly. If it is I have no qualms with the Mods taking that post out.

To me it was more if a suggestion on how the Sovereign Citizen movement works and he could comply with their ideals and their actions.

As far as the shooting of LEOs, sure I said it because again the other poster said "that would be a perfect case to use deadly force since you can't call the police to stop the police". Since he originated the idea, I guess we may have been both in violation of said rule. Not sure anyone else is keeping track besides yourself though.

I'm sure that will be overlooked because you are special.

 

[Primus]

I'm sure that will be overlooked because you are special.

Only to you apparently. No one else (especially myself) sees me as being "special" at least not in any type of good way. My wife calls me special on occasion but I'm pretty certain it's not in a positive manner. :lol:

I openly stated I have no qualms if they want to delete a post they feel is crossing the line. I'm not a poster who will get extremely upset if something is deleted.

 

[Freedom1Man]

Starving the beast is a different battle from the one that the Fair Tax is designed to fight. One can be for BOTH goals.

As far as the feds go, that was decided by the States and the People late in the 18th century. As far as State and local governments, they can spend on whatever the People will tolerate them spending on. If you don't like the spending in your town or State, vote with your feet.


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<o>

I really don't think very highly of people who run out and claim that we need to change the law, when they have never read the current law.

Please explain how the "Fair Tax" would be constitutional and please explain how the current law is unconstitutional.

Also please explain how the "fair tax" would end the IRS.


You sound like the anti-gun crowd. You want changes without knowing anything about that which you are demanding change.

Exactly what taxes are abolished?

The FairTax is replacement, not reform. It replaces federal income taxes including personal, estate, gift, capital gains, alternative minimum, Social Security, Medicare, self-employment, and corporate taxes

I see now, you're a socialist. The "fair tax" is just a way to promote socialism.

 

[sudden valley gunner]

I was attempting to discern the old post from the new post but it's all in blue. I was able to gather you avoided coming up with a method for roads to be made, you just said private roads get made. You didn't even answer the idea that the roads would be PRIVATE, or answer my premise that if it was private then who drive on it?

LOL...yes I did, in many posts, I even told you what I feel about the gas tax. Like another poster mentioned you seem to be stuck on a 5th grade level of argument.

I wasn't ignoring your argument about taxes being taken with force. I refuted it in a few words in a very short sentence, you refuted by saying you don't WANT to do that. One more time for the others reading....

No one forces you to live where you live or work at your job. You voluntarily CHOOSE (key word) to work there and live in that town, county, state, country. You could easily live in another town, county, state, or country to determine exactly how many taxes you want to pay or none. Also, you would have to recind your citzenship as someone pointed out.

I know, it seems like a crazy idea and you'll say "if I have to leave then it's not liberty". My friend, that's exactly what liberty is, the ability to say NO right? So say NO to living there and move. Say NO to an income tax and leave the country. No one will stop you at the border. You are FREE to leave. That is my premise that you knowingly CHOOSE to reside in this wonderful country and the state you live in. Yes you were born their against your will, but your an adult and CHOOSE to stay there. You CHOOSE to accept that if you don't pay your taxes you may be "forcefully" incarcerated. Essentially your in a contract with the .gov.

refuted post #77 by Citizen

Finally, Iv'e answered the point of your point of the thread. I have no intentions of taking anything from anyone because I willingly pay taxes by living in my state/country. In fact, I pay more in taxes then alot of guys make (per week) and I'm ok with that. I've accepted that to enjoy the many many freedoms I get, I have to pay something into it. Freedom isn't free....

Like I said earlier you who live off of peoples taxes trying to justify the theft of it from others is like the wise guy telling the business owner he's extorting "protection money " from, "hey don't complain I gotta give some of this to the Don"

Oh god the freedom isn't free line....what a crock. Silly sophistry....if its not free then its not freedom.....it's that easy. Your statist propaganda don't mean a damn to me.

I have put a summation in post...#127 , you haven't countered anything.

 

[sudden valley gunner]

No, no, no, true freedom is being illiterate living in a mudhut cooking your food with a dung fire and having access to plenty of weapons to protect yourself from roaming banditos, and the wealthy can live in oceanreef while you are in your mudhut. Anything else is pure statism and you hate freedom you filthy commie.
:lol:

What pure drivel.

Your assumption that humans would have no drive to better their lives without government says more about you than the human race.

 

[sudden valley gunner]

Starving the beast is a different battle from the one that the Fair Tax is designed to fight. One can be for BOTH goals.

As far as the feds go, that was decided by the States and the People late in the 18th century. As far as State and local governments, they can spend on whatever the People will tolerate them spending on. If you don't like the spending in your town or State, vote with your feet.


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<o>

Id rather we just stop feeding the beast. All of it.

Isn't promoting or encouraging illegal activity a violation of forum protocol? This is the second time I've found this poster inciting illegal activities, the other taunting a new member to shoot at police officers.

He likes to make idiotic comments like this it's a poor debate tactic, similar to a elementary student "if you like peanut butter so much why don't you marry it".

 

[eye95]

Id rather we just stop feeding the beast. All of it...

I know that is your preference. However, the vast majority of people, including me and including the Founders and Framers, recognized the need for some amount of government and for taxing in some form to support it.

I have no respect for positions that do not recognize this reality and won't waste my time trying to convince the few who do not accept this reality of it.

Moving on.


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<o>

 

[eye95]

Isn't promoting or encouraging illegal activity a violation of forum protocol? This is the second time I've found this poster inciting illegal activities, the other taunting a new member to shoot at police officers.

He is being sarcastic. But I am sure you know that. It is obvious to everyone following the discussion.

If you think that he is violating forum rules, report him.

Geez, I thought you were talking about a certain CT troll until I tracked this link back.


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<o>

 

[WalkingWolf]

I know that is your preference. However, the vast majority of people, including me and including the Founders and Framers, recognized the need for some amount of government and for taxing in some form to support it.

I have no respect for positions that do not recognize this reality and won't waste my time trying to convince the few who do not accept this reality of it.

Moving on.


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<o>

They also recognized that part of their problem with the Crown was the oppressive use of taxes.

 

[eye95]

They also recognized that part of their problem with the Crown was the oppressive use of taxes.

Yes, they did. However, even they did not advocate the end of all taxes, regardless of form.

The first thing we need to do is to repeal the 16A. It is being used to more than just tax. It is being used to control us instead of us being in control. Do away with the income tax and the IRS first, and we have a shot at fixing the rest.


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<o>

 

[Freedom1Man]

Isn't promoting or encouraging illegal activity a violation of forum protocol? This is the second time I've found this poster inciting illegal activities, the other taunting a new member to shoot at police officers.

Cite the laws requiring a citizen to buy health insurance.
Prove that licensing for automobiles is not limited to commercial use same with registration of automobiles.

How is shooting someone is self defense, no matter what clothing they are wearing, an illegal activity?

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Cite the laws requiring a citizen to buy health insurance.
Prove that licensing for automobiles is not limited to commercial use same with registration of automobiles.

How is shooting someone is self defense, no matter what clothing they are wearing, an illegal activity?

QFR

just as a note to everyone, Mr. F1man believes that Washington is not an actual admitted state in the Union, he's claimed that the state's drivers licenses are invalid because the RCW says "driver's license" and the card issued by the DMV say Driver License...

Vehicles must be registered and titled in every state. this is so basic it should require no cite

 

[Primus]

QFR

just as a note to everyone, Mr. F1man believes that Washington is not an actual admitted state in the Union, he's claimed that the state's drivers licenses are invalid because the RCW says "driver's license" and the card issued by the DMV say Driver License...

Vehicles must be registered and titled in every state. this is so basic it should require no cite

Does that mean he isn't a citizen?

 

[marshaul]

IQ100-Q5 school of on-line posting rhetoric.

lol, yup.