CC-onlyers believe in brandishing as deterrence

[eye95]

Eye I would have to respectfully disagree. If I responded to a call that you "brandished " a firearm and held it down or at your leg and you could articulate (by speaking to me uh oh) that you felt threatened and you were trying to avoid a bad incident id thank you for your time tell you great job and leave. Just saying...

Also some states actually require you to point said firearm at person to be assault. So by that you could draw and hold by your leg and still deescalate/ make space.

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I don't care what you "would" do. I care what the law allows you to do, cuz some cop or prosecutor is gonna do it. I am not going to put my fate in the hands of what a cop says he "would" do.

If I don't see an imminent threat to life or limb, that gun stays put. I will not risk the charges that would result in conviction.

If I do see an imminent threat to life or limb, that gun is coming out, and I intend to fire it to stop that threat.

You will almost never be questioned for unholstering and not firing. Not so for non-LEOs. So please stop applying your standards for acting to us.

Moving on.

 

[WalkingWolf]

Eye I would have to respectfully disagree. If I responded to a call that you "brandished " a firearm and held it down or at your leg and you could articulate (by speaking to me uh oh) that you felt threatened and you were trying to avoid a bad incident id thank you for your time tell you great job and leave. Just saying...

Also some states actually require you to point said firearm at person to be assault. So by that you could draw and hold by your leg and still deescalate/ make space.

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Your killing me I tell ya, killing me. :lol:

Everytime I think you have hit bottom you dig even deeper. :lol:

It has happened many times that LAC brandishing EVEN IN HIS OWN GARAGE have been shot and killed by police.

Damn I am still laughing!

 

[Primus]

Your killing me I tell ya, killing me. :lol:

Everytime I think you have hit bottom you dig even deeper. :lol:

It has happened many times that LAC brandishing EVEN IN HIS OWN GARAGE have been shot and killed by police.

Damn I am still laughing!

Getting shot by police is not remotely what we were talking about. We were talking about a confrontation and a perceived threat and how to react. Period.

Can you cite any cases where a guy was charged and found guilty for brandishing self defense?


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[eye95]

Your killing me I tell ya, killing me. :lol:

Everytime I think you have hit bottom you dig even deeper. :lol:

It has happened many times that LAC brandishing EVEN IN HIS OWN GARAGE have been shot and killed by police.

Damn I am still laughing!

His statement about what he "would" do is reminiscent of Oberlin. One of the antis up there said that they should be able to leave their anti-park-carry ordinance on the books. They'd just promise not to enforce it.

I don't believe in cop-bashing, but knowing what some cops might do and will get away with doing, I won't trust any cop to do what he says he "would" do. I am responsible for protecting my legal ass. He ain't.

If I draw, that can be seen as deadly force. If deadly force is not authorized, I could go to jail, regardless of what one cop on a message board says he "would" do.

 

[WalkingWolf]

Getting shot by police is not remotely what we were talking about. We were talking about a confrontation and a perceived threat and how to react. Period.

Can you cite any cases where a guy was charged and found guilty for brandishing self defense?


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YOU were the one who brought up holding a gun while police arrived! Remember that Forest Gump quote?

Brandishing in NC IS GATTOP, there are a few cases. But the law says go about with a weapon terrorising the people. Which is exactly what pulling a gun on another person without a threat being present. And if there is an actual threat, the LAC would be an idiot not to stop it. If a LAC is just drawing because he wants to be prepared should a threat arise, that person would be an idiot.

Idiots should not carry guns or wear badges.

 

[sudden valley gunner]

I was doing nothing illegal walking down the street drinking a coffee on a pleasant summer day, heard someone yelling behind me turned around to see a Glock pointed at my face, I almost drew and fired.......the other guy was a cop.

 

[Primus]

YOU were the one who brought up holding a gun while police arrived! Remember that Forest Gump quote?

Brandishing in NC IS GATTOP, there are a few cases. But the law says go about with a weapon terrorising the people. Which is exactly what pulling a gun on another person without a threat being present. And if there is an actual threat, the LAC would be an idiot not to stop it. If a LAC is just drawing because he wants to be prepared should a threat arise, that person would be an idiot.

Idiots should not carry guns or wear badges.

Please quote where I mentioned holding a gun when the cops showed up? I'll patiently wait.

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[Primus]

His statement about what he "would" do is reminiscent of Oberlin. One of the antis up there said that they should be able to leave their anti-park-carry ordinance on the books. They'd just promise not to enforce it.

I don't believe in cop-bashing, but knowing what some cops might do and will get away with doing, I won't trust any cop to do what he says he "would" do. I am responsible for protecting my legal ass. He ain't.

If I draw, that can be seen as deadly force. If deadly force is not authorized, I could go to jail, regardless of what one cop on a message board says he "would" do.

Eye I'm sorry you feel that way. As I said check local law. I made that clear it may be legal or not depending on the circumstances. I also made it very clear that it may not be worth the risk of getting in trouble.

Again its just one more step to avoid the shoot. However you want to go about it is on you like you said.

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[WalkingWolf]

Eye I would have to respectfully disagree. If I responded to a call that you "brandished " a firearm and held it down or at your leg and you could articulate (by speaking to me uh oh) that you felt threatened and you were trying to avoid a bad incident id thank you for your time tell you great job and leave. Just saying...

Also some states actually require you to point said firearm at person to be assault. So by that you could draw and hold by your leg and still deescalate/ make space.

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Here ya go Forest...

 

[Primus]

Here ya go Forest...

Hey walking wolf look at word brandished.

Brandished means past tense.

Brandishing would be present tense. As in " if I showed up to a call and you were BRANDISHING...."

Please familiarize yourself with the English language and the use of tense which is used to denote a time period as in before during or after and incident.

In your haste to bash you usually miss the point or misread or miss a while post. This is twice in one thread you've done it.

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[WalkingWolf]

Hey walking wolf look at word brandished.

Brandished means past tense.

Brandishing would be present tense. As in " if I showed up to a call and you were BRANDISHING...."

Please familiarize yourself with the English language and the use of tense which is used to denote a time period as in before during or after and incident.

In your haste to bash you usually miss the point or misread or miss a while post. This is twice in one thread you've done it.

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Now you saying it is after the fact. :lol::lol::lol:

 

[WalkingWolf]

Gotta love the lack of competence of some police that they would harass a LAC for no other reason they are armed, yet the would allowing brandishing a firearm to terrorize the public, as long as it is not them.

 

[Rusty Young Man]

+1 If I have to draw the threat and elements of defensive force have already been met.

+1 The only possible escalation I may consider is the hand-on-the-grip but not yet drawing from the holster. By this point the situation has gone south DESPITE my openly carried firearm, which in and of itself should send a pretty clear warning to any would-be assailants.

OT: seems like the CC-only bunch would benefit from seeing how many OC-ers die here in AZ after losing the "element of surprise" they esteem so much.

 

[Primus]

Now you saying it is after the fact. :lol::lol::lol:

Umm... yea? Hence the reason I used brandished in the first post. I can try to teach you the language but I can't fix stupid I'm sorry.

Listen I get it. You have rep with the guys on this forum and you be been around a while. You clearly are not completely stupid since others have quoted you as being smart or knowledgeable about something.

But this personal attack thing is getting lame. I've asked you repeatedly to knock it off. I understand its the internet so you can say anything you want and not fear repercussions but it shouldn't be a license to be an a**.

You've gone out of your way to bash me or try and assassinate my character at every turn. When called out on it you've just said you don't like me. So be it. But this thread is one of many examples where even I'm being respectful and reasonable and talking to OTHER guys you feel the need to jump in and make false accusations.

For the other readers... its clear I said brandished and meant in the past. Not one other one poster has even put the word police and guns together in the same post.

Finally I apologize to the moderators for detracting from the thread to address this person but its going too far.

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[WalkingWolf]

Umm... yea? Hence the reason I used brandished in the first post. I can try to teach you the language but I can't fix stupid I'm sorry.

Listen I get it. You have rep with the guys on this forum and you be been around a while. You clearly are not completely stupid since others have quoted you as being smart or knowledgeable about something.

But this personal attack thing is getting lame. I've asked you repeatedly to knock it off. I understand its the internet so you can say anything you want and not fear repercussions but it shouldn't be a license to be an a**.

You've gone out of your way to bash me or try and assassinate my character at every turn. When called out on it you've just said you don't like me. So be it. But this thread is one of many examples where even I'm being respectful and reasonable and talking to OTHER guys you feel the need to jump in and make false accusations.

For the other readers... its clear I said brandished and meant in the past. Not one other one poster has even put the word police and guns together in the same post.

Finally I apologize to the moderators for detracting from the thread to address this person but its going too far.

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It can be taken either in the present or past tense. The point is YOU brought it up, it was a less than intelligent post, because we all know what has happened to armed citizens when the police roll up. Hell some not even a gun, one man shot for having a electric drill in his car in NYC. 9 bystanders shot in NYC not even armed. A one armed, one legged man in a wheel chair with a PEN. A unarmed sleeping woman in a jeep in VA.

A person would have to be an idiot to have a hand on a gun or anywhere near a gun unless there is clear case of self defense. And if there is a person would be a idiot not to stop the threat.

I keep hoping that evolution will remove idiots from society.

 

[Primus]

It can be taken either in the present or past tense. The point is YOU brought it up, it was a less than intelligent post, because we all know what has happened to armed citizens when the police roll up. Hell some not even a gun, one man shot for having a electric drill in his car in NYC. 9 bystanders shot in NYC not even armed. A one armed, one legged man in a wheel chair with a PEN. A unarmed sleeping woman in a jeep in VA.

A person would have to be an idiot to have a hand on a gun or anywhere near a gun unless there is clear case of self defense. And if there is a person would be a idiot not to stop the threat.

I keep hoping that evolution will remove idiots from society.

?? How is brandished used in present tense? Please explain.

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[WalkingWolf]

?? How is brandished used in present tense? Please explain.

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Inquest hearing

Coroner~~Officer nimwit why did you shoot the corpse?

Officer Nimwit~~Coroner he brandished a firearm.

The only way brandishing is present is if it is present. If you indeed did pull up to a scene of a man holding a gun it would be described as "He brandished" or "He was brandishing"

"I saw the man eating"

"I saw the man eat"

It is not rocket surgery. I took it to claim that you would rolled up on a man holding a gun NOT shoot him. When all the evidence is to the contrary. Because you got caught again with your pants down does not change your claim.

I once had a defense attorney try to be stupid, playing with words by try to change the meaning because it did not bode their case well. The judge admonished him for it.

I used "I rolled to a stop" Defense attorney "How can you roll and stop at the same time" Judge "Approach the bench counsel" defense attorney "question withdrawn".

If it was past tense there are only two ways you would know 1~The person that brandished admitted it. 2~The other person makes the claim.

If it is the first person he is an idiot for talking to the police without a attorney. If it is the second person who may be a criminal, YOU are going to take his word?

Again I repeat idiots should not carry guns or badges.

 

[acmariner99]

If I have to draw, legally speaking the conditions for the use of deadly force need to be met. This isn't the movies where a situation slowly evolves to a climax - in the situations I have been in where I was glad I was armed, I had only a matter of a couple of seconds to decide whether to use force or not. (I am also reasonably sure that my OCing in those instances helped prevent those situations from escalating further).

Some states like Arizona have a so-called "defensive display" law allowing you to indicate you are armed if you reasonably believe there is an imminent threat, but most states don't have that luxury. Pointing a weapon at someone is a crime as is in many places simply having the weapon in your hand without cause.

 

[Primus]

Inquest hearing

Coroner~~Officer nimwit why did you shoot the corpse?

Officer Nimwit~~Coroner he brandished a firearm.

The only way brandishing is present is if it is present. If you indeed did pull up to a scene of a man holding a gun it would be described as "He brandished" or "He was brandishing"

"I saw the man eating"

"I saw the man eat"

It is not rocket surgery. I took it to claim that you would rolled up on a man holding a gun NOT shoot him. When all the evidence is to the contrary. Because you got caught again with your pants down does not change your claim.

Wolf really? Someone else please correct him on the tense thing.....

I was using myself in the present by saying "if i rolled up....." in the scenario and the firearm brandished in the past tense. Why is this so complicated?

You proved my point every time you just used it was in the past tense telling a story of what happened in the past. You really can't admit you were wrong. Wow. Its not often you see a guy deflect and refute and insult to the last breath instead of just manning up and saying whoops my bad I mispoke or didn't see something.

So be it. Not to infringe on eyes word but I'm moving on from this. If anyone else wishes to discuss I'm open to it.


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[WalkingWolf]

Wolf really? Someone else please correct him on the tense thing.....

I was using myself in the present by saying "if i rolled up....." in the scenario and the firearm brandished in the past tense. Why is this so complicated?

You proved my point every time you just used it was in the past tense telling a story of what happened in the past. You really can't admit you were wrong. Wow. Its not often you see a guy deflect and refute and insult to the last breath instead of just manning up and saying whoops my bad I mispoke or didn't see something.

So be it. Not to infringe on eyes word but I'm moving on from this. If anyone else wishes to discuss I'm open to it.


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So you admit you used the present as you rolled up and the deceased brandished? Way to go there Forest!

Let me try to help you with a physics lesson. Everything that has happened is past tense. If it has not happened it is fantasy. It certainly was not happening as you posted. But IMO everything you post is fantasy.