Hey! I've get an agenda and am on a vendetta!

[sccrref]

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sv_libertarian wrote:

No I did get his name, but I have this habit of not remembering names unless I see them written down. Sadly I did not have a chance to write it down. The rest of the call went as described. The Sgt. while gruff was a decent enough person to talk with, and I would probablly enjoy drinking a beer with him.

One conversation I had with Lt. Wilson he told me that while he understands I am a law abiding citizen, that if I continued to OC I would probably get to know all the downtown cops. Since the way I have been meeting downtown cops lately has revolved around "please stand up, put your hands behind your head and interlace your fingers" I thought I could circumvent this somewhat unpleasant experience a bit. Lt. Wilson told me that they have something like 70 sworn officers and he could not tell them all I am a "good guy".

I went out of my way NOT to argue case law with the Sgt. I told him I was well acquainted with the laws and case laws regarding OC when he asked. I said I was trying to ensure my safety and well being by talking to another officer outside of Lt. Wilson and any staff commonly available on weekdays. I did this. Two officers in a supervisory position are acquainted with my posistion. One officer works business hours, and the other works weekends. It seems simply stating that I had been working with Lt. Wilson was sufficient, and I will use this if there is a future incident. I will ask for a couple of names of officers in supervisory situations I can contact day, night or weekend if there is a problem.

As much as I don't want to, I believe I will have to accept there may be some more unpleasant experiences, and I do not want any of them to involve staring at gun muzzles or wearing handcuffs. I do not see it as hurting my cause to make myself peaceably known to a couple of cops. This may well influence how a strange cop on a dark night treats me.

What bothers me, and why I made this post is the clear disregard the whole of the OPD, rank and file seem to have about OCing. I learned more in my little phone call with the Sgt. than I have with all of my conversations with Lt. Wilson, and what I learned bothers me to no great end.

I am a salesman by profession which helps me negoiating anddealing with peopleand will continue making my pitch in a professional, firm and courteous manner to those who matter in this case.

I am sorry you believe I was trying to start something and have a selective memory. Names do not stick well with me. Oh well. I need to carry a pen and paper for the little details.



Steve

Get one of those sneaky little digital recording devices. You could use it in you occupation to dictate notes and names as well.

 

[thebastidge]

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Bashing cops isn't likely to get them on your side, and there is nothing to keep them from reading this forum.

If they do something wrong, call them on it, and let other people know. But why not stick to the facts of the matter rather than opinions and insults?

If "Officer So-n-So" acts like a Nazi, then fine, say he acted like a Nazi. But speculating about their family life is a bit bitchy-childish and doesn't do any of us much good.

 

[sv_libertarian]

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thebastidge wrote:

Bashing cops isn't likely to get them on your side, and there is nothing to keep them from reading this forum.

If they do something wrong, call them on it, and let other people know. But why not stick to the facts of the matter rather than opinions and insults?

If "Officer So-n-So" acts like a Nazi, then fine, say he acted like a Nazi. But speculating about their family life is a bit bitchy-childish and doesn't do any of us much good.

I agree. At least two on the OPD are familiar with OCDO, Lt. Wilson, and the Sgt. I spoke with Saturday. I suspect someone there is reading it right now. At the very least insulting family life is a bit crude. I will admit to a knee jerk laugh, but I know I wouldn't like someone talking badly of my family life.

I have engaged in verbal sniping with cops before, and rather recently even, and sadly it gets neither side anywhere. Even exchanging unpleasantries is something I ususally regret doing later as all I do is stoop to their own level.

If I haven't said it before, I would of course like to thank everyone that has chimed in and been supportive during all this crap.

Steve

 

[sv_libertarian]

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sccrref wrote:

Get one of those sneaky little digital recording devices. You could use it in you occupation to dictate notes and names as well.

I want to get a sneaky little recorder anyway to sneakily record cops who are not so sneakily trying to infringe on my rights...

99% of my contact with customers though is wrapped up within a couple of minutes, and once a person says "sure" out comes the pen and order form. I always have pen and paper and work, and should really do so when not working...

Steve

 

[Bear 45/70]

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sv_libertarian wrote:

thebastidge wrote:

Bashing cops isn't likely to get them on your side, and there is nothing to keep them from reading this forum.

If they do something wrong, call them on it, and let other people know. But why not stick to the facts of the matter rather than opinions and insults?

If "Officer So-n-So" acts like a Nazi, then fine, say he acted like a Nazi. But speculating about their family life is a bit bitchy-childish and doesn't do any of us much good.

I agree. At least two on the OPD are familiar with OCDO, Lt. Wilson, and the Sgt. I spoke with Saturday. I suspect someone there is reading it right now. At the very least insulting family life is a bit crude. I will admit to a knee jerk laugh, but I know I wouldn't like someone talking badly of my family life.

I have engaged in verbal sniping with cops before, and rather recently even, and sadly it gets neither side anywhere. Even exchanging unpleasantries is something I ususally regret doing later as all I do is stoop to their own level.

If I haven't said it before, I would of course like to thank everyone that has chimed in and been supportive during all this crap.

Steve

I will disagree. If the copsdon't want to be called arrogant, ignorant storm troopers stomping on our Constitutional rights (State and Federal) along with violating the law themselves, then they shouldn't do it. If the cops are aware of the Internet and they should be, then they should know that every time they pull a boneheaded stunt and/or act like they don't have to follow the law or treat the very people they are suppose to be serving poorly or with a bad attitude; that it will end up on the Internet somewhere for all to see. Secrecy works in their favor not the peoples. If the copsare above being made fun of, thatwould pretty much prove anything said here about them here or else where is true. Besides that I was under the impression cops were suppose to have thick skins to do their jobs. But then that's my opinion, you cans can have your own of course.

 

[ne1]

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It isn't bashing when they brought up the issue in the first place- seems like fair game to me.

 

[thebastidge]

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As usual, people are missing the point. If you'reinsulting themlike petulant children instead of calmly pointing out deficienies and errors of law and practice, you undermine your own arguments.

If you're angry, then "I am angry because of X" is far more effective than "stupid cops! no donut!" Not only is it less directly confrontational to someone who may yet be convinced of the error of his ways, but it's less off-putting to third parties and fence sitters.

If the cop acted like arrogant: as I said before, saying "officer so and so acted like a Nazi by saying that his personal views andversion of the law trumps the written constitution and statues" is not so much out of line. But "Officer So and So is taking out his inadequacies on the general public because he's got a short dick" is not constructive.

Of course if you're just beating your chest because the hollow sound drowns out the voices in your head, then by all means...

On another note, you can get a voice recorder module for your iPod if you have one...

 

[sv_libertarian]

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Bear 45/70 wrote:

I will disagree. If the copsdon't want to be called arrogant, ignorant storm troopers stomping on our Constitutional rights (State and Federal) along with violating the law themselves, then they shouldn't do it. If the cops are aware of the Internet and they should be, then they should know that every time they pull a boneheaded stunt and/or act like they don't have to follow the law or treat the very people they are suppose to be serving poorly or with a bad attitude; that it will end up on the Internet somewhere for all to see. Secrecy works in their favor not the peoples. If the copsare above being made fun of, thatwould pretty much prove anything said here about them here or else where is true. Besides that I was under the impression cops were suppose to have thick skins to do their jobs. But then that's my opinion, you cans can have your own of course.

Ah, now I don't mind calling cops arrogant, ignorant storm troopers stomping on our Constitutional Rights. In fact I have done so when the shoe fits. I feel petty insults about family life, sexual preference, carnal relations with small furry animals, or whatnot is wrong. Calling a spade a spade is fine. Empty speculation about rather or not a person's family would even want them around can be funny but in the end fruitless or damaging.

One reason I have probably made myself annoying with blow by blow accounts of the OPD incident is to put it out in a public place where the weight of public opinion can judge on it, and also because I know that there are people in the OPD who have had and certaintly are again reading OCDO after I mention where I am telling my story. A small quiet affair is just that, but a loud public affair where people from all over the state and country are sounding in is just that; a loud public affair. Since I am almost counting on the people I am talking about and talking to stopping by, I for one try to be as courteous as my mood and the situation allows.

But again, I will call a jack booted thug a jack booted thug to his face. Since I left Cali, I haven't had occassion to do that thank God.

Steve