• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

Mag limits infringe on 2nd amendment right to be able to defend yourself

Red Dawg

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2010
Messages
399
Location
Eastern VA, with too many people
I am having a very hard time getting why anyone who says they believe in ANY liberty is okay with allowing the government to dictate what you can and can not do on a daily basis. I don't think anyone would argue on this forum that the 2nd gives us the right to have a gun to defend ourself. This is a right, correct? Not a privelege. What if the government mandated that you no longer can have a car that gets less than 35 MPG? You only use a car to commute to work, so no big deal. What about the guy that uses a 3/4 ton truck to make a living repairing your roof? Do you really need a car that has 400 hp, and goes 155 mph? nah, but when you want a little more power, NEED a little more power to get out of a tight spot on the road, it's pretty nice to have the extra. We all know, and hope to never pull our guns in anger, or need, but if there are more than one bad guy, and adremaline is flowing and god forbid you miss, or they move and don't stand still while you shoot them, woiuldn't it be nice to have those extra rounds.
 

jdmm72

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2013
Messages
15
Location
Nitro, WV
I guess some folks can't defend themselves without 30 rnd mags. How did they do it before ARs came on the scene?

Maybe because when they were available, they usually had a couple of loaded revolvers, a repeating rifle on the horse, maybe a shotgun/street cannon, bowie knives, and derringers. At one point in human and US history, it was LEGAL to carry bowie knives, swords, daggers, and spears, axes, but not anymore, we are mostly limited to handguns by law, most of the time, we cannot carry backup long guns, so we have a primary weapon and no sort of backup.

When I was in a warzone in recent years, I was issued a 9mm and a 3.75" Benchmade automatic knife which I was allowed to keep after my commitment was up. I cannot by law carry the Benchmade under any circumstances BY LAW in most of the US. Not only is it 3.75", it is defined as a switchblade, thus is illegal to carry in 2 fronts. I can carry my pistol legally. In many SD distances, that Benchmade would be more effective, faster, and just as lethal, but I am not allowed to carry it as backup.

Additionally, with the recent invention of things like meth, crack, painkillers, one shot, or 4 or 8 shots may not be enough to take down a perp. The one shot thing only works definitely if you hit high on the spine and completely sever it. Even with a heart hit, they could possibly still stab/shoot you before dying, and may still be conscious and moving for a few more seconds, maybe up to 30, depending on circumstances. We have heard plenty of instances recently were perps have been shot 6+ times including hits to the head, and still manage to run off and functionally live.

Remember, most pistol shots aren't necessarily fatal (even .45), given proper prompt medical care. Ultimately, the handgun is there to allow you to get out of a life threatening situation hopefully by egress, not necessarily kill bad guys.

Really?

Let's assume for a minute--since we don't know for sure--that the Connecticut shooters AR style rifle had a one-round limit. Every time he fired a shot, he had to reload. Would it have had an effect on his ability to murder 26 individuals so quickly? Please say no.

Then I will ask if you could sufficiently defend yourself with a single shot semi-auto (bear with me here, it wouldn't really be a semi-auto, it would be more like a bolt-action), against a person carrying an AR style rifle with a hundred round drum.

Last time I checked, they have taken the AR-15 claim down to a "long gun" claim, and it apparently never left his car. He used mostly handguns, so the premise of the AR ban proposal is false at best in reason.
 
Last edited:

MSG Laigaie

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Messages
3,241
Location
Philipsburg, Montana
Last time I checked, they have taken the AR-15 claim down to a "long gun" claim, and it apparently never left his car. He used mostly handguns, so the premise of the AR ban proposal is false at best in reason.


Because of State Law, he only used ten round magazines. He just reloaded a lot.
 

jdmm72

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2013
Messages
15
Location
Nitro, WV
And the lady in Geogia defending her kids from the closet hit 5 of 6 times and the perp walked away. What if there were more than one in the house..?

That was one of the cases I was thinking of. A shotgun is the best home defense gun, if you have time to set an ambush, but unfortunately you don't always, and the federal laws that mandate a minimum barrel length make it unwieldy.

And to be clear, by ambush, I mean to go and hide in your room, and wait for BG to bust through the door.
 
Last edited:

Freedom1Man

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
4,462
Location
Greater Eastside Washington
I don't think anyone would argue on this forum that the 2nd gives us the right to have a gun to defend ourselves. SNIP
Spelling correction by me. Not intending to change the meaning.

I will agree with you on the first part.

I will disagree with you on the second part.
The 2nd Amendment does not GIVE/GRANT rights, AT ALL. None of the amendments in the bill of rights GRANT the people rights at all. They are there to re-affirm NATURAL/GOD GIVEN/CREATOR GIVEN/UNALIENABLE rights that you have whether the amendments exist or not.
 

WalkingWolf

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,930
Location
North Carolina
Actually the second amendment has nothing to do at all with personal self defense. BOR is or was a the time specific to protect the people from the government. If we take the BOR for it's original intended meaning it has nothing to do with self defense from each other.
 

OC for ME

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,452
Location
White Oak Plantation
Of course the 2A is about self defense. The primary threat considered at the time of its construction was a tyrannical government. We just tossed one out of America. But, buildings do not attack us, our fellow citizens who work for the tyrannical government attack us. So, the 2A is about self defense from our fellow citizens who are tyrants.
 

marshaul

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
11,188
Location
Fairfax County, Virginia
If a criminal is shooting back at you, then hell yes a limited magazine capacity diminishes your chance of successful self-defense.

If you are a nut-job shooting 6-year olds, with nobody around to shoot back, then swapping out mags is hardly an inconvenience.

My thoughts exactly.
 

MSG Laigaie

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Messages
3,241
Location
Philipsburg, Montana
...... A shotgun is the best home defense gun, if you have time .......

I agree, I use my pistol(EDC) to get to my shotgun.

The ABW bill is in and "high cap mags" are on the list. I saw this and it is a unique thought. Not illegal, undocumented. I like this train of thought.

If someone doesn't comply with the federal registry of their gun, will it be illegal, or will Democrats insist on calling it 'undocumented'?
 

OC for ME

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,452
Location
White Oak Plantation
Well, if you vote democrat you will have undocumented mags. If you do not vote democrat you will have illegal mags.

Full breach in 5...4...3...2...
 

Freedom1Man

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
4,462
Location
Greater Eastside Washington
I agree, I use my pistol(EDC) to get to my shotgun.

The ABW bill is in and "high cap mags" are on the list. I saw this and it is a unique thought. Not illegal, undocumented. I like this train of thought.

If someone doesn't comply with the federal registry of their gun, will it be illegal, or will Democrats insist on calling it 'undocumented'?

Like the unlicensed pharmacists doing business in alleys and street corners?
 

Beretta92FSLady

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 14, 2009
Messages
5,264
Location
In My Coffee
Okay. Baretta lady, bee dude, I have a valid NEED for more than a few rounds in my SD gun. They are called flashmob beatings. Maybe you've heard of them. Where I live right now, pretty low percentage of probability. BUT anywhere that Gangs are, there is a chance of them.
B92Lady, you asked if a revolver is not a good SD weapon. Well, as a matter of fact, it is in my eyes, most of the time. That is my carry gun(s) most of the time. I have 3 of them that I rotate. I also have a Ruger SR9. Sometimes I drive a 4x4 truck, and sometimes I drive a big 4 door 3/4 ton truck. I also drive an old Camaro...Like anything else, it depends on what I'm doing and where I'm going. The key I'm trying to make people understand and see, I do NOT want the government, some dude or chick on the interwebz, or anyone else telling me what the heck I can do or how to protect myself, or anythig else. It's none of your, or anyone's damn business.

Google flashmob beatings....That's all the cite I need to more than a few rounds in my carry gun.

Agreed. I don't want anyone telling me whether or not I can defend myself, and with what.
 

Beretta92FSLady

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 14, 2009
Messages
5,264
Location
In My Coffee
And the lady in Geogia defending her kids from the closet hit 5 of 6 times and the perp walked away. What if there were more than one in the house..?

Listening to the footage of that exchange...well, I got some dirt in my eye.

Every man should be supportive, like her husband; every woman should know when, and how to drop the hammer.
 
Top