My first police encounter

[fire suppressor]

He writes out a notice of infraction and hopes that you will just send the fine in and not take the time to fight it. Charges get thrown out of court every day. However, people pay fines on citations that would not stick in court every day just because they don't want to take the time to go to court and fight them.



How does telling a police officer about my lawfully possessed gun show respect? Doesn't "Yes, sir", "No, sir", "Good morning/afternoon, sir", "hope you have a nice day, officer" show respect? Doesn't pulling over in the safest place possible show respect? Doesn't having the REQUIRED documents ready show respect?

If telling the officer about my lawfully possessed and carried gun shows respect, does that mean that if I told him what CDs are in my stereo, which pocket my cell phone is in, or that I have a tire pressure guage in my glove box and jumper cables in my trunk show more respect, then? Those ojbects present just as much danger to the officer as the gun in my holster does.

There are at least nine professions that more workers die in than police officers. Among those professions are lumber workers, garbage collectors and farmers. Every day those men and women are out there putting in more than a full day's work and they contribute daily to my health and welfare and the health and welfare of all of us. And they are dying on the job more often than police officers do. So, do we tell the garbage man about our gun and our CPL to show respect to them?

Theses people are out all day coming into contact with all types of people some good and some bad. For their own safety they have to assume everyone they come across is bad until proven otherwise. Telling them you have a gun shows them respect because number one now they know you have it and it will not startle them and number two because if you are informing them of your gun you are sending them a message of peace and non violence. I think it can make for a overall more relaxed encounter. I do not agree with them unloading our guns or holding them but I do understand their reasoning. I have never know a bad guy to tell a cop he has a gun and then try to shoot them. I think it just sets a positive tone for the entire situation

 

[sudden valley gunner]

Theses people are out all day coming into contact with all types of people some good and some bad. For their own safety they have to assume everyone they come across is bad until proven otherwise. Telling them you have a gun shows them respect because number one now they know you have it and it will not startle them and number two because if you are informing them of your gun you are sending them a message of peace and non violence. I think it can make for a overall more relaxed encounter. I do not agree with them unloading our guns or holding them but I do understand their reasoning. I have never know a bad guy to tell a cop he has a gun and then try to shoot them. I think it just sets a positive tone for the entire situation

Shows a lack of respect for those who died for our 4th amendment. To quote sparky 'don't feed the bears'.

Do you assume every person you encounter during the day are "bad"?

Cops are no more deserving respect than any other citizen you encounter, matter of fact they are your employee they should show you the respect of respecting your rights, regardless of whom they may encounter.

 

[MKEgal]

Had me step out of the car checked and cleared my gun.
All in all great experience.

The officer nedlessly put you, himself, and others in increased danger of negligent discharge by handling the gun with no justifiable reason to do so.

I might ask him why he would want me to even touch my weapon if he is so concerned with officer safety?

+1 to Navy & Jim.
You chose to do certain things, & they seem to have turned out OK... as in, nobody was shot.
But the next time that officer runs into someone who knows his rights & knows the law, that person's day will get lots harder.
And it's possible that the next time that officer handles an unfamiliar pistol, he won't be so lucky & someone will get shot.

I cannot say that a traffic stop where a cop seizes my gun is a good encounter. A cop who basically acknowledges the presence of the gun, but then pretty much ignores it is a good stop, if there can be any such thing as a good stop.

+1

I work with law enforcement and although are very tolerant and supportive of our gun rights they worry about the nut jobs they could potentially encounter and have.

Even the FBI admits that criminals don't carry openly, & practically never use holsters. (And honestly, how many do you think can slip through the cracks to get a carry license?)
So if the officer can see the pistol, and it's not being pointed at anything other than a paper target, everything should be OK.
If it's in a holster & especially if the carrier is bending enough to show a carry license, the officer should actually relax at bit.

I'll just add that when the cop walks up to me, I cannot tell whether he is a good cop or a bad cop.
When the good cops get rid of the bad cops, then we'll talk about notifying.

+1
It's getting harder & harder, but I try to behave neutrally until the officer (or any other person, for that matter) gives me a reason to believe they're either "good" or "bad".
Hopefully the officer does the same, & hopefully s/he is familiar with the FBI study from... what... 2005? that I referenced above. I have links to a PDF around here somewhere...

The way he was facing me he could see inside very well.

So there was no reason to tell him - he could already see the pistol.

Actually officer, for everyone's safety I would prefer it just stay in the holster...
Almost all [strike]accidental[/strike] negligent discharges have the gun being handled as a common denominator.

FTFY. But +1

Then he would have called for backup and when they arrived, they would have put you on the ground, handcuffed you, and removed your gun "for officer safety."

And the department/city would be faced with a suit for unreasonable search & seizure, excessive use of force, etc.
If someone has been pulled over for speeding (or whatever minor ticket-causing thing) there's no reason to search the driver (or passengers), search the car, seize anything... There's nothing on the people or in the car that will give you evidence of speeding.

So far, to my knowledge, the Washington State Supreme Court has never separated "armed" from "dangerous". The US Supreme Court says the the officer has the right to disarm you for "officer safety" if, during a lawful detention, the officer has RAS to believe that you are "armed and dangerous". Until the Washington State Supreme Court says otherwise, we can assume that armed will equal dangerous.

The WA court doesen't get to overrule SCOTUS. They've already clearly said armed /= dangerous, by using the phrase armed and dangerous. If armed = dangerous, LEO could walk up & disarm anyone they saw in possession of a firearm.

Officer stops you for open carrying and demands to see your CPL. You reply, "I am not concealing a firearm, there is no requirement for me to possess or carry a CPL."

And then the officer makes up a story about having seen you conceal the pistol at some point, & arrests you for cc.
BTDT.

How can you be charged with something that is not illegal?

See above...
OC in a car was specifically made legal as part of our cc law that went into effect last NOV.
Nevertheless, I've been charged with ccw for OC in the car (which was parked, not running, on private property) because one unobservant officer claimed she didn't see my pistol (which is possible... we have other proof she's unobservant) and lept to the conclusion that I was concealing it.

I'm not going to say someone should or should not but I think it does show respect

I think it shows respect for their oath to uphold the laws & Constitutions if they treat a LAC just like any other citizen. Unless & until the LAC does something to make the officer believe that they are not law-abiding, that pistol in its holster should be given no more attention than the air freshener hanging from the mirror... unless the officer wants to talk pistols over a cup of coffee.

 

[OC for ME]

Theses people are out all day coming into contact with all types of people some good and some bad. For their own safety they have to assume everyone they come across is bad until proven otherwise. Telling them you have a gun shows them respect because number one now they know you have it and it will not startle them and number two because if you are informing them of your gun you are sending them a message of peace and non violence. I think it can make for a overall more relaxed encounter. I do not agree with them unloading our guns or holding them but I do understand their reasoning. I have never know a bad guy to tell a cop he has a gun and then try to shoot them. I think it just sets a positive tone for the entire situation

Drivel.....Why do some folks always place the burden solely on the citizen to be the 'adult in the room' and hold LE harmless. With regards to a LEO, I am courteous not deferential. Both have the element of respect.

In my view, until proven otherwise, every LEO is a bad LEO, a anti-liberty, anti-citizen state/county/city hired thug. This is the only way to consider LE when they contact you, so that you, the citizen, can just go home at the end of the day. If that LEO turns out to be a citizen, just like me, who just happens to have chosen LE as a career, we'll get along just fine. In fact, I'll buy him a cup of coffee. This determination usually occurs in just a few seconds after contact. On the other hand, if he is a state sponsored thug....

In either case the LEO gets nothing from me beyond what the law mandates that I must provide. Make no mistake, I am not talking about innocuous conversations, content completely unrelated to the LEO's job. I'm talking about the "Excuse me Sir, can I speak with you for a moment?" type of 'consensual contact'.

I know a few LEOs and we will shoot the breeze for a few minutes when I get my morning 22oz cup-o-Joe at the local C-store, while OCing, if we happen to meet. Complaints about sons and daughters texting, crappy school grades, not picking up their dirty clothes, the dog digging up The Wife's freshly planted flowers.....blah blah blah. But, if I detect that they are in the "Excuse me Sir,...." mode, my guard goes up. Even my cop buddies get this treatment. They know it is not personal, they are professionals.....good cops.

Respect begets respect, but the LEO has to be respectful first, he gets paid to be respectful, not me.

Respect is not using nice words while stomping on my unalienable Rights with their state provided jack-boots.

 

[MSG Laigaie]

Respect begets respect, but the LEO has to be respectful first, he gets paid to be respectful, not me.

Respect is not using nice words while stomping on my unalienable Rights with their state provided jack-boots.

YES YES It has been a very long time since a LEO has "pulled me over" so I have no anecdotal experience. If this occurs, I see no reason to inform a LEO of me doing a legal act. I will not put a hand near my weapon or act aggressively.

 

[911Boss]

Actually officer, for everyone's safety I would prefer it just stay in the holster...
Almost all accidental negligent discharges have the gun being handled as a common denominator.

FTFY. But +1.

Actually, when a cop has an an ND, they usually still use the AD term. Always better to force someone to prove negligence in a lawsuit than admit to it up front...