Oaklander from CGN/CGF invites OCDO members over to a BBQ

[MudCamper]

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greg36f wrote:

Everyone, always andnever are words that should rarely if ever be used.......

Yeah, yeah. Sounds like somebody's had to take "sensitivity training"!

OK, many.

 

[greg36f]

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bigtoe416 wrote:

MudCamper wrote:

I was originally enthusiastic about this event.

But after the recent hate-fest frenzy over on CalGuns I don't feel like coming anymore.

Everyone, including most of the CGF board of directors, has been insulting the UOC community non-stop for the last 16 hours over there. It makes this thread feel like the fig leaf in one hand while the dagger is being held behind the back in the other.

Well said.

I was also pretty stoked about this event, and while I didn't plan on carrying, I thought it was a great show of faith that Oaklander was willing to have strangers carry concealed in his house. Now this is a gun-free gun-related event, which makes me think back to the gun-free gun show which was talked about in Nordyke and which everybody laughed at. I can't help but think that any anti's would love to know about how we don't even want people carrying guns on our own property. Why should we expect businesses to welcome us in when we can't even do the same for people who support our cause?

Also, a significant number of the OCers have stood down after being requested to do so. Some of them haven't. But we're all getting equal amount of flak for a bill being introduced, which is totally lame.

I did not mean to throw a wrench into anything....It is just that it only takes ONE PERSON to make Oaklanders life difficult.........I have lived in some real sketchy neighborhoods and I know how important OPSEC is........If I knew that he lived in a good neighborhood, I never would have said anything......

It was only out of respect for his well being that I brought this up......

That being said, this is a real important time for gun rights, no matter what your opinion of the details and route required to get there....

We must stand together in bad times more than good times.....

This get together is an evenbetter idea now, than when he proposed it....

 

[greg36f]

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MudCamper wrote:

greg36f wrote:

Everyone, always andnever are words that should rarely if ever be used.......

Yeah, yeah. Sounds like somebody's had to take "sensitivity training"!

OK, many.

I'm so sensitive that I got skin like a new born baby,,,,,,:lol:. I make Alan Alda look insensitive!!!!!

 

[N6ATF]

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Oaklander wrote:

OK - now I am all paranoid!

I am going to pull rank here, and make this a NO GUN event (except for those lucky souls who have CCWs).

This will ensure:

1) no future problems with neighbors

2) no police interaction

And the police interaction thing is no joke. OPD does not mess around. . .



If people are concerned about their personal safety - I have plenty of guns on site. . . And food, and water, for that matter!!!

LOL

Might as well cancel it then, if you think OPD is going to shoot the lawyer(s) first, then question everyone else later. If they won't respect private property CCW without permit, then they won't respect permitted CCW either (since nobody with a CCW will be from Alameda Co.)

If you want to play into the hands of the government, who would rejoice at a massacre of law-abiding gun owners, maybe everyone needs to buy body armor instead.

 

[Oaklander]

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Guys,

All I am trying to do is open dialog between CGN and UOC. If you will notice, I have not posted anything substantive in the Calguns thread on about the new proposed California law. I am trying to remain neutral on the topic.

I would really like to meet some of you in person so that we can start a dialog and look for points of commonality.

 

[MudCamper]

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greg36f wrote:

We must stand together

Agreed. This is something I've been screaming over on CGN for the last year, but it is falling mostly on deaf ears.


Oaklander wrote:

I would really like to meet some of you in person so that we can start a dialog and look for points of commonality.

I'm still going to try and make it.

 

[TatankaGap]

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Here's what I see:

the Open Carry people are moving things forward because it is a non-hierarchical, non-lawyer run, non-organization - just a bunch of people from all of the 50 states aware of and exercising their rights - and aware of the current dynamic changes in the area of RKBA -

the Calguns people are so clearly oppressed and sensitized that they tend to be very risk-averse when it comes to exercising 2A rights because they're all Californians and they've never had a 2A to rely on, officially, that is - until June they don't -

If you've never lived or spent significant time outside CA to see what it is like in 2A respecting places, you can't really know how to express freedom because all you know is slavery.

It reminds me of a story I heard once about how after Moses led the Jews out of Egypt, they got into the desert and Moses went up on the Mountain and God told him to send some scouts out into Canaan - and he did and the scouts came back and said all the Canaanites out there were scary and too tall to conquer and the people were afraid. Then Moses went back up the Mountain and God told him that the people would have to stay in the desert for 40 years so that the slave generation would die off. People who were born and lived all their lives as slaves were incapable of leading their people to freedom. So, when a generation came of age that had been born into freedom, they sent their scouts out, their warriors conquered and they made a place for themselves.

To me it's just a story, but one that comes from the Old Testament and one that is instructive about why the oppressed people at Calguns are so scared to rock the boat or deviate out of the exact order that their lawyers tell them is safest.

People born into and living in slavery are unable to lead the people to freedom - :shock:

 

[MudCamper]

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TatankaGap wrote:

To me it's just a story, but one that comes from the Old Testament and one that is instructive about why the oppressed people at Calguns are so scared to rock the boat or deviate out of the exact order that their lawyers tell them is safest.

While the story is interesting, and certainly is true of some people, it's not fair to characterize all of CalGuns this way. (Hey, I'm a CalGunner too!) I understand and appreciate the CGF (foundation, not net) strategy, and have honored the stand-down request to a point. The CGF are smart, dedicated guys who will achieve victories for all of us.

The problem with regard to OC is the divisive language they have used to express their frustration with the wild card UOC groups, and then the barrage of CGN (net) fanboys who pile on top with useless personal attacks.

 

[Gundude]

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IMHO....I think people fall into 3 basic group regarding guns.

One group has a fear of gun taken to a phobia. They would have to go through some sort of counseling to get over the phobia.

Another group believe in the 2nd amendment and has no problem about guns. Probably gun owners who wouldn't open carry but may carry concealed if it were an option, and some that just keep their guns at home.

That brings it to us.I suspect there are some here who would open carry all the time. For myself, when on the street or in my car, I would open carry. When I entered a business I would pull my shirt out and drop it over my weapon. I would like the choice to do either.

 

[coolusername2007]

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greg36f wrote:

I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it.
Voltaire

That's finethat Voltaire is being quoted, but that doesn't have anything to do with our 2A freedoms. What good is it to speak freely and defend that speach while simultaneously doing the opposite for 2A freedoms? What, you'll defend our rights to open carry...as long as we don't do it?

I won't be attending this event. I thank Oaklander for the offering though. Too much CGN paranoia has already infiltrated this event (and thread), and that's worse than an OPD infiltration.

I respect Oaklander for offering his home for this event, but frankly it doesn't seem like such a good idea because of his need to protect his privacy from his neighbors. To make a simple analogy, it seems a little like having about 50-100 of my loudest friends over, but we can't make any noise because the neighbors are too sensitive about noise. Maybe a better locationis in order.

 

[greg36ff]

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coolusername2007 wrote:

greg36f wrote:

I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it.
Voltaire

That's finethat Voltaire is being quoted, but that doesn't have anything to do with our 2A freedoms. What good is it to speak freely and defend that speach while simultaneously doing the opposite for 2A freedoms? What, you'll defend our rights to open carry...as long as we don't do it?

I won't be attending this event. I thank Oaklander for the offering though. Too much CGN paranoia has already infiltrated this event (and thread), and that's worse than an OPD infiltration.

I respect Oaklander for offering his home for this event, but frankly it doesn't seem like such a good idea because of his need to protect his privacy from his neighbors. To make a simple analogy, it seems a little like having about 50-100 of my loudest friends over, but we can't make any noise because the neighbors are too sensitive about noise. Maybe a better locationis in order.

To me it means that in this public forum, we should respect each others opinions and we should treat each other with respect.

 

[coolusername2007]

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greg36ff wrote:

coolusername2007 wrote:

greg36f wrote:

I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it.
Voltaire

That's finethat Voltaire is being quoted, but that doesn't have anything to do with our 2A freedoms. What good is it to speak freely and defend that speach while simultaneously doing the opposite for 2A freedoms? What, you'll defend our rights to open carry...as long as we don't do it?

I won't be attending this event. I thank Oaklander for the offering though. Too much CGN paranoia has already infiltrated this event (and thread), and that's worse than an OPD infiltration.

I respect Oaklander for offering his home for this event, but frankly it doesn't seem like such a good idea because of his need to protect his privacy from his neighbors. To make a simple analogy, it seems a little like having about 50-100 of my loudest friends over, but we can't make any noise because the neighbors are too sensitive about noise. Maybe a better locationis in order.

To me it means that in this public forum, we should respect each others opinions and we should treat each other with respect.

I respect your speech and your opinions. I would prefer a less ironical event, I think it was N6ATF who called out the irony here first. He's right IMO, but I still thank and respect Oaklander for the offering.

The point I was attempting to get across was that many on CGN probably agree with Voltaire's quote on speech. Is there a quote from Voltaire about defending the RKBA while actually doing it? If so, maybe that quote is in order.

 

[N6ATF]

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coolusername2007 wrote:

greg36ff wrote:

coolusername2007 wrote:

greg36f wrote:

I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it.
Voltaire

That's finethat Voltaire is being quoted, but that doesn't have anything to do with our 2A freedoms. What good is it to speak freely and defend that speach while simultaneously doing the opposite for 2A freedoms? What, you'll defend our rights to open carry...as long as we don't do it?

I won't be attending this event. I thank Oaklander for the offering though. Too much CGN paranoia has already infiltrated this event (and thread), and that's worse than an OPD infiltration.

I respect Oaklander for offering his home for this event, but frankly it doesn't seem like such a good idea because of his need to protect his privacy from his neighbors. To make a simple analogy, it seems a little like having about 50-100 of my loudest friends over, but we can't make any noise because the neighbors are too sensitive about noise. Maybe a better locationis in order.

To me it means that in this public forum, we should respect each others opinions and we should treat each other with respect.

I respect your speech and your opinions. I would prefer a less ironical event, I think it was N6ATF who called out the irony here first. He's right IMO, but I still thank and respect Oaklander for the offering.

The point I was attempting to get across was that many on CGN probably agree with Voltaire's quote on speech. Is there a quote from Voltaire about defending the RKBA while actually doing it? If so, maybe that quote is in order.

I was so quick on the irony uptake that I called it BEFORE the actual event was modified to be ironical. Maybe I'm psychic. Or maybe I should use reverse psychology next time.

This time:
Me- "That would be too ironic."
Him- "Let's DO IT THEN!"

Next time:
Me- "That's not ironic ENOUGH!"
Him- "Ok, I'll make it less ironic then."

 

[heliopolissolutions]

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*facepalm*

Disunity FTL.

 

[cato]

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This will be a good time. Please try to make it!

 

[Oaklander]

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Sorry that I haven't had time to reply in this thread. I've been busy working with certain people and organizations to try and stamp out an anti-gun ordinance that is rearing its ugly head in a nearby town:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=278794

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=278749

http://kevinthomason.blogspot.com/2010/03/city-of-emeryville-trying-to-pass-new.html

I respect the irony that there will be no guns (other than mine) at this event. I am still hoping that people will come. I think it is essential that we work on ways to work together.

If you can make it, please post in this poll:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=276304

That will give me a list of people to whom I can PM my address.

Regards,

Kevin

 

[MudCamper]

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Oaklander wrote:

I respect the irony that there will be no guns (other than mine) at this event. I am still hoping that people will come.

Couple questions on this just for clarification.

Your place is inside a school zone, and that is the concern with open carry. Is that correct?

And, do you have a problem with anyone lawfully LUCCing to/from/on your property?

 

[cato]

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LUCC = 'right persons carry' I would hope Oak would be OK with that.

 

[coolusername2007]

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Oaklander wrote:

OK - now I am all paranoid!

I am going to pull rank here, and make this a NO GUN event (except for those lucky souls who have CCWs).

This will ensure:

1) no future problems with neighbors

2) no police interaction

And the police interaction thing is no joke. OPD does not mess around. . .



If people are concerned about their personal safety - I have plenty of guns on site. . . And food, and water, for that matter!!!

LOL

You guys missed his earlier post. This is a NO GUN EVENT.

 

[Oaklander]

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LUCC is fine. Please note that the CGN thread was accidentally deleted. I am working with the mods right now to get it reinstated.