PBS - How do gun owners really feel about gun control?

[VApatriot]

imported post

This there any way to put together just the video shot of Ed and his family and the litter pick-up? I honestly don'tfeel like watching anything that will make me want to beat my head against a hard surface, but I wouldn't mind seeing the rest of it.

 

[Grapeshot]

imported post

VApatriot wrote:

This there any way to put together just the video shot of Ed and his family and the litter pick-up? I honestly don'tfeel like watching anything that will make me want to beat my head against a hard surface, but I wouldn't mind seeing the rest of it.

joeamt wrote:

Spoiler ALERT!

Here is a clip of the gun rights part of the show!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8ExKZOcKek

Yata hey

 

[ed]

imported post

Grapeshot wrote:

joeamt wrote:

Spoiler ALERT!

Here is a clip of the gun rights part of the show!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8ExKZOcKek

Yata hey

Except that was not even part of the show

 

[Overtaxed]

imported post

ed wrote:

So why is crime dropping so fast in the big city of NY like Bloomberg is bragging about? Because of things like this: http://www.villagevoice.com/2010-05-04/news/the-nypd-tapes-inside-bed-stuy-s-81st-precinct

Funny, I just got through reading that very story in print on my way back from NYC to my home about 36 mins away by train.

While I have no doubt that there is some "cooking of the crime stat books" NYC is undeniably safer than it was under Koch and the ineffectual Dinkins.

I remember news stories in the mid to late 90s describing the closing of trauma centers; the precipitous drop in crime was given as the number one reason for this - fewer of them were needed.

In addition, look at all of the gentrifying areas of the City and the Boroughs. Places that were literally used as sets in films like the original Death Wish (most of the sequels were shot in other cities), Taxi Driver, the Warriors and other "urban crime genre" movies are now lined with expensive rentals, condos and retail shops.
No neighborhood is perfect, and crime can drift from one place to another, but it's a pretty safe bet, IMHO, that the people that spend the years of planning and millions of dollars to rehab old tenements and brownstones and carve out upscale retail aren't going to do so unless there's a real and proven drop in crime where they're looking to develop.

 

[Grapeshot]

imported post

Overtaxed wrote:

ed wrote:

So why is crime dropping so fast in the big city of NY like Bloomberg is bragging about? Because of things like this: http://www.villagevoice.com/2010-05-04/news/the-nypd-tapes-inside-bed-stuy-s-81st-precinct

Funny, I just got through reading that very story in print on my way back from NYC to my home about 36 mins away by train.

While I have no doubt that there is some "cooking of the crime stat books" NYC is undeniably safer than it was under Koch and the ineffectual Dinkins.

I remember news stories in the mid to late 90s describing the closing of trauma centers; the precipitous drop in crime was given as the number one reason for this - fewer of them were needed.

In addition, look at all of the gentrifying areas of the City and the Boroughs. Places that were literally used as sets in films like the original Death Wish (most of the sequels were shot in other cities), Taxi Driver, the Warriors and other "urban crime genre" movies are now lined with expensive rentals, condos and retail shops.
No neighborhood is perfect, and crime can drift from one place to another, but it's a pretty safe bet, IMHO, that the people that spend the years of planning and millions of dollars to rehab old tenements and brownstones and carve out upscale retail aren't going to do so unless there's a real and proven drop in crime where they're looking to develop.

Closing of trama centers was driven by the bottom line rather than need - too many uninsured, but other justifiable excuses given. The same has held true nationwide and continues to this day in areas subject to high influx of illegals w/o insurance.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/11/15/eveningnews/main3509726.shtml

http://www.traumacare.com/download/NFTC_CrisisReport_May04.pdf

Hollywood/movies has never been a reasonable test for anything.

Agree that no neighborhood is perfect nor totally safe and that crime has expanded into suburbia, but if you make that bet, you're going to lose. Developers decisions are driven by the bottom line (surprise?)

They buy cheap and sell high, best done by creating a perception of value and/or desirability whether based on facts or not. Crime rates have little to do with this choice of location, particularly when they promote images of this very act of developing such is what will change the demographics.
http://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles/physenv.pdf

Yata hey

 

[2a4all]

imported post

Grapeshot wrote:

Overtaxed wrote:

ed wrote:

So why is crime dropping so fast in the big city of NY like Bloomberg is bragging about? Because of things like this: http://www.villagevoice.com/2010-05-04/news/the-nypd-tapes-inside-bed-stuy-s-81st-precinct

Funny, I just got through reading that very story in print on my way back from NYC to my home about 36 mins away by train.

While I have no doubt that there is some "cooking of the crime stat books" NYC is undeniably safer than it was under Koch and the ineffectual Dinkins.

I remember news stories in the mid to late 90s describing the closing of trauma centers; the precipitous drop in crime was given as the number one reason for this - fewer of them were needed.

In addition, look at all of the gentrifying areas of the City and the Boroughs. Places that were literally used as sets in films like the original Death Wish (most of the sequels were shot in other cities), Taxi Driver, the Warriors and other "urban crime genre" movies are now lined with expensive rentals, condos and retail shops.
No neighborhood is perfect, and crime can drift from one place to another, but it's a pretty safe bet, IMHO, that the people that spend the years of planning and millions of dollars to rehab old tenements and brownstones and carve out upscale retail aren't going to do so unless there's a real and proven drop in crime where they're looking to develop.

Closing of trama centers was driven by the bottom line rather than need - too many uninsured, but other justifiable excuses given. The same has held true nationwide and continues to this day in areas subject to high influx of illegals w/o insurance.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/11/15/eveningnews/main3509726.shtml

http://www.traumacare.com/download/NFTC_CrisisReport_May04.pdf

Hollywood/movies has never been a reasonable test for anything.

Agree that no neighborhood is perfect nor totally safe and that crime has expanded into suburbia, but if you make that bet, you're going to lose. Developers decisions are driven by the bottom line (surprise?)

They buy cheap and sell high, best done by creating a perception of value and/or desirability whether based on facts or not. Crime rates have little to do with this choice of location, particularly when they promote images of this very act of developing such is what will change the demographics.
http://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles/physenv.pdf

Yata hey

Cities want blighted areas redeveloped because it will generate tax revenue. Developers want to do the work because they will profit from it. Before any investments are made, developers seek and get assurances from the city that certain "infrastructure improvements" will be done, such as improved fire and police protection, crime reduction, streets repaved/widened, pedestrian access upgraded, etc, even if the developers have to shell out for (some of)it.

How does the city increase police protection? Using DHSgrants (which are always temporary), additional officers are hired & trained to patrol these now desirable areas to reduce crime by making it more difficult for drug dealers and prostitutes to do business in that neighborhood, and by more carefully classifying crimes that are committed. For example, a low-level felony gets treated as a misdemeanor. One result of this effort is that street crime migrates to other areas, thus making the neighborhood "safer". In Newport News, the police aretrying to"tag" prostitutes to enforce restrictions on where they may be (post conviction), a method to keepthem out of the city's "flagship zones". One side effect is that my area of the city, once very desirable, now has the most gangs. Other things have been done, but that's not for discussion here.

 

[nova]

imported post

I don't care if NYC actually has lower crime rates now, and I don't care if that's a result of gun control (which we know it isn't, it's because of other factors...Chicago has similar or worse gun control, and their crime is through the roof).

The fact I'm being denied my right to self protection there is why I'll never step foot in their jurisdiction.

 

[mwright]

imported post

nova wrote:

I don't care if NYC actually has lower crime rates now, and I don't care if that's a result of gun control (which we know it isn't, it's because of other factors...Chicago has similar or worse gun control, and their crime is through the roof).

The fact I'm being denied my right to self protection there is why I'll never step foot in their jurisdiction.

I agree. They can throw out any statistics they want, but it comes to the matter of principle--that being the right to self protection.

 

[Overtaxed]

imported post

Grapeshot wrote:

Hollywood/movies has never been a reasonable test for anything.

Never said that movies were realistic in general, just that some of the areas that were so drowning in crime and grime that they made great already built film sets have now become tony and gentrified.

Still don't fully agree about what drives residential and retail development - although I'll concede that some land-use decisions are made before an area "cleans up" but there are probably just as many who wait until crime recedes before committing time and dollars to a project.
Developers want a return on investment - why go through all of the BS with zoning,permits, etc and round up financing, if you can't attract tenants willing to pay?
How do you market to these affluent potential tenants when they know that there's a pretty good chance of encountering muggers, pimps and other lowlifes as they're entering or exiting their building?

 

[roscoe13]

imported post

Overtaxed wrote:

How do you market to these affluent potential tenants when they know that there's a pretty good chance of encountering muggers, pimps and other lowlifes as they're entering or exiting their building?

You lie to them.... Works (almost) every time...

 

[ed]

The same crew that interviewed Larry Pratt and I for http://tinyurl.com/edn2k are re-cutting tape and plan on airing something this week in light of Arizona. They phone interviewed me last night after telling me they just talked to Larry Pratt again.

 

[ed]

Feel free to click the link, watch , then comment on their web site:

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/need-to-kno...after-the-arizona-tragedy/6428/#disqus_thread

 

[ed]

 

[FFchris]

I just watched it on tv. At first it seemed rather balanced and fair, but towards the end they're going off the deep end about how we need even more gun control and how the extended magazines are evil. So much for truthful reporting. What happened to sticking with the facts and not giving one's opinion? :banghead:

 

[MSC 45ACP]

What happened to sticking with the facts and not giving one's opinion? :banghead:

You know how it is... Opinions are like ( )*( )

Everyone has one, and most of them smell funny...

 

[Grapeshot]

Overtaxed wrote:
You lie to them.... Works (almost) every time...

The anti proponents are even willing to break the law to push their agenda.

Colin Goddard buys handguns out of state without showing ID. He admits to willfully breaking the law. Why should he not be prosecuted?
"After traveling to many gun shows around the country and across the commonwealth, I have personally purchased firearms without so much as showing my identification."
http://www2.timesdispatch.com/news/2011/jan/15/tdopin02-close-the-gun-show-loophole-ar-775723/

 

[Grapeshot]

You know how it is... Opinions are like ( )*( )

Everyone has at least one, and most of them smell funny...

Fixed it for you.

The upper orifice being more contributory.

 

[MSC 45ACP]

Fixed it for you.

The upper orifice being more contributory.

Thank you, Brother Grapeshot. I can always count on you! See you tomorrow!
Mike