Representative Gabrielle Giffords

[PDinDetroit]

Bail & PD
i agree with both of you on this point posted above,
I wish her a speedy recovery & to the famlies that lost loved ones, & to the injured, I wish them all the best.

And as for the posts that are made out of misinformation, Or made in error, Or ignorance,
to forgive is devine, and a understanding of each one of our weaknesses, is knowledge.

P.S. and anything that (we) say will be taken out of context to be used against us, for there cause...

Agreed Sir!

Ain't none of us perfect and we are here to learn from each other.

 

[PDinDetroit]

Based upon watching hid YouTube videos, I believe he thought of himself as a revolutionary, in the "overthrow" sense of the word. He felt victimized, identified the .gov as the problem, recognized the American Revolution as a past solution to such a problem, and then acted, he thought, in a manner consistent with past revolutionaries to attack the .gov in response.

I can understand if he may have found the awakening process (to the true state/nature of .gov) to be alarming, as many folks do, but I don't understand why he thought this was a possible solution. Perhaps he doesn't think that rousing the herd the voice their opposition is a successful tactic, but how could he imagine this tactic would effect change? Does he think of himself as a martyr and hope to be imitated? Lone gunman rarely have copycats, if ever.

It appeared this guy had a grudge against Representative Giffords based upon an answer she gave to question he had during a townhall-type meeting (reported on the news). She became the focal point for his anger and he acted out.

There really is no understanding that which makes no sense.

 

[stainless1911]

She was a democrat, but the antis keep bringing things into the argument like Palin, tea parties, gun control, and conservative radio and news.

 

[PDinDetroit]

There have been reports that the shooter obtained the Glock 19 legally. I beg to differ on the following points:

1. Self-Admitted Use of Marijuana based upon Internet Postings.
2. Persons who had contact with the shooter stated he was a "pot-head".
3. Reports today that US Military rejected his application due to failed Drug Test.

Based upon this information, the shooter lied on Federal Firearm Form 4473, question 12e.

Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana, or any depressant, stimulant, or narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?

Therefore, the shooter obtained the firearm illegally.

 

[Sonora Rebel]

There have been reports that the shooter obtained the Glock 19 legally. I beg to differ on the following points:

1. Self-Admitted Use of Marijuana based upon Internet Postings.
2. Persons who had contact with the shooter stated he was a "pot-head".
3. Reports today that US Military rejected his application due to failed Drug Test.

Based upon this information, the shooter lied on Federal Firearm Form 4473, question 12e.



Therefore, the shooter obtained the firearm illegally.

Unfortunately, there was no record of it... or anything else in the NCIS data base to verify that he lied on the 4473.

 

[Sonora Rebel]

Ive read though this thread and have been unable to see if anyone confirmed if a permit carrying citizen was actually there and attempted to end the fight. Anybody have any leads on this? This would be great information to be able to pass on to our local units of government attempting to pass illegal ordinances.

No permit is required to carry a sidearm openly or concealed in Arizona. One of the subduers (Joe Zamudio) was armed, but did not draw the weapon under the circumstances.

 

[PDinDetroit]

She was a democrat, but the antis keep bringing things into the argument like Palin, tea parties, gun control, and conservative radio and news.

Yes, I have seen quite a bit of this. Our job to "nip it in the bud" and not continue it or make this partisan in any way, shape, form.

A Pima Community College classmate was on Fox today being interviewed (purple hair and all). He stated he attempted to engage the shooter in political discussions with no success whatsoever. IMO, the shooting was not political just the actions of a madman.

 

[PDinDetroit]

Unfortunately, there was no record of it... or anything else in the NCIS data base to verify that he lied on the 4473.

IIRC, I believe that the store that sold him the firearm is required to keep a copy of the 4473.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Firearms_License#Record_keeping

FFL holders are required to keep a registry of firearms sales in an ATF-approved Bound Book, or a computerized equivalent using ATF-approved software. They must also maintain file copies of Form 4473 or eForm 4473 "Firearms Transaction Record" documents, for a period of not less than 20 years after the date of sale or disposition. When retiring or otherwise relinquishing a license, these records are sent to the BATFE's Out-of-Business Records Center. The ATF is allowed to inspect, as well as request a copy of the Form 4473 from the dealer during the course of a criminal investigation. In addition, the sale of two or more handguns to a person in a five business day period must be reported to ATF on Form 3310.4.

Unless this was a Private Transfer, the store should have this!

 

[autosurgeon]

Yes the store will have a copy of the 4473

 

[NHCGRPR45]

And where was security? If any?

 

[stainless1911]

There has never been any security when I meet with my rep either, I suspect that this is the norm, and honestly, its as it should be. It wouldn't feel right to me to meet with her in front of armed guards. It would add to the whole superior/subject relationship to us and our elected officials.

 

[eastmeyers]

Many politicians have a CPL (or what ever their state calls it), even liberals. They should learn to carry everyday where legal. I am not saying it would have made a difference in this case but it may have. As a law abiding citizen we should all "even our odds"!

 

[jeremy05]

Sad day for sure. I was a little pissed that I was in the wrong part of Tucson that day. Its a shame nobody else was carrying.

 

[DrTodd]

They were.

http://tinyurl.com/2vltqpp

 

[NHCGRPR45]

Thank you!!! John!

 

[DrTodd]

Sad, when someone does something this crazy. Glad an OCer was in the area to step up, otherwise the loss of life could of been worse (going off what you posted) of course the news reports I've seen make no mention of the OC intervention. Media bias I suppose

Well, CNN is reporting it... well, Joe says it in the interview. We need to get this information out when we respond to the statements on-line that there was no one there who was armed. Wisely, the young man kept it holstered. The sheriff is an anti and his men would have most likely shot someone who was helping.

http://tinyurl.com/2vltqpp

 

[NHCGRPR45]

Well, CNN is reporting it... well, Joe says it in the interview. We need to get this information out when we respond to the statements on-line that there was no one there who was armed. Wisely, the young man kept it holstered. The sheriff is an anti and his men would have most likely shot someone who was helping.

http://tinyurl.com/2vltqpp

Indeed. Well done.
.......................................................................................................................
Friendly fire isn't. And its certainly something to have in the back of your mind should any of us ever end up in a situation like this. Unfortunately, IFF might not work like we all hope. Rules change on a 2 way range.

 

[Michigander]

And where was security? If any?

As a teen in Scouts, I met the tyrant Sander Levin at a large community event. I filmed him for someones Eagle project. He had no security of any kind. He just parked his car and walked over to us. Even Jennifer Granholm, when I saw her in Oak Park in the parade had her security detail so well hidden I couldn't spot anyone, and certainly someone who wanted to kill her probably could have.

Arizona people are rather laid back. Some places are rather dangerous because of border crime, but it's still very laid back. Right or wrong, I would think the concern over security would have been even less there than it is here.

 

[StingMP9]

Thank God for smart legislative reactions

The Arizona State Senate and House passed an emergency bill to make it a misdemeanor to picket or protest a funeral within 300 feet. It was signed into law by their Governor as a prevention to Westboro Baptist Church's plans to picket the 9 year old girls funeral.

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/content/view/49106/

 

[PDinDetroit]

Arizona Shooter Stopped By Police Just Hours Before Shooting...

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/01/12/arizona-shooting-suspect-stopped-police-morning-rampage/