imported post
Well, the implication was that they would forcibly search you and confiscate your weapon if they suspected you had one.
I guess I should have been more clear in my wording- if they did anything other than ask you to leave, or ask you to relinquish a weapon, in other words, anything physical, then they would be assaulting and unlawfully detaining you, as long as you hadn't broken any laws (signs and corporate policies do not count).
"Private security guards are not held to lawful search and seizure like LEO's are. "
I think that's what I said, except I used the possibly more correct term "pro forma" rather than lawful.
A security guard can't "unlawfully" search you because there is no law against search by a private citizen. But if he forcibly detains you and physically manhandles you, then he has committed assault, unless he can produce the justification that he was protecting himself or others from a clear threat, not a person who committed no legal infraction. As far as I can tell, violating a posted policy against firearmsdoes not constitute a priori trespass- they still have to ask you to leave before your presence becomes illegal. Also, if he siezes your property, he has committed theft. If he is armed and uses the threat of physical force, he has committed armed robbery. The difference between theft and government 'seizure' is thatthe latteris under color of authority andit is illegal to resist the act physically (extrapolating from 'resisting arrest'), but itmay be (must be?)redressed by challenging the legitimacy of the seizure under formal due process laws.
In other words, if a cop takes your gun illegally, it is still illegal for you to resist if you're aware he is a cop. If a robber or private citizen attempts to deprive you of property, it IS legal to resist, in a manner consistent with logical escalation of force, i.e. physical force to resist the theft, then deadly force if and when the perp threatens your life or well-being in reaction to your physical force resistance of the theft.
I can't brandish my gun to prevent you taking my car that I left running at the curb while I grab a cuppa at Starbucks. But if you're smashing open the window of my car in my driveway, and when I challenge you, you start toward me waving the crowbar, then I can shoot you because you're now a credible threat to my life.
Back to the security guard: just because somebody has a shiny piece of metal on the chest, and a blue-ish looking set of clothes, doesn't mean he has any authority to detain you. There are laws against impersonating a police officer, I'm not aware of any penalties for simply dressing like a security guard. Who knows who that guy really is? There have been cases of people impersonating both and abusing people's respect for authority.
If the rent-a-cop approaches you in a reasonable manner and reasonably requests reasonable things, fine. If they think they are THE MAN, then it is time to start considering how far one will comply. (I say this despite having briefly paid my bills bywearing a goofy-ass security guard uniform for several months during one of the more benighted period of my life. Licensed by the state of Oregon, no less.)
I hope I made sense through all of my meandering.