VA chp holder charged in philly shooting

[Grapeshot]

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Jonesy wrote:

Some of the members over there (http://www.pafoa.org/)
don't seem to have a clue as to what circumstances would allow the use of lethal force as justified self defense. You would think most people would have enough common sense to study the law a little bit before carrying a weapon. And all the jumping to conclusions when the video doesn't show what led up to this imho does not present enough evidence to determine whether the shooting is justified. The evidence should come out in court if it gets that far.

I find PaFOA people to generally be very knowledgeable - some extremely so.

All forums do contain people with varying degrees of expertise, true enough here too.

We are not trying the case here - rather making observations and thinking out loud.

You are right though, time will tell. Hope all involved get a fair shake.

Yata hey

 

[Jonesy]

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Grapeshot wrote:

Jonesy wrote:

Some of the members over there (http://www.pafoa.org/)
don't seem to have a clue as to what circumstances would allow the use of lethal force as justified self defense. You would think most people would have enough common sense to study the law a little bit before carrying a weapon. And all the jumping to conclusions when the video doesn't show what led up to this imho does not present enough evidence to determine whether the shooting is justified. The evidence should come out in court if it gets that far.

I find PaFOA people to generally be very knowledgeable - some extremely so.

All forums do contain people with varying degrees of expertise, true enough here too.

We are not trying the case here - rather making observations and thinking out loud.

You are right though, time will tell. Hope all involved get a fair shake.

Yata hey

I guess you are right, we have varying degrees of knowledge here as well. Everyone after all has to start at the beginning, and some of the members over there did seem knowledgeable.

 

[Neplusultra]

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His first court appearance is going to be Monday? I thought thehabeus corpus limit was 24 hours?

 

[Jonesy]

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Neplusultra wrote:

His first court appearance is going to be Monday? I thought thehabeus corpus limit was 24 hours?

He is out on bail.

 

[Grapeshot]

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Jonesy wrote:

Neplusultra wrote:

His first court appearance is going to be Monday? I thought thehabeus corpus limit was 24 hours?

He is out on bail.

Do we know who will be defending him yet?

Yata hey

 

[Neplusultra]

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Jonesy wrote:

Neplusultra wrote:

His first court appearance is going to be Monday? I thought thehabeus corpus limit was 24 hours?

He is out on bail.

Ah, so it's NOT his first appearance. But it is sloppy reporting, like the gun was taken by his girlfriend, but also recovered atthe scene.......

 

[Jonesy]

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Neplusultra wrote:

Jonesy wrote:

Neplusultra wrote:

His first court appearance is going to be Monday? I thought thehabeus corpus limit was 24 hours?

He is out on bail.

Ah, so it's NOT his first appearance. But it is sloppy reporting, like the gun was taken by his girlfriend, but also recovered atthe scene.......

Yeah, that seems unclear. The docket does not list a lawyer: http://ujsportal.pacourts.us/DocketSheets/CPReport.aspx?matterID=201683609

 

[nuc65]

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Jonesy wrote:

paramedic70002 wrote:

TFred wrote:

One thing caught my eye... the author of this report claims that several news reports have said the gun was recovered several miles away at the Ung's home.

Seems rather odd, since he was arrested on the spot. All I've ever read about being involved in a self-defense shooting is to hand the gun over to the cops as soon as they show up.

TFred

If at his direction his GF took the gun home prior to the LEOs showing up that changes a lot. Shows guilt on the part of the shooter. Strange stuff.

Some of the members over there (http://www.pafoa.org/)
don't seem to have a clue as to what circumstances would allow the use of lethal force as justified self defense. You would think most people would have enough common sense to study the law a little bit before carrying a weapon. And all the jumping to conclusions when the video doesn't show what led up to this imho does not present enough evidence to determine whether the shooting is justified. The evidence should come out in court if it gets that far.

The news article I posted earlier says that the gun was recovered at the scene so I don't know where the rumor started about the gun not being recovered on scene. I saw enough of the video where at least 4 men are following a couple. Then I see a quick movement toward them by the group of men. Then I see somebody try to grab the gun. It seems enough. It really doesn't matter what led up to it, the shooter is trying to leave and is being followed, he is attacked, probably fearing for his and/or his friend lives does what he believes he must to protect himself. But lacking the political connections of the attacker ends up charged with everything that one can be charged with.

This link has a note about a 'plausible' defense because Ung was rushed by a group (gang of thugs).
http://blackpoliticalthought.blogspot.com/2010/01/gerald-ung-third-year-law-student.html

However, legal troubles are probably on the horizon because it appears that he did speak to authorities. I read in a few articles that Ung told authorities it was self-defense and he is graduate law student. So it appears he didn't exercise his 5th amendment right to silence.

VaTuck posted the PA statutes on the first page for review.

 

[jegoodin]

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It will be interesting to see the spin put on the video by the two parties.

What I saw was a packfollowing a guy holding his GF's hand. One of the wolf pack goes wide to the right to circle around for an attack and actually grabs the GF. It appears it is at that point where the guy pulls out his weapon. And appropriately the wolf steps back, but at that point the second aggressor steps forward.

The man with the gun can be seen back pedaling trying to withdraw, but the would-be assailant keeps on coming. You see the assailantcontinue to engage and then throw a punch. He comes up and grabs for the gun and at that point you see the first muzzle flash. The assualt continues with either more punches or more grabbing with a few additional muzzle flashes as they both tumble down and out of the field of camera view.

That's what I see.

 

[Pagan]

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I could not tell what the hek was going on in that video, very jumpy and blurred, perhapsI should try a frame by frame view:?.

 

[peter nap]

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Pagan wrote:

I could not tell what the hek was going on in that video, very jumpy and blurred, perhapsI should try a frame by frame view:?.

I watched it a dozen times, then copied it, enhanced it and slowed it down.

Here's my take on it.

He was walking and something not on video happened. From the story they bumped Rocky while he was showing off.

The group followed them presumably making ample use of the Fawk" word.

In the video, it shows the couple on a well lighted street with people around and the Bowery Boys still following. Ung turned around at least once walking backward and apparently stilll trying to get away. Who knows what was being said but he was trying to get away. There was some distance between the groups there.

Then, for some reason, it looks like they're on a street with no one else around and they stop. I don't know why and that's important...to me anyway....

The girl friend is on one side with one of the BG's and jerks her hand loose. Ung has drawn his gun which I think was a mistake. If he was hoing to do it, it should have been done when he had some distance. Rocky makes a grab for the gun and actually gets his hand on it and Ung shoots.

I can't tell how many but again from the news, twice. That seems to be OK. Both go down.
Somehow after they go down, Rocky gets shot 4 more times. If he gets a legal thumping, I think those last 4 shots will be the reason.

So two mistakes IMO. He should have done one of two things. He should have drawn his gun l;ong before he did or he should have kept it holstered or waited until Rocky really hurt him or the GF.

the second mistake was carrying a .38. If you have to shoot someone, use enough gun. The more you shoot, the more you have to explain.

 

[TFred]

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Looks like DiDonato's family's version of the events are now the news. Gotta love that overly descriptive "something ensued"... could that be the part where "DiDonato and his 5 jock buddies followed Ung, cursing and threatening him and his girlfriend until he felt sufficiently threatened to defend his life?"

Somehow I don't imagine that part will ever get reported.

TFred


http://www.philly.com/philly/news/homepage/82231277.html?cmpid=15585797

Nova grad reportedly stepped in front of gun to save friends in Old City shooting

By STEPHANIE FARR
Philadelphia Daily News

farrs@phillynews.com 215-854-4225

A representative for the family of a Villanova grad who was shot six times allegedly by a law student in Old City last weekend, said that the victim stepped in front of the gun to save his two friends.

Edward "Eddie" DiDonato Jr., 23, is still in critical condition at Thomas Jefferson University Hospital, where he's expected to undergo his fourth surgery today, said Gina Furia Rubel, a close friend of the DiDonato family who is acting as their spokeswoman.

"The fact that Eddie is alive is a true miracle," she said at a news conference held outside the Criminal Justice Center in Center City yesterday.

Rubel, who is also president and chief executive officer of Furia Rubel Communications, a local public-relations and marketing firm, said that DiDonato's feeding tube has been removed but he still has "a long road ahead."

Gerald Ung, 28, a Virginia native in his fourth year at Temple Law School, is accused of shooting DiDonato in his hand, chest and abdomen six times in six seconds, according to police and Rubel.

She said that two of those bullets were fired from just 4 1/2 feet away. DiDonato, of Blue Bell, suffered injuries to his lungs, liver, intestines and colon.

The shooting, which occurred outside Fox 29's studios, on Market Street near 4th, was caught on video by the station's surveillance cameras. The DiDonato family has seen the video, Rubel said.

Despite more than two dozen witnesses allegedly on scene, details about what led to the altercation remain scant.

Police will only say that there was an argument before the shooting. Rubel said yesterday that DiDonato and some friends were walking to get a cab after a night out in Old City and they were "messing around" on some scaffolding.

"One of them was pushed, something ensued and Eddie got shot," Rubel said, noting that the family had been told that DiDonato stepped in front of the gun and saved the lives of his two friends.

His family considers him a hero, Rubel said.

Ung waited at the scene for authorities to arrive and his gun was confiscated, police said.

"The family isn't saying anything about the man accused of doing this," Rubel said. "Right now all the family cares about is that Eddie survives this awful tragedy."

DiDonato, the son of Center City attorney Edward DiDonato Sr. and Marianne DiDonato, sister of city Republican leader Michael Meehan, graduated from Villanova last spring.

Ung was to graduate from law school this spring. He is charged with attempted murder and related offenses. He was released Monday on 10 percent of $200,000 bail.

Repeated calls to his family's home in Virginia have not been returned.

A Facebook group titled "Gerald Ung is Innocent" had grown from 36 members Tuesday night to 173 last night.

 

[c45man]

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Was he right? Was he wrong? It boils down to the defense attorney's ability to pick a sympathetic jury. The defense has the advantage in a jury trial in that the defending counsel only has to convince one person of his client's justification, on the other hand, the D.A. has to convince all of the 12 member jury of the defendant's guilt.

I might add for the sake of people who are unaware of the fact that the Philadelphia District Attorneys' office has the lowest felony conviction rate of any large city Prosecutors' Office. Great news for the shooter.

 

[peter nap]

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That's pretty good Fred. They have a PR firm it tell the story.

DiDonato, the son of Center City attorney Edward DiDonato Sr. and Marianne DiDonato, sister of city Republican leader Michael Meehan, graduated from Villanova last spring.

You rekon he coulda shot someone with a little pull. Even if he walks on this, it'll be in civil court untill hell freezes over.

 

[peter nap]

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two of those bullets were fired from just 4 1/2 feet away.

I wonder if they were the first two or last. I didn't see any shots until the grab for the gun.

 

[TFred]

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peter nap wrote:

two of those bullets were fired from just 4 1/2 feet away.

I wonder if they were the first two or last. I didn't see any shots until the grab for the gun.

Hard to say. One apparently went through his hand, I would assume that was the first one as he was going for the grab... maybe lacrosse players have unusually long arms?

TFred

 

[marshaul]

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TFred wrote:

Duct Tape Alert!

This guy is already convicted in the press:

Family: Old City Shooting Victim 'Hero'
Critically-Wounded Victim To Have More Surgery

PHILADELPHIA - A recent college graduate is clinging to life following the Old City shooting caught on tape outside Fox 29's studios over the weekend.

On Wednesday, the family of 23-year-old Eddie DiDonato spoke out publicly for the first time and called him a hero.

"The fact that Eddie is alive is a true miracle," said Gina Rubel, a spokeswoman for DiDonato's family.

The La Salle College High School and Villanova University graduate was still listed in critical condition Wednesday at Thomas Jefferson University Hospital.

Fox 29's security cameras caught the violence at Fourth and Market streets on tape around 2:30 a.m.

DiDonato and a group of friends were playing around doing chin-ups, according to the family spokeswoman, after they'd been out earlier in Old City.

That's when the surveillance cameras captured shooting suspect Gerald Ung – a Temple University law student – walking and bumping DiDonato's group.

DiDonato and friends followed him, the video shows, and police said Ung pulled out a gun.

Family says that's when DiDonato stepped toward Ung, protecting his friends

Police said Ung fired multiple times.

"We want everyone to know that Eddie is our hero. He stepped in front of his two friends when they were presented with a .38-caliber gun that was being pointed at them. He took two bullets to the chest from four-and-a-half feet away, and within six seconds he was shot six times.

DiDonato has one more surgery, and that's scheduled for Thursday. Fox 29 News is told he is alert, talking and told his family he does remember the shooting.

Ung's first court appearance is scheduled for Monday.

Jeez. His parents remind me of the ever-present mother of any criminal stopped in an act of violence, "But it wasn't his fault! He couldn't have ever done anything wrong!"

Remember what I said about genes which have no business existing? This mother should be ashamed of her aggressing jock lout of a son, and should be making it clear how lucky he is to be alive, and how little he deserves that luck (from an evolutionary perspective). Instead, she coddles his misbehavior, calling him a "hero".

What a worthless piece of garbage.

 

[peter nap]

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marshaul wrote:

TFred wrote:

Duct Tape Alert!

This guy is already convicted in the press:

Family: Old City Shooting Victim 'Hero'
Critically-Wounded Victim To Have More Surgery

PHILADELPHIA - A recent college graduate is clinging to life following the Old City shooting caught on tape outside Fox 29's studios over the weekend.

On Wednesday, the family of 23-year-old Eddie DiDonato spoke out publicly for the first time and called him a hero.

"The fact that Eddie is alive is a true miracle," said Gina Rubel, a spokeswoman for DiDonato's family.

The La Salle College High School and Villanova University graduate was still listed in critical condition Wednesday at Thomas Jefferson University Hospital.

Fox 29's security cameras caught the violence at Fourth and Market streets on tape around 2:30 a.m.

DiDonato and a group of friends were playing around doing chin-ups, according to the family spokeswoman, after they'd been out earlier in Old City.

That's when the surveillance cameras captured shooting suspect Gerald Ung – a Temple University law student – walking and bumping DiDonato's group.

DiDonato and friends followed him, the video shows, and police said Ung pulled out a gun.

Family says that's when DiDonato stepped toward Ung, protecting his friends

Police said Ung fired multiple times.

"We want everyone to know that Eddie is our hero. He stepped in front of his two friends when they were presented with a .38-caliber gun that was being pointed at them. He took two bullets to the chest from four-and-a-half feet away, and within six seconds he was shot six times.

DiDonato has one more surgery, and that's scheduled for Thursday. Fox 29 News is told he is alert, talking and told his family he does remember the shooting.

Ung's first court appearance is scheduled for Monday.

Jeez. His parents remind me of the ever-present mother of any criminal stopped in an act of violence, "But it wasn't his fault! He couldn't have ever done anything wrong!"

Remember what I said about genes which have no business existing? This mother should be ashamed of her aggressing jock lout of a son, and should be making it clear how lucky he is to be alive, and how little he deserves that luck (from an evolutionary perspective). Instead, she coddles his misbehavior, calling him a "hero".

What a worthless piece of garbage.

I've been doing some research on the family:

The only reason that the Philly story is news is the victim is part of a very wealthy and powerful family. Old city is one of the main clubbing spots and every other month there is a drunken stabbing or shooting at 2:30 a.m..

The story doesn't mention his father is one of the wealthiest and politically connected lawyers in Philadelphia. It does mention that his uncle is a powerful politician.

 

[nuc65]

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peter nap wrote:

marshaul wrote:

TFred wrote:

Duct Tape Alert!

Ung's first court appearance is scheduled for Monday.

Jeez.
What a worthless piece of garbage.

I've been doing some research on the family:

The only reason that the Philly story is news is the victim is part of a very wealthy and powerful family. Old city is one of the main clubbing spots and every other month there is a drunken stabbing or shooting at 2:30 a.m..

The story doesn't mention his father is one of the wealthiest and politically connected lawyers in Philadelphia. It does mention that his uncle is a powerful politician.

This is part of the game that the MSM plays. The use of the word victim in place of aggressor, punk, attacker or other such is part of the portrayal of who did what. In this case I am of the opinion that the victim is Ung and the gang member that got shot is the criminal.

 

[marshaul]

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What scum.