VA-ALERT: VCDL is organizing NOW to fight back - we need YOU to do your part!

[longwatch]

Governor Northam wants war Northam has declared war on Virginia's gun owners: CHP holders, open carriers, hunters, target shooters, sport shooters, collectors, and competitors. All of us. (Northam wants to strip us of our right to self-defense and is even looking at confiscating guns.) So be it! But we are very much in the fight As the dust cloud has been settling from election day, my optimism that we can derail a lot of Northam's agenda has been growing steadily. Admiral Yamamoto, after bombing Pearl Harbor in 1941, famously said, "I fear that all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve." Yes, that is exactly what Pearl Harbor did. And that's exactly what shoving gun control down our throats will do, too! And we are tired of so called "compromises," that always involve us giving up some of our rights, and getting absolutely nothing in return. That is not a compromise, that's stupid! Virginia's gun owners are model citizens, with CHP holders being the most law-abiding of the law-abiding. We are fed up with being punished and pushed around every time some lunatic shoots up another gun-free zone or some gang-banger kills a bunch of other criminals. We have no more patience for being abused and we won't cede another inch without a fight. There is no such thing as "common sense gun control." In reality, gun control is a black hole that sucks common sense and our liberties into oblivion! It hits poor minorities and women the hardest, but it ultimately affects all good people. Criminals get their hand slapped and are released to continue their acts of mayhem with illegally owned firearms. A government that doesn't want its citizens to be able to protect themselves clearly has an ulterior motive for wanting a disarmed populace. We dare not turn over our guns to such a government, ever. It's time to organize and create a "machine" that will fight back wherever gun control rears it's head We can put a major dent in Northam's plans if we begin preparing and organizing NOW, before the new General Assembly is sworn-in in early January. Here's what we need to do (alerts will be going out on these items soon): Strong gun-owner activism in Democratic districts. Democrat legislators in some of the more pro-gun areas of the state voted gun owners with impunity over the last 4 years because they knew the Republican majority would never let gun-control bills become law. Thus, their bad votes wouldn't actually change the status quo and probably wouldn't wakeup and anger gun owners in their district. With the new Democrat majority, they will own any gun control that gets passed for the next two years. Gun owners living in such districts need to be extremely active. Reach out to other gun owners in the district to get them involved, get them on VA-ALERT, and have them join VCDL. Contact your Democrat Senator and/or Delegate and keep the pressure on them to steer clear of all gun control. Go to their office and meet in person. Some anti-gun Democrats have actually told our members that they have never met with anyone who opposes their anti-gun voting! If enough gun owners do this, it WILL get their attention. Contact your Democrat legislators whenever VCDL requests you do so. Let there be no doubt: you can play an absolutely crucial role in slowing down, moderating, or stopping major parts of Northam's agenda by putting pressure on your Democrat legislators! Watch Teams for local government (WTLGs). For each locality in Virginia, we need a team consisting of one or more local members to watch everything that the Board of Supervisors or City Council is doing. The WTLGs are looking for anything that affects firearms in any way, including hunting restrictions, and keep VCDL informed of what is planned or occurring so we can react. If we lose Virginia's preemption law, WTLGs will be critical in the effort to block local gun-control. Liaison Teams for Local Government (LTLGs). For localities that have some gun-friendly supervisors or council members, we need to be able to interface with them. The purpose is to get inside-track information on any proposed gun control or hunting restrictions, as well as to work with them to implement pro-gun ordinances or resolutions. For example, making the locality a Second Amendment Sanctuary against unconstitutional gun-control laws, or lowering CHP fees. Liaison Teams for Law Enforcement (LTLEs). LTLEs will interface with local sheriffs or chiefs of police who are supportive of gun owners and are willing to stand with us in preserving our rights. When an appropriate time comes, we will be looking for chief law-enforcement officers who would be willing to speak with one voice with gun owners at the General Assembly. We would also want to be looking for chief law-enforcement officers who would be willing to make their jurisdiction a Second Amendment Sanctuary against any gun control that is unconstitutional. No law-enforcement officer is required to enforce, or should enforce, an unconstitutional law. More volunteers at the VCDL table at gun shows, festivals, and other events. Just this weekend in Richmond, there were gun owners who approached the VCDL table and had no clue about how precariously their rights are hanging after the election - I kid you not! We must educate our fellow gun owners on the threat that we now face. Do NOT assume they know what you know! Advance litigation preparation in case we have to use the courts to stop unconstitutional gun laws. VCDL and its attorneys are developing contingency plans. A huge Lobby Day on January 20, 2020 (starts at 8 am at the General Assembly Building in Richmond). Speakers for the rally (11am - noon) are being lined up and will be announced as the event draws nearer. This time the rally will be in an excellent, picturesque location on the steps of the Capitol, instead of in the field by the Bell Tower! More Second Amendment Sanctuaries are coming! VCDL has already been approached by several localities which want to become Second Amendment Sanctuaries! (We expect this trend to continue.) VCDL has given them some guidance and I expect to see announcements of such sanctuaries starting in January. Patience, please, as VCDL is dealing with a flood of incoming information and requests I am personally getting over 700 emails a day (as I write this, I have 1,004 unread emails in my inbox since Friday), plus phone calls, texts, and Facebook contacts, as well as doing radio interviews and speaking at meetings. Please bear with me and the organization as we slog through the flood of information and requests. (The other Board members and some of our executive members are doing their best to take up the slack. The VCDL-PAC is compiling some useful information to help with the upcoming fight in the General Assembly.) Don't listen to the defeatists. That is exactly what our opponents want us to do. Be fearless, stand strong and united with all your fellow gun owners, and be ready to fight back when the time comes!

 

[longwatch]

I would expect most here have already seen this but just in case anyone isn't getting the VA-Alert.

 

[Barros Serrano]

I'm in Virginia and think this issue can be addressed without the hyperbole I see here.

I have a concealed carry permit in VA and am among those who are very law-abiding and will never shoot ANYONE except in self-defense or to prevent someone else from being shot by a criminal or terrorist.

Nonetheless, we cannot allow the current situation to continue where mentally unhinged people show up in public places with huge magazines spraying bullets hither and yon. Something has to be done to weed out the dubious people from acquiring such weapons.

Surely in this country we have enough intelligence to accomplish this without retreating into our dysfunctionally polarized stances as always happens these days.

I really believe that the courts would declare un-Constitutional any attempt to confiscate my pistols or rifles, possession of which is guaranteed by the 2nd Amendment, clearly. However, where does this right end? With the AK? Bazookas? Heavy artillery? Tanks? I know there has to be a line drawn somewhere, which will not infringe on our rights as hunters, collectors, self-defenders and so on.

Hysterical caterwauling about gun-grabbing and commies and fascists and so on gets us nowhere.

 

[color of law]

I'm in Virginia and think this issue can be addressed without the hyperbole I see here.

I have a concealed carry permit in VA and am among those who are very law-abiding and will never shoot ANYONE except in self-defense or to prevent someone else from being shot by a criminal or terrorist.

Nonetheless, we cannot allow the current situation to continue where mentally unhinged people show up in public places with huge magazines spraying bullets hither and yon. Something has to be done to weed out the dubious people from acquiring such weapons.

Surely in this country we have enough intelligence to accomplish this without retreating into our dysfunctionally polarized stances as always happens these days.

I really believe that the courts would declare un-Constitutional any attempt to confiscate my pistols or rifles, possession of which is guaranteed by the 2nd Amendment, clearly. However, where does this right end? With the AK? Bazookas? Heavy artillery? Tanks? I know there has to be a line drawn somewhere, which will not infringe on our rights as hunters, collectors, self-defenders and so on.

Hysterical caterwauling about gun-grabbing and commies and fascists and so on gets us nowhere.

I think you should have taken some time and read this forum in detail. In my humble opinion your views defy history and places you in an unsupported position, in that, true gun rights have been achieved by hard nosed activism. Passivity is what has gotten us in this mess.

 

[riverrat10k]

I've been lax lately for various reasons.

Back in bidness.

 

[longwatch]

I'm in Virginia and think this issue can be addressed without the hyperbole I see here.

I have a concealed carry permit in VA and am among those who are very law-abiding and will never shoot ANYONE except in self-defense or to prevent someone else from being shot by a criminal or terrorist.

Nonetheless, we cannot allow the current situation to continue where mentally unhinged people show up in public places with huge magazines spraying bullets hither and yon. Something has to be done to weed out the dubious people from acquiring such weapons.

Surely in this country we have enough intelligence to accomplish this without retreating into our dysfunctionally polarized stances as always happens these days.

I really believe that the courts would declare un-Constitutional any attempt to confiscate my pistols or rifles, possession of which is guaranteed by the 2nd Amendment, clearly. However, where does this right end? With the AK? Bazookas? Heavy artillery? Tanks? I know there has to be a line drawn somewhere, which will not infringe on our rights as hunters, collectors, self-defenders and so on.

Hysterical caterwauling about gun-grabbing and commies and fascists and so on gets us nowhere.

I hope you are right about the courts but so far that route has not worked out really well in NY, CA, MD, MJ, or CT. Somebody is also going to have to be the test case at risk of freedom livelihood and fortune. Any volunteers?

 

[Barros Serrano]

I think you should have taken some time and read this forum in detail. In my humble opinion your views defy history and places you in an unsupported position, in that, true gun rights have been achieved by hard nosed activism. Passivity is what has gotten us in this mess.

I'm not advocating passivity, but reasoned discourse which will produce more results than in-your-face activism!

I could make the analogy that you're advocating that I be the Black Panthers, while I'm trying to behave more like Dr. King. I acknowledge that both approaches can be productive, but this country right now is very polarized and angry, and a civil war is the last thing any sane person wants or needs.

Really there is no level of oppression occurring against gun owners like myself which justifies such in-your-face militancy.

So I am not really advocating passivity, but rather reasoned discourse. I don't think I need to carry an AK into Wendy's in order to defend gun rights.

Probably the best thing one could do to support the 2nd Amendment is to engage in such reasonable conversation, rather than confrontation. You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar, I've heard.

 

[color of law]

I'm not advocating passivity, but reasoned discourse which will produce more results than in-your-face activism!

I could make the analogy that you're advocating that I be the Black Panthers, while I'm trying to behave more like Dr. King. I acknowledge that both approaches can be productive, but this country right now is very polarized and angry, and a civil war is the last thing any sane person wants or needs.

Really there is no level of oppression occurring against gun owners like myself which justifies such in-your-face militancy.

So I am not really advocating passivity, but rather reasoned discourse. I don't think I need to carry an AK into Wendy's in order to defend gun rights.

Probably the best thing one could do to support the 2nd Amendment is to engage in such reasonable conversation, rather than confrontation. You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar, I've heard.

Reasoned discourse or reasonable conversation does not work with communists. Anti-gun activists are not progressives or socialists, they are communists. Progressivism and socialism are disguises for communism.

 

[2a4all]

I'm not advocating passivity, but reasoned discourse which will produce more results than in-your-face activism!

I could make the analogy that you're advocating that I be the Black Panthers, while I'm trying to behave more like Dr. King. I acknowledge that both approaches can be productive, but this country right now is very polarized and angry, and a civil war is the last thing any sane person wants or needs.

Really there is no level of oppression occurring against gun owners like myself which justifies such in-your-face militancy.

So I am not really advocating passivity, but rather reasoned discourse. I don't think I need to carry an AK into Wendy's in order to defend gun rights.

Probably the best thing one could do to support the 2nd Amendment is to engage in such reasonable conversation, rather than confrontation. You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar, I've heard.

We have attempted reasoned discourse with the anti-gun folks many times. We have not been very successful with their hard-liners (yes, there are many of the). As an example, I have had a number of conversations with my state senator, both at my house (he was campaigning and I answered my door OCing) and in his (Richmond) office. He is not what I would call an anti-gunner, but he doesn't get high marks for 2A support either.

We've talked about background checks, and he doesn't understand why I object to them, since they are not unduly inconvenient (only take a few minutes) and law abiding citizens nearly always pass. He thinks that law-abiding citizens shouldn't have a problem with being verified as such. When I point out that these checks are flawed due to insufficient data and cause innocent people to be flagged as prohibited, he thinks such incidents serve as opportunities to correct the system. When I point out that such checks don't stop criminals from buying guns, he's perplexed about how they can do that. After all, why would an accomplice who could pass a background check (aka straw purchaser) knowingly commit a crime by lying on a 4473?

Regarding magazine limits, he said he noticed that I always carry an extra magazine which seemed small, and asked if I was OK with magazine limits. I told him that the size of my gun and mag were selected for personal comfort, with the caveat that would I have enough ammo to defend myself.

He hasn't been on any committees that deal with firearms, so his influence has been nil. That may change come January.

 

[OC for ME]

Dealing with politicians requires a measured approach when discussing enumerated rights. Unfortunately it is many a cop who engage the lawfully armed citizen that refuse to engage the armed citizen with a measured approach.

Cops, as a institution, refuse to hold the anti-individual liberty citizen accountable for lodging a false report.

The burden must be placed on LE to educate our fellow citizens....yeah, I know...good luck with that...

 

[FreedomVA]

Do to them what they do to us, then they will see the light of common sense

 

[Barros Serrano]

Reasoned discourse or reasonable conversation does not work with communists. Anti-gun activists are not progressives or socialists, they are communists. Progressivism and socialism are disguises for communism.

Sorry, but this is hyperbole. No, they are not communists. There are very few communists in this country. In fact, communism is virtually dead in the world. N Korea can call itself communist, but in fact is just an insane asylum run by the craziest inmate.

Progressivism and socialism are not communism. Every other developed nation is demosocialist. So are you condemning Germany, UK, France, New Zealand, Canada, Israel, Japan, Spain, Belgium, Denmark, etc., as "communist"?

There are plenty of people advocating gun control who are moderate Democrats. As USA politics has been pushed rightward since Reagan, many Republicans nowadays think a centrist is a commie. Bulldooky!

And I'd have to observe that those who think Democrats are commies are generally of fascist ideology themselves. This is a democratic society, and if someone advocates for a minimum wage increase or environmental protection, they are not communists!

The issue of gun control, like any other, needs to be discussed rationally. I am basically a Kennedy Democrat, hate Trump, hated Reagan, and support the Constitution, which includes my right to keep and bear arms, which I practice. I also hate communism, as I have studied it and know very well what an abysmal disaster was the USSR. I could give you complex theoretical reasons why Marx screwed up, and why Marxist-Leninism is doomed to fail (as it has already done).

Reagan signed the assault weapons ban. Was he a communist?

 

[FreedomVA]

sometime communism is disguised as a, Wolf in Sheep clothing

 

[Barros Serrano]

We have attempted reasoned discourse with the anti-gun folks many times. We have not been very successful with their hard-liners (yes, there are many of the). As an example, I have had a number of conversations with my state senator, both at my house (he was campaigning and I answered my door OCing) and in his (Richmond) office. He is not what I would call an anti-gunner, but he doesn't get high marks for 2A support either.

We've talked about background checks, and he doesn't understand why I object to them, since they are not unduly inconvenient (only take a few minutes) and law abiding citizens nearly always pass. He thinks that law-abiding citizens shouldn't have a problem with being verified as such. When I point out that these checks are flawed due to insufficient data and cause innocent people to be flagged as prohibited, he thinks such incidents serve as opportunities to correct the system. When I point out that such checks don't stop criminals from buying guns, he's perplexed about how they can do that. After all, why would an accomplice who could pass a background check (aka straw purchaser) knowingly commit a crime by lying on a 4473?

Regarding magazine limits, he said he noticed that I always carry an extra magazine which seemed small, and asked if I was OK with magazine limits. I told him that the size of my gun and mag were selected for personal comfort, with the caveat that would I have enough ammo to defend myself.

He hasn't been on any committees that deal with firearms, so his influence has been nil. That may change come January.

Any policy has some flaws, including background checks, but I wonder, what DO we do to stop all the mass shootings? They continue to occur, and very often the people with the guns shooting random people are already known to Police as having mental problems.

So what do we do? Nothing? That is not satisfactory, especially with parents sending their children to school!

For self-defense you do not need a huge magazine such as those carried by mass shooters. Just how large a magazine should be permitted? I can't answer that. I also do not know where the limits should be. Should we be allowed the right to carry shoulder-mounted rocket launchers? Where DO we draw the line. This discussion has to occur, and while on the gun-rights side there is much intransigence, it is just as bad on the gun-control side, and this is the case with ANY issue today in the USA: absolute polarization, and an utter inability to discuss, cooperate or compromise. This bodes ill for this country. Civil conflict is not a good thing. Some on the right advocate shooting Democrats. Good luck with that, because I'll be shooting back, but is that where we want to go?

You know, if we got Jefferson, Madison, Franklin and Lincoln (2 from each Party) together, they'd SOLVE problems rather than sit in opposite corners pouting as is the norm today. Let's act more like those guys and less like Mitch McConnell, eh?

 

[Barros Serrano]

sometime communism is disguised as a, Wolf in Sheep clothing

And sometimes fascism pretends to be "conservative".

Let's keep this country democratic and free.

 

[FreedomVA]

And sometimes fascism pretends to be "conservative".

Let's keep this country democratic and free.

There is no such thing as a democratic and free USA...everyone here pay for their Freedom with taxes and nowadays you don't get much for your money either

 

[Barros Serrano]

There is no such thing as a democratic and free USA...everyone here pay for their Freedom with taxes and nowadays you don't get much for your money either

That is very simplistic. While I agree that the govt can be inefficient, and in fact spends the money on the wrong things sometimes (e.g., subsidizing Monsanto), it is simply not true that if we pay taxes we're not free!

In the past we've gotten a good deal from govt on occasion, as when Eisenhower built the interstate highway system without incurring any debt. As long as the ultra-rich are relieved of their tax burden while folks like us who actually WORK are paying it, then there's a problem.

And when private contributions fund political campaigns, obviously corporations and billionaires can buy elections, and so that curtails democracy, certainly.

So... our system is not perfect, and currently is not functioning well, in large part due to the inability of the 2 Parties to talk to each other. Certainly the megalomaniac currently occupying the White House is making this worse. Perhaps we need to do as some countries and require people to vote, with some inducement. Full participation I'm sure would be better than the current situation when often less than half the electorate bothers to vote.

 

[FreedomVA]

How Much Did the Interstate Highway System Cost to Build - History

Ballpark Estimate: $114 billion (1956-1991 dollars); $500 billion (2008 dollars) Holding the distinction of being the largest in the world, the Interstate Highway System is a coast to coast network of state-owned roads. It is a system of high-speed highways that serves every major city in the...

www.whatitcosts.com

"it is highly likely that many primary Interstate Highways will be converted into turnpikes (toll roads) to help defray this growing expense. "

"Perhaps we need to do as some countries and require people to vote, with some inducement. Full participation I'm sure would be better than the current situation when often less than half the electorate bothers to vote. "

kinda contradictory and communist thinking, isn't it?

 

[solus]

Sorry, but this is hyperbole. No, they are not communists. There are very few communists in this country. In fact, communism is virtually dead in the world. N Korea can call itself communist, but in fact is just an insane asylum run by the craziest inmate.

Progressivism and socialism are not communism. Every other developed nation is demosocialist. So are you condemning Germany, UK, France, New Zealand, Canada, Israel, Japan, Spain, Belgium, Denmark, etc., as "communist"?

There are plenty of people advocating gun control who are moderate Democrats. As USA politics has been pushed rightward since Reagan, many Republicans nowadays think a centrist is a commie. Bulldooky!

And I'd have to observe that those who think Democrats are commies are generally of fascist ideology themselves. This is a democratic society, and if someone advocates for a minimum wage increase or environmental protection, they are not communists!

The issue of gun control, like any other, needs to be discussed rationally. I am basically a Kennedy Democrat, hate Trump, hated Reagan, and support the Constitution, which includes my right to keep and bear arms, which I practice. I also hate communism, as I have studied it and know very well what an abysmal disaster was the USSR. I could give you complex theoretical reasons why Marx screwed up, and why Marxist-Leninism is doomed to fail (as it has already done).

Reagan signed the assault weapons ban. Was he a communist?

so nice to see a recent political science graduate on the forum...under or grad ~ surely not a terminal candidate..

 

[Barros Serrano]

so nice to see a recent political science graduate on the forum...under or grad ~ surely not a terminal candidate..

Nope, not a poli sci major. But I'm well informed regarding politics, social issues, etc.

I know that a properly functioning democratic country can NOT be fascist or communist. Socialist, yes, if it is the demosocialism we see in every other developed nation, and to some degree in the USA (e.g., Medicare).