Ryan tells Ohio he will protect our gun rights.

Jack House said:

Do I want 4 more years of rights hating, gun grabbing tom foolery or do I want 8 years of rights hating, gun grabbing tom foolery followed by 8 years of whatever rights hating, gun grabbing politician the Democrats decide to sick on us? Answer: I want the cycle to stop, which means withdrawing my support of it by voting for a candidate that will put an end to the vicious cycle.

No more party politics for me, I refuse to be a part of the group that is going to doom our nation.

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^^^^This. Very well said.

As I stated, I have nothing more to say on the subject. However, since the key line in my one thing to say was not quoted with the rest, I will simply repeat it:

"When your finger is poised over the button, I implore you to think about this just one more time, search your heart, and do the right thing."

Jack House said:

If everyone that thought like him, voted for him, the Republicans would lose nearly their entire voter base and the Democrats would lose a huge portion as well.


Nope, if Johnson were not in the race, most of his supporters would either right in Ron Paul or not vote. Those of us voting for Johnson are doing so because we feel he's the only person on the ballot worth voting for and that a vote for either Obama or Romney is consent for their anti-constitution actions.


Obama wants to ban guns. Romney has banned guns. Obama wants to take other misc rights away, so does Romney. There's no difference.


Obamacare is evil right? So what does that make the bill it was spawned from, which would be Romneycare? Obama wants to take away our rights, correct? That's why he appointed an anti-rights judge to SCOTUS, right? So what do you think Romney, who signed the strongest anti-gun rights law in the nation and supported the Clinton AWB?

Romney is not miles better than Obama. Don't kid yourself.


The less desirable candidate is Romney. Do I want 4 more years of rights hating, gun grabbing tom foolery or do I want 8 years of rights hating, gun grabbing tom foolery followed by 8 years of whatever rights hating, gun grabbing politician the Democrats decide to sick on us? Answer: I want the cycle to stop, which means withdrawing my support of it by voting for a candidate that will put an end to the vicious cycle.

No more party politics for me, I refuse to be a part of the group that is going to doom our nation.

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twoskinsonemanns said:

My "selfish desire" is for all men to have the most individual liberty possible in our society.
If enough of you value-compromising types remain blinded long enough you'll ruin our country. So amazing how fox news and the GOP pull your string so easily. Dance, little redbaron, dance.

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Interesting, you both play right into the hands of the Dems...they want you to vote this way...it benefits them.

Redbaron007 said:

Interesting, you both play right into the hands of the Dems...they want you to vote this way...it benefits them.

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News flash: There's 0 (ZERO, ZILCH, NADA) difference between the Republicans and the Democrats. The Republicans aren't the only ones losing votes to Johnson, a very large number of formerly Democrat voters will be voting Johnson as well.

I really wish you people would get it through your thick skulls that you're the biggest threat to this nation by continuing to vote for 'the lesser of two evils.' There is no such thing as a lesser of two evils. Both the Democrats and Republicans are evil, both equally support huge government, both salivate over the idea of a police state, both want to take a match to the constitution.

Guess what? Romney WILL lose this election. There's no doubt about it. Guess why? Because people just like you are going to vote for who they feel to be the lesser of two evils(L2E), only they will be voting for Obama.

All I hear from the L2E people are Romney is better because OBAMA. Obama is better because ROMNEY.

But but but REPUBLICAN
But but but DEMOCRAT
But but but GUNS
But but but RIGHTS
But but but EVIL

Obama catches a lot of flack for signing that NDAA bill with the indefinite detention clause. As he damn well should. But not when it means ignoring that the MAJORITY OF REPUBLICAN "REPRESENTATIVES" voted for that very same bill.

Obama gets a lot of flack for appointing rights hating politicians to SCOTUS. Where's the flack for the Republicans that CONFIRMED them?

I'm fairly positive that hatred for the wire tapping bill and PATRIOT Act is pretty close to universal here. So why is there so much staunch support for the Republicans who gave us those wholesale evil, constitution shredding bills?

Loads of hatred for the TSA. The TSA was created under Bush. Why do you keep forgetting this?

Almost every last one of you want to see Obama flayed for Fast And Furious. But that was a policy created by Bush and continued by Obama.

A vote for Romney/Republicans is a vote for the continued degradation of our rights. Until people realize this, this country is going to continue heading downhill and it's just going to pick up speed.

So I'd like to be the first person to thank you. Thank you, L2E people for ruining our country. Thank you for supporting tyranny and the destruction of our rights as human beings. Should there ever come a time when our country is forced into wide spread rebellion to topple a tyrannical government, I hope you hold you head high, you consented to tyranny, you voted it into office. You did. Not I, not the other people here that said "you know what? These party politics, they're damaging our country. They're dividing the people and making it easier for big government to conquer us. I refuse to continue supporting that which is destroying everything we as Americans have stood for during the last 200 some odd years."

So if you go and vote Romney, know that you're voting for a presidential candidate with a history of signing away our freedoms. Don't make excuses, be proud! Because when Romney loses and Obama continues to hold office, you got what exactly what you wanted: a rights hating, gun grabbing politician that is more concerned about increasing the government's illegal power, it's illegitimate authority, than protecting your rights.

eye95 said:

As I stated, I have nothing more to say on the subject. However, since the key line in my one thing to say was not quoted with the rest, I will simply repeat it:

"When your finger is poised over the button, I implore you to think about this just one more time, search your heart, and do the right thing."

Click to expand...

To be a bit more clear, I'll consider all that I know about the candidates, I will think about my choice and I'll vote with a clean conscience because I'll have decided that there will be

Jack House said:

No more party politics for me, I refuse to be a part of the group that is going to doom our nation.

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Redbaron007 said:

Interesting, you both play right into the hands of the Dems...they want you to vote this way...it benefits them.

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Interesting. You play right into the hands of the Repubs. They want you to vote this way. It benefits them.

Come on. Really. The Republicans had as much chance as the Dems over the last forty years to straighten things out. What we got was forty years of business-as-usual. They're just as culpable as the Dems. Sky-high debt, deficit spending (same thing), recessions, centrally-planned credit, inflation, a huge fedgov, rights-strangling regulation...

The Republicrats and Democans are just two wings of the same bird of prey. Neither is in it for the country. Both are in it for themselves.

Its about 99 years, five wars, and $54T past time to put a stop to it.

Citizen said:

Interesting. You play right into the hands of the Repubs. They want you to vote this way. It benefits them.

Come on. Really. The Republicans had as much chance as the Dems over the last forty years to straighten things out. What we got was forty years of business-as-usual. They're just as culpable as the Dems. Sky-high debt, deficit spending (same thing), recessions, centrally-planned credit, inflation, a huge fedgov, rights-strangling regulation...

The Republicrats and Democans are just two wings of the same bird of prey. Neither is in it for the country. Both are in it for themselves.

Its about 99 years, five wars, and $54T past time to put a stop to it.

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So voting for Gary Johnson fixes all this? In this election, I guess I don't mind being played by the repubs...it beats the Dems.

Can it be fixed in this election? Voting for who would resolve this issue?

Redbaron007 said:

But but but DEMOCRATS

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And voting for Republicans will fix or protect things how?

Edit: spellin'~

Redbaron007 said:

So voting for Gary Johnson fixes all this? In this election, I guess I don't mind being played by the repubs...it beats the Dems.

Can it be fixed in this election? Voting for who would resolve this issue?

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That's my point--no, it doesn't beat the Dem's. Both major parties are destructive beyond belief.

Lets look at it this way. (And, giving no ground to the Dem's, neither.)

The Republicans for all their yammer over the years about championing this and that have accomplished nothing substantive to roll back the massive fedgov, its regulations, its debt, its appetite to devour our freedoms for its own ends.

The Republicans have had over forty years to get such a rollback program organized, to cheerlead it to the country and to success. They always manage to promise this and that. Then throw us a little bone once in a while, but never enough bones to actually reverse course substantially and put us on a course of major rollback. They could have started this ball rolling years and years ago. This is the surest proof that they're out for themselves rather than the country.

Voting for Romney isn't going to fix it, either.

This is something that will take time. More people have to find out how destructive the major parties really are. You can start by finding out yourself.

Citizen said:

.....snip....

Voting for Romney isn't going to fix it, either.

This is something that will take time. More people have to find out how destructive the major parties really are. You can start by finding out yourself.

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You are correct....voting for Romney doesn't solve the problem. Never said it would. However, it provides the opportunity to slow it done and continue to debate and place pressure on the elected and those running to realize their overreach.

Keeping the current leader in place does not allow the braking. With King Obama in for a second term with out having to campaign for reelection...the future isn't really bright. The only consequent of him remaining elected would be he should not have full control of the congress.

You are right about time.....it will take plenty.

Redbaron007 said:

You are correct....voting for Romney doesn't solve the problem. Never said it would. However, it provides the opportunity to slow it done and continue to debate and place pressure on the elected and those running to realize their overreach.

Keeping the current leader in place does not allow the braking. With King Obama in for a second term with out having to campaign for reelection...the future isn't really bright. The only consequent of him remaining elected would be he should not have full control of the congress.

You are right about time.....it will take plenty.

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Well, thanks for confirming you won't be finding out for yourself. If you already knew or planned on finding out, you wouldn't be discussing a slow-down effect.

Sigh, I guess we just get to listen to those too fixed in their hatred to realize each is as bad as the other.

These fellas say it better than I. Here's an excerpt:

"As he points out, both branches of the Establishment party want to continue building the Leviathan state, albeit in the service of different constituencies: 'Most Republican politicians don’t actually want to strip the federal government of most of the powers to regulate, tax and spend that came with the New Deal. This is because Republican politicians want to use those powers to promote Republican policies….' "

http://lewrockwell.com/grigg/grigg-w268.html

Citizen said:

Well, thanks for confirming you won't be finding out for yourself. If you already knew or planned on finding out, you wouldn't be discussing a slow-down effect.

Sigh, I guess we just get to listen to those too fixed in their hatred to realize each is as bad as the other.

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So what is your solution, at this point of time?

Redbaron007 said:

So what is your solution, at this point of time?

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I thought it was simple; stop voting for them.

Jack House said:

I thought it was simple; stop voting for them.

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So you advocate for no one to vote in the Prez election?

Redbaron007 said:

So what is your solution, at this point of time?

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Nice try. Which is it? That you are so fearful that you believe you must have a solution at this point in time? Or, that you deliberately throw up a false premise--that a solution is required at this point in time?

There is no solution at this time. Any real solution is going to take years.

Redbaron007 said:

So you advocate for no one to vote in the Prez election?

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And, why should I vote? The Republicrats and Democans are functionally equivalent: tyrants looking for more power. You're demanding that I actually approve the thug that is going to cut my economic throat and trample my liberties?

Citizen said:

You're demanding that I actually approve the thug that is going to cut my economic throat and trample my liberties?

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Ohhh, I like that!

Jack House said:

Ohhh, I like that!

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If I recall, I got that from Lysander Spooner's No Treason. I just adapted it a bit. Basically, he pointed out that taxation forces you to pay to strengthen and arm the tyrant. You're basically putting the sword in the tyrant's hands for him to use on you. I think Spooner was the source. Anyway, I just adapted it to fit the situation.

Citizen said:

Nice try. Which is it? That you are so fearful that you believe you must have a solution at this point in time? Or, that you deliberately throw up a false premise--that a solution is required at this point in time?

There is no solution at this time. Any real solution is going to take years.

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Which is what? Not fearful of anything. What false premise? Working toward a solution is a false premise? You criticize the current election cycle candidates, but yet don't propose an alternative, except it will take time. When do you plan on doing something that starts that change? Next election cycle? When your candidate comes out on top?

I'm not advocating and never have, that a solution has to be done now, or even completed in this election. But, you have to start somewhere/sometime. I started in the primaries with the candidate I thought was going to be best suited; mine didn't make it. Now the election process funnel has narrowed down the selection.....King Obama, Romney or third party. Which one do you support to start the change? And please, don't start with KO and Romney are the same...that's an over generalization of flatulence that the RP followers espouse with no facts to support.

The current election cycle is here, today (within the next 30 days or so)....what are you going to do? Discussing what should have, could have happened in the primaries is great coffee table conversation; but the reality is...what are you doing/proposing, under the current circumstances? Or is it time?

Citizen said:

And, why should I vote? The Republicrats and Democans are functionally equivalent: tyrants looking for more power. You're demanding that I actually approve the thug that is going to cut my economic throat and trample my liberties?

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No offense, but this is with every election candidate, nothing new. If you can't get past this, then you'll never vote and affect change. It's called politics. And why should you vote? To start the change you state will take time. Which thug is going to cut your economic throat and trample your liberties? King Obama? If you are historian of politics/history, you will realize there has never been the perfect candidate elected nor will there be one presented. Every candidate has downfalls....you eventually have to choose and decide you vote for the one that comes closest....or in some cases vote to remove the one who will cause the most damage.

Living here in Missouri, we have a Senate race....Claire McCaskill vs Todd Akin. I can't stand either one of them. MO doesn't need another 6 years of McCaskill, however, I'm not fond of having Akin the Senator either. McCaskill is considered the vote that passed Obamacare, she has been a strong supporter of the liberal King Obama and his policies. I will not vote for her....I will hold my nose, close one eye, say 10 Hail Mary's when I mark the spot for Akin...then, after turning my ballot in , say another 10 Hail Mary's and take a shot of Kentucky Bourbon to help ease the pain. :lol:

So based upon your comment, am I to assume you are not voting? When do you plan to implement this change that you referenced earlier?