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Thread: Need help, Place of employment posting signs...

  1. #1
    Regular Member Maverick9110e's Avatar
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    Need help, Place of employment posting signs...

    Hey guys, i could use some help. I work up in Youngsville for a fastener distributor. We only have about 8-10 people working here. My boss who knows i'm an avid shooter and an advocate for gun rights apparently has ordered a gun buster sign as well as a sign to post at the front of the property that says no firearms allowed on the property. Now seeing as how i work in the shipping area i intercepted this, and plan on taking it to him tommorow when he's in and discussing it with him. One of my questions is this:
    Seeing as how we only pay for the building on a lease (its like a 5 year lease or something) and we don't actually own the property can he legally put the no firearms allowed on the property sign up? We don't even do any maintiance on the building, the "landlord: of the property does.
    Now i plan on making my case to him about how he just put a please come shoot/rob us sign on the door and how its not doing anyone any good, and not to mention is basically singinlging me out as he know no one else here shoots or is into guns. So i'll be putting that together tonight but could use some help reccomendations, and some help with the property dilema. I do plan on going to HR with it even though im sure nothing will be accomplished.

    Thanks!

  2. #2
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick9110e View Post
    Seeing as how we only pay for the building on a lease (its like a 5 year lease or something) and we don't actually own the property can he legally put the no firearms allowed on the property sign up? We don't even do any maintiance on the building, the "landlord: of the property does.
    The tenant always has control over who is allowed on the premises. For example, Chapman v. United States decided that a landlord may not give permission for a police search.

    In general, the only exception is that landlords may not be prevented from performing maintenance or inspections, once they have given sufficient notice. I'm not sure about North Carolina specifics, but those two principles are pretty much a given.
    Last edited by marshaul; 03-15-2011 at 12:29 PM.

  3. #3
    Regular Member sultan62's Avatar
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    Yes, he has rights to put up the sign just as the owner would.
    "They don't give a damn about any trumpet playing band
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    Regular Member Maverick9110e's Avatar
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    Ugh, there goes that argument. Well at least i can point out that not only is he putting a sign on the door, but a sign out at the street that says please come rob and harm us. The annoying part is our buisness is sort of off the main highway so its sort of secluded and the cops are never really around. And honestly as much as i hate not being allowed to carry into my place of employment i can almost deal with that reality, but not being able to keep it locked up in my truck is just stupid. I realize there is a law in the works to help with that right now, but even if it passes it won't be in effect until december 1rst.
    Last edited by Maverick9110e; 03-15-2011 at 12:33 PM.

  5. #5
    Regular Member Felix's Avatar
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    Any chance you and/or your position might be considered excess by management?

    Without knowing what kind of a working relationship you have with your boss, you might want to tread lightly on this one since you weren't consulted despite being widely known as a 2A advocate in a very small organization. Plus keep in mind that you've used your position to get advanced warning of what's planned. That may not sit well with your supervisor. Above all else, ensure you don't come across as confrontational. Or whiny (like that idea of trying to claim the company doesn't "own" the property).

    If you can ascertain first what's driving the perceived need to ensure firearms aren't carried on company property, you might be in a better position to offer a credible rebuttal.
    Daily carry: SIG P229 .40 S&W

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    Regular Member Maverick9110e's Avatar
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    Thanks! Not really doing anythign wrong with the item, came in today, Boss is already gone, just holding it to the side until he comes in tommorow to discuss it rather then just leaving it on his desk. Honestly, we've talked about it before and he just things guns are needless and dangerousand people can't be trusted with them. (He's Canadian, lol) Despite the fact that he said he wanted to take me up on the offer to take him to the range in a few months.

  7. #7
    Regular Member sultan62's Avatar
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    Maybe you could try one or both of the following:

    1. Point out that you have carried in there daily for however long you've been there.

    2. Ask why he decided to put up signs now. What occurred that made him think he needed to put up signs, or that they would help?
    "They don't give a damn about any trumpet playing band
    It ain't what they call rock and roll
    And the Sultans...
    Yeah the Sultans, they play Creole"

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    Regular Member REDFIVE48's Avatar
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    To me sounds like you are more concerned that you can't keep your weapon in you vehicle during working hours. I work for a company with similar employee guidelines, but I have never had anyone search my vehicle, so I just store in my car and no harm no foul. If anyone ever demanded access to my vehicle, that would be refused and we would have an HR process to work out there, either way could lose, but at least they need to make a big stink to try and search my personal property. These employer/employee rules are too tricky especially since all employment (barring unions) is 'at will', so no real 2A protections for us that I can see.

    I do have standing orders with my wife to attempt to sue my employer if I was ever a victim of an attack at work for their taking away my ability to defend myself, probably a non-starter, but I'll be gone anyway.

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    Not sure if this is too far out in left field but a wild thought has flitted through what passes as my brain. If your boss is a follower of political issues could it be that he has heard of the progress of the new law being considered to permit keeping of weapons on premises in locked cars in the parking lots of businesses? If so it may be as simple as his attempt to get out ahead of this matter in hopes of being "grandfathered" as prohibiting such on his business. In light of lack of confidence in the politicians it can never be assumed that any new issue will either pass or what form it might take. Just thinking out loud and absent any hard facts it makes as much sense as anything else.

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    Invite him to an OC dinner. He will meet several other 2A advocates, his views are not the only ones.

  11. #11
    Regular Member Felix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick9110e View Post
    ...he wanted to take me up on the offer to take him to the range in a few months.
    A few months! Suffice to say, he's not too interested then, correct?

    I say again, "Any chance you and/or your position might be considered excess by management?" Any chance the position will not be around in a "few" months and this is merely an exercise in futility?

    Not trying to be mean but this just isn't adding up. Looks like an apparent anti who isn't the slightest bit interested in discussing the subject or he would have pulsed the resident 2A advocate before deciding to post the place. I don't see you're going to have much of an impact. Don't pursue so aggressively you put your job in jeopardy.
    Daily carry: SIG P229 .40 S&W

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    Regular Member Maverick9110e's Avatar
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    It was me who suggested the timeframe actually. I like the oc dinner idea,lol. But I think I can cime off more civil the better, which is what I was/am trying to come up with solution wise.

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    My plant has it on the door going into the plant.."no dangerous weapons on this property" I never asked... "IF" I could leave mine in my truck... I just do...I never talk about guns at work... I shoot with a few co workers but still never talk about guns at work....

    If I were you...drop it...let it go.... act as if you could careless.... that way you dont become a "target" for a search.... Hide it well in your vehicle...

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    Regular Member Ruger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buzzsaw View Post
    If so it may be as simple as his attempt to get out ahead of this matter in hopes of being "grandfathered" as prohibiting such on his business.
    I may be mistaken, but I don't think there is any grandfathering provision in the bill (nor should there be IMO).

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    Regular Member sultan62's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruger View Post
    I may be mistaken, but I don't think there is any grandfathering provision in the bill (nor should there be IMO).

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using Tapatalk
    No version I've seen has a grandfather provision.
    "They don't give a damn about any trumpet playing band
    It ain't what they call rock and roll
    And the Sultans...
    Yeah the Sultans, they play Creole"

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  16. #16
    Regular Member Maverick9110e's Avatar
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    Yea i have thought about taking the quiet road, except we sometimes use my truck to go to lunch and i don't have a CC permit so i can't just keep it locked up. And thats what i'm more concerned about. I think i'll bring it to him, make a point that its not doing anyone any good, and maybe a light conversation but nothing more then that.

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    Regular Member rotorhead's Avatar
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    Tell him he's a punk ass and you won't work for such a little nancy who would subject his employees to such violations of their rights, nor who would endanger them in such a way. Ask him if his wife has lesbian tendencies for wanting to be with such a little girl like him.

    Then, take a minute and pretend to collect yourself, and start over with a slight apology and tell him you'd like to discuss this matter further with him.

    Doing it this way will get things out of your system and give you a clear head to move forward with

  18. #18
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rotorhead View Post
    Ask him if his wife has lesbian tendencies for wanting to be with such a little girl like him.
    This is TOTALLY UNCALLED-FOR homophobia.

    Clearly, his wife is a pedophile.

  19. #19
    Regular Member rotorhead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marshaul View Post
    This is TOTALLY UNCALLED-FOR homophobia.

    Clearly, his wife is a pedophile.
    lol.

    It might have been uncalled for, but I have no fear of lesbians

    Good catch on the pedophile profiling, though. It's quite possible I was mistaken in my initial diagnosis.

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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Regular Member Maverick9110e's Avatar
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    lol, i thought about just venting and saying how in the hell a Canadian transplant is going to sit here and stomp on my rights is beyond me but i'll save that for another day. lol.

  22. #22
    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Another thing that might possibly make an impression on him is to show him how many shootings have happened in places that are posted as "gun free".
    Either give him links to news reports or print them out & hand them to him.

    But I agree with calmly asking what changed recently that he's decided you being able to protect yourself is now a Bad Idea. I'm assuming you haven't done anything illegal, immoral, or unethical involving use of a pistol, either at work or elsewhere.

    If I didn't want to keep my job, I'd send the merchandise back to the other company. "Ordered in error."
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    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    Now is the time for you to start looking for a new job. Get something else lined up--in a 2A-friendly company--and then when you hand in your resignation,let them know you are leaving because you felt the company was more interested in appearances than in providing a safe workplace for you.
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
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    Regular Member Resto Guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamer View Post
    Now is the time for you to start looking for a new job. Get something else lined up--in a 2A-friendly company--and then when you hand in your resignation,let them know you are leaving because you felt the company was more interested in appearances than in providing a safe workplace for you.
    And don't him drive to lunch anymore.

  25. #25
    Regular Member Maverick9110e's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MKEgal View Post
    Another thing that might possibly make an impression on him is to show him how many shootings have happened in places that are posted as "gun free".
    Either give him links to news reports or print them out & hand them to him.

    But I agree with calmly asking what changed recently that he's decided you being able to protect yourself is now a Bad Idea. I'm assuming you haven't done anything illegal, immoral, or unethical involving use of a pistol, either at work or elsewhere.

    If I didn't want to keep my job, I'd send the merchandise back to the other company. "Ordered in error."
    Percisley. He's more a paranoid type person then anything. And i hear ya dreamer, lol.

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