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First LEO encounter... Confronted at gunpoint

georg jetson

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2009
Messages
2,416
Location
Slidell, Louisiana
Precedent has already been set.

Gorge George George...you keep repeating the same old lines....the legal written opinion by the attorney general does not address what an officer can and can not do when they see a person open carrying a gun in public...is obvious that most law enforcement agencies recognize this right by the fact that while they are presently harassing people they see open carrying,,these people are not being ARRESTED....just harassed in the hopes of persuading people to stop carrying a gun in a legal manner in public. So George..are you offering to take this to court??? Or are you hoping someone else will just let themselves be a test case? Repeating something over and over will not make it magically happen.

I'm offering to help keep people from wasting their time and money.

Read...
http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=4079373856556614361&hl=en&as_sdt=2&as_vis=1&oi=scholarr
 

estcrh

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2008
Messages
365
Location
Louisiana, USA
I'm offering to help keep people from wasting their time and money.

Read...
http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=4079373856556614361&hl=en&as_sdt=2&as_vis=1&oi=scholarr
Can you explain to me how this 1 piece of information will keep a law enforcement official from improperly confronting a person who is legally carrying a gun in public. The information somehow has to get from point A..you...to point B...the law enforcement agency in question...and then it has to be EXPLAINED to them in a manner that can be easily understood...someone correct me if I am wrong but isnt that what an attorney does?
 
M

McX

Guest
i read the story, even looked at the pics. somehow the sight of law abiding citizens just doesn't scare me. i would have sat next to your table, with all assembled, and had no damn problem with it at all. holding citizens at gun point, and quoting crap about detaining you for a potential criminal act is a horrible lie! then telling you to get a permit to cc, that's like adding icing to the lie cake! tell you guys what, i'd sure like to get one of those t-shirts to show my support, way the hell up here in the arm pit of the midwest! somebody pm me how to get one!
 

kwikrnu

Banned
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
1,956
Location
Brentwood, Tennessee
Can you explain to me how this 1 piece of information will keep a law enforcement official from improperly confronting a person who is legally carrying a gun in public. The information somehow has to get from point A..you...to point B...the law enforcement agency in question...and then it has to be EXPLAINED to them in a manner that can be easily understood...someone correct me if I am wrong but isnt that what an attorney does?

That is what a lawsuit does. A letter from an attorney does nothing. There is no punishment for disobeying a letter from an attorney.
 

estcrh

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2008
Messages
365
Location
Louisiana, USA
That is what a lawsuit does. A letter from an attorney does nothing. There is no punishment for disobeying a letter from an attorney.
The letter from an attorney gives the offending party a chance to change their actions before things get out of hand. It gives law enforcement agencies something to consider, they can take it and discuss the information provided with their legal staff and possibly make changes to how they go about their business...its the step between doing nothing and a law suit. Law suit keeps getting tossed around like an old rag here but who is going to be the one to step up and get the ball rolling in court???? Sometimes people do compromise...stranger things have happened before.
 

NRAMARINE

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
Messages
523
Location
Anywhere but here.
What you can't see in the pics from Hammond, is the number of small children present. I'm in the blue FN hat behind IA's head on the left. There were probably all told 7-10 kids there. They don't get scared sitting with a bunch of armed citizens. Even people they've just met. They know that we are all decent people, we are husbands, fathers, sons, daughters, mothers, etc. They don't scream at the sight of a gun, nor are they being indoctrinated in any way to believing that guns are toys either. They just know we love and protect them, and we give a s#!t about what kind of world we leave them, god willing a free one. Where people realize that exercizing your rights is a moral and justified thing to do.
 

NRAMARINE

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
Messages
523
Location
Anywhere but here.
The letter from an attorney gives the offending party a chance to change their actions before things get out of hand. It gives law enforcement agencies something to consider, they can take it and discuss the information provided with their legal staff and possibly make changes to how they go about their business...its the step between doing nothing and a law suit. Law suit keeps getting tossed around like an old rag here but who is going to be the one to step up and get the ball rolling in court???? Sometimes people do compromise...stranger things have happened before.

That is what we hope to achieve with the letter from L.O.C.A.L. that's going out to all LEO agencies soon.
 

georg jetson

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2009
Messages
2,416
Location
Slidell, Louisiana
That is what a lawsuit does. A letter from an attorney does nothing. There is no punishment for disobeying a letter from an attorney.

Exactly... the letter is just a way of allowing the chief law enforcement officer a chance to correct an issue they may or may not be aware of... and who writes the "NOTICE" is irrelevant. The fact that one has hired an attorney "to do the writing" CAN have an effect. However, if one writes persuasively, it would be realized that an attorney is unnecessary... at this point...
 

estcrh

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2008
Messages
365
Location
Louisiana, USA
Exactly... the letter is just a way of allowing the chief law enforcement officer a chance to correct an issue they may or may not be aware of... and who writes the "NOTICE" is irrelevant. The fact that one has hired an attorney "to do the writing" CAN have an effect. However, if one writes persuasively, it would be realized that an attorney is unnecessary... at this point...

George, the average person does not have the resources to research the necessary rulings and statutes required to prove their point..you have obviously done so but most people have good intentions but that unfortunately is not enough in many situations.

One more point....Americans do not tend to take the average citizen seriously until an attorney is backing them up...so who writes a letter to law enforcement MAY be irrelevant...WHAT THEY WRITE is whats important and a person should know their own limitations and hire a PROFESSIONAL with EXPERIENCE when it come to something of GREAT IMPORTANCE.
 

georg jetson

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2009
Messages
2,416
Location
Slidell, Louisiana
George, the average person does not have the resources to research the necessary rulings and statutes required to prove their point..you have obviously done so but most people have good intentions but that unfortunately is not enough in many situations.

One more point....Americans do not tend to take the average citizen seriously until an attorney is backing them up...so who writes a letter to law enforcement MAY be irrelevant...WHAT THEY WRITE is whats important and a person should know their own limitations and hire a PROFESSIONAL with EXPERIENCE when it come to something of GREAT IMPORTANCE.

Well... the average person should know the law and shame on US f we don't... because we are EXPECTED to know the law in a REPUBLIC. In a REPUBLIC, the citizen realizes that the meaning of "eternal vigilance" is EXACTLY that... MAKE THE TIME TO KNOW THE LAW.

The reason the "average" citizen is not taken seriously when it comes to the law is because the "average" citizen is ABYSMALLY ignorant of the law. Again... shame on US.

Take responsibility... we all have problems... identify yours and fix them.
 

estcrh

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2008
Messages
365
Location
Louisiana, USA
Well... the average person should know the law and shame on US f we don't... because we are EXPECTED to know the law in a REPUBLIC. In a REPUBLIC, the citizen realizes that the meaning of "eternal vigilance" is EXACTLY that... MAKE THE TIME TO KNOW THE LAW.

The reason the "average" citizen is not taken seriously when it comes to the law is because the "average" citizen is ABYSMALLY ignorant of the law. Again... shame on US.

Take responsibility... we all have problems... identify yours and fix them.

Do you fix your own car, do your own dental work, operate on yourself..NO..you hire an EXPERT(or at least I do) who has STUDIED for YEARS..a SPECIALIST..as opposed to an AMATEUR. But then when I do something I plan on doing it right and succeeding at what I do...Im just saying..........
 

kwikrnu

Banned
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
1,956
Location
Brentwood, Tennessee
Do you fix your own car, do your own dental work, operate on yourself..NO..you hire an EXPERT(or at least I do) who has STUDIED for YEARS..a SPECIALIST..as opposed to an AMATEUR. But then when I do something I plan on doing it right and succeeding at what I do...Im just saying..........

When I have a headache, I take a couple aspirin.
 
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georg jetson

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2009
Messages
2,416
Location
Slidell, Louisiana
Do you fix your own car, do your own dental work, operate on yourself..NO..you hire an EXPERT(or at least I do) who has STUDIED for YEARS..a SPECIALIST..as opposed to an AMATEUR. But then when I do something I plan on doing it right and succeeding at what I do...Im just saying..........

Complete your analogy... people fix their own car when they can't afford to pay someone else. Additionally. knowing somethig about the way a car works will help keep you from getting ripped off. How will you know if an attorney is any good if you use excuses to keep yourself completely ignorant of the law. There are times when the use of an attorney is wise and even in those cases you can ASSIST the attorney if you know what you're doing. However, most of the time they are NOT needed.

We need a population knowledgeable about the law in order to restore the Republic. No more excuses!!
 

LA Confederate

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 9, 2009
Messages
238
Location
Hammond Area, LA, ,
Do you fix your own car, do your own dental work, operate on yourself..NO..you hire an EXPERT(or at least I do) who has STUDIED for YEARS..a SPECIALIST..as opposed to an AMATEUR. But then when I do something I plan on doing it right and succeeding at what I do...Im just saying..........

I do most minor and some major repairs to my car. Why? Because I took it upon myself to learn how the vehicle functions. Knowing this allows me to diagnose why it stopped working and how to fix it. There are repairs that I choose not to perform not because of a lack of knowledge, but because of a lack of available tools or environment. Now I can talk with knowledge to other mechanics and I can know when someone is trying to scam me out of changing my headlight lubricant or flasher fluid. And I don't have to wait on the side of the road like a douche when my tire goes flat or there is another mechanical failure.

This same perspective is the difference between someone wanting to have at least a basic working knowledge of the law. It's not because you want to be Matlock...it's because you want to know what your have a right to do and not do, and because you want to be able to know when your rights are getting violated without sounding like one of these jack legs on t.v. yelling "Ah no's mah rahts!!!" Unless you know what your rights are, how can you defend or fight for them?
 

sraacke

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2008
Messages
1,214
Location
Saint Gabriel, Louisiana, USA
And I would like to get more involved and plan on doing so. I've been wanting to get more involved in this direction, but work has just not allowed me to. I will attend the next meeting if at all possible. I appreciate and am thankful for the invite.

Paul, please go to the forum at the LOCAL site www.laopencarry.org , register there and please join our discussions and planning there. Lots happens there that doesn't get put here. OCDO and LOCAL are both pro-OC and many members are on both forums but OCDO and LOCAL are entirely separate entities.
 

estcrh

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2008
Messages
365
Location
Louisiana, USA
Paul, please go to the forum at the LOCAL site www.laopencarry.org , register there and please join our discussions and planning there. Lots happens there that doesn't get put here. OCDO and LOCAL are both pro-OC and many members are on both forums but OCDO and LOCAL are entirely separate entities.

Maybe if you let people know what is going on with LOCAL here thats not getting put here you would get more interest in your group, such as this letter your planning on sending...one thing I cant understand...how come you can not answer a simple question...either LOCAL is getting advise from an attorney on the letter they are planning on sending on behalf of their members ( and all open carry advocates) or LOCAL is not using an attorney to help with the letter they are sending. I have been asked to attend a meeting which I have been planning on doing but as a member you should know if legal advise has been used or will be used to help with the letter that is going to be sent to all law enforcement agencies.
 
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