Creation, true, false, or unsure?

[Redbaron007]

There is no evidence for creationism or evolution.
Sounds suspiciously like the pro & anti-rights debate...

Fixed it for you.

 

[ADobbs1989]

Fixed it for you.

Incorrectly, however. There are mounds of evidence that support Evolution. It's possibly one of the most scientifically sound and supported theories we currently have.

 

[Redbaron007]

Incorrectly, however. There are mounds of evidence that support Evolution. It's possibly one of the most scientifically sound and supported theories we currently have.

Really??....please feeel to edjukate us on the mounds of evidence.

(just a lil help for ya...its actually called a 'theory' for a reason....but go ahead and dispel the myth)

 

[Mantioch]

Moths in London during the industrial age changed from light grey to dark grey. Are moths intelligent, or did the genes for light grey coloration nearly go extinct because those moths showed up more on polluted trees, so the moths got eaten with more regularity than the moths with dark grey coloration. .

That is not accurate. Both light and dark varieties of the peppered moth were around then. The occurrence of the light version of the peppered moth decrease dramatically due to increased predation because smoke and pollution killed the lichen they hid in. Nothing evolved - they were simply eaten at a horrifyingly violent pace. The dark and light peppered moths were still just peppered moths. They didn't turn into bluejays. This is how Darwinism spreads - via misinformation.

 

[ADobbs1989]

Really??....please feeel to edjukate us on the mounds of evidence.

(just a lil help for ya...its actually called a 'theory' for a reason....but go ahead and dispel the myth)

Ignorance is bliss I guess. "A scientific theory summarizes a hypothesis or group of hypotheses that have been supported with repeated testing. If enough evidence accumulates to support a hypothesis, it moves to the next step—known as a theory—in the scientific method and becomes accepted as a valid explanation of a phenomenon." You are trying to attribute the word "hypothesis" to the word "theory" when they are two different things. A hypothesis is an educated guess, a theory is an educated guess that has proof, evidence, and facts to support it's validity.

That is not accurate. Both light and dark varieties of the peppered moth were around then. The occurrence of the light version of the peppered moth decrease dramatically due to increased predation because smoke and pollution killed the lichen they hid in. Nothing evolved - they were simply eaten at a horrifyingly violent pace. The dark and light peppered moths were still just peppered moths. They didn't turn into bluejays. This is how Darwinism spreads - via misinformation.

Evolution would never come to the conclusion that moths could turn into bluejays. Actually if you could provide an example of this happening you would completely discredit the theory of evolution and it would become void.

 

[Mantioch]

Ignorance is bliss I guess. "A scientific theory summarizes a hypothesis or group of hypotheses that have been supported with repeated testing. If enough evidence accumulates to support a hypothesis, it moves to the next step—known as a theory—in the scientific method and becomes accepted as a valid explanation of a phenomenon." You are trying to attribute the word "hypothesis" to the word "theory" when they are two different things. A hypothesis is an educated guess, a theory is an educated guess that has proof, evidence, and facts to support it's validity.



Evolution would never come to the conclusion that moths could turn into bluejays. Actually if you could provide an example of this happening you would completely discredit the theory of evolution and it would become void.

Point being the information was wrong. And evolution says all life evolved from a single protein strand. I don't understand the difference between that and a moth becoming a bluejay.

 

[OC for ME]

Says logic. <snip>

I will take your choice to be 'We' and not He. No big deal, logically speaking.

 

[georg jetson]

Apples fall. Are they intelligent? Is the Earth intelligent, that it draws the apples to itself?

SNIP

The planets go around the sun. Are the planets intellegent, or are they responding to natural laws (gravity)?


SNIP

You miss the point. The reason apples fall is because of gravity. Gravity is a result of intelligence. It is a natural law. Who or what decided what this law was to be? It makes no sense to think that the natural laws "evolved" from anything because what laws did the evolutionary process obey if there were no laws to begin with.

 

[eye95]

Really??....please feeel to edjukate us on the mounds of evidence.

(just a lil help for ya...its actually called a 'theory' for a reason....but go ahead and dispel the myth)

There is all kinds of evidence for evolution. Heck, it has been witnessed.

The little problem is they don't tell you that there are two kinds of evolution.

1. Intraspecial evolution. Chicken 2.0. A bigger, better, and tastier chicken.

2. Extraspecial evolution. Chicken lays egg. Out pops God-knows-what, with a different set of chromosomes, that is viable, that meets and mates with another God-knows-what with the same basic set of chromosomes, and Adam-and-Eves a whole new and viable species.

There is all kinds of evidence for 1. There is no evidence for 2.

When folks say they believe in evolution, ask them to qualify. I know 1 happens, so I believe in evolution. Do I believe man evolved from another species? I see no evidence of that. I see that man 10.0 is the current version and there is evidence of man 5.0 - 9.7. Man 5.0 looked a lot like an ape, but was a man with the same essential set of chromosomes man 10.0 has.

 

[eye95]

I will take your choice to be 'We' and not He. No big deal, logically speaking.

I said no such thing. I deliberately did not take one of your choices.

You know how I feel about folks putting words in my mouth.

Moving on.

 

[MyWifeSaidYes]

Wow. Interesting thread.

I am not a religious person. I also believe that ORGANIZED religion has been, and is still, at the heart of a great percentage of the violence in the world. An ORGANIZED religion causes the stories contained within books like the Bible, the Torah, the Koran and even whatever is written on those darn invisble magic golden plates, to be used by a few people controlling that religion to control their followers. This may be for good, as it is with most religions, most of the time. But, just like firearms, religion can be used by bad people to do bad things.

As a supporter of our country's Constitution, I support and will defend your right to believe whatever you want, up until the point that your beliefs impose on someone else.

The anti-gunners don't want us to have guns, but I don't demand that they HAVE one.

The CC-only crowd doesn't want us to open carry, but I don't demand that THEY open carry.

The religious guys can tell me all day long that I am going to Hell for not believing, but...

I WILL NEVER TELL SOMEONE THAT THEIR FAITH OR BELIEF SYSTEM IS WRONG UNTIL THEY TRY TO FORCIBLY IMPOSE IT ON ME OR MY FAMILY.

At that point, this will become a PURELY firearms related discussion.

 

[Redbaron007]

There is all kinds of evidence for evolution. Heck, it has been witnessed.

The little problem is they don't tell you that there are two kinds of evolution.

1. Intraspecial evolution. Chicken 2.0. A bigger, better, and tastier chicken.

2. Extraspecial evolution. Chicken lays egg. Out pops God-knows-what, with a different set of chromosomes, that is viable, that meets and mates with another God-knows-what with the same basic set of chromosomes, and Adam-and-Eves a whole new and viable species.

There is all kinds of evidence for 1. There is no evidence for 2.

When folks say they believe in evolution, ask them to qualify. I know 1 happens, so I believe in evolution. Do I believe man evolved from another species? I see no evidence of that. I see that man 10.0 is the current version and there is evidence of man 5.0 - 9.7. Man 5.0 looked a lot like an ape, but was a man with the same essential set of chromosomes man 10.0 has.

Now why did you go and do that....I was wanting to see if they could splain their evidence! :lol:

 

[WalkingWolf]

Well, the OP is definitely giving the non-creationists what he surely thinks is a leg up by demanding evidence, which only the non-creationists think they can provide.

However, none of us was there. No one can present one scrap of conclusive evidence one way or the other. Some folks will point to scientific "evidence" that says that the Earth is older than the biblical Creation story would seem to set it. However, they ignore one thing: Couldn't a God who brings an entire universe into existence create it with all that evidence of age already present?

Science, when used to look backward, is interesting, but, by nature, flawed. Science makes guesses about how things work, uses those guesses to predict future outcomes, and constantly refines those guesses into theories and laws as they prove to be better and better predictors. Science is forward-looking. It is not apt for looking backward.

The net result: Whether you believe in a creation event or not, whether you will admit it or not, you are relying on faith. You are building a complete system of belief based upon axioms you cannot prove. But, hey, Euclidean Geometry works. And it is based on axioms accepted on faith. Even a few we now know to be false!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk.

<o>

IF god created the universe, time is not relevant, considering there was no time before the creation, and time is relative to the creator as weight. Certainly a day for a god could be trillions of years. If looked upon the way our money is created, the value is what ever the creator feels it should be. Same goes for the so called facts the atheists claim, it can be any value that the creator wishes. What people have to remember that out of a solar system, where there is no evidence of life there is a abundance of life on this planet. And out of that abundance only one species that has advanced in the manner of humans. Different races that are the same yet very different. All the antis would have you believe came from one or more caustic pools.

 

[georg jetson]

SNIP
A god which evolved from not-god. A god which started out not intelligent but evolved intelligence.
SNIP

This type of god is a creature. It would be part of creation or in the case I think you're making is that a god is a by product of the singularity. In that case we can all become a god. That gets us no closer to answer the question of "where did everything come from?"

Answer this question. How would the natural laws come from an evolutionary process? Where does the intelligence/laws come from to direct even that process?

Remember, "everything" includes gravity, the two nuclear forces, even the rules that make 1 atom act like hydrogen and two act like helium. How could such a rule or law evolve? How could the universe happen with no rules or laws?

 

[MyWifeSaidYes]

And as for evolution, I have an open mind because the Earth has been around for a few billion years.

There is simply no way (yet) to be sure what has happened over that great a span of time, regardless of who invented time.

 

[Redbaron007]

If evolution is what those say it is....then all plants and animals would be evolving to be a human being.....we are the top of the food chain....so they should be striving to be......well....like us.

OK, now that evolution has been discredited....now what?



Now, lets move onto the next question....which caliber makes the biggest hole....a 10mm or 40 caliber?

 

[georg jetson]

Wow. Interesting thread.

I am not a religious person. I also believe that ORGANIZED religion has been, and is still, at the heart of a great percentage of the violence in the world. An ORGANIZED religion causes the stories contained within books like the Bible, the Torah, the Koran and even whatever is written on those darn invisble magic golden plates, to be used by a few people controlling that religion to control their followers. This may be for good, as it is with most religions, most of the time. But, just like firearms, religion can be used by bad people to do bad things.

SNIP

Would it not be better stated that organized GOVERNMENT has been, and still is, at the heart of a great percentage of the violence in the world? Was Stalin obeying a religious edict when he mass murdered?

 

[ADobbs1989]

Point being the information was wrong. And evolution says all life evolved from a single protein strand. I don't understand the difference between that and a moth becoming a bluejay.

You make it sound like a single protein transformed into a cow one day, then gave birth to a dog, cat, monkey, pig, etc. etc. etc. If you have actually done any reading or research of evolution (not from some apologists website, but from actual scientific sources) it's not all that hard to understand it, and would be quite simple to see the difference between how life formed and evolved vs why a moth can't turn into a bluejay.

 

[Redbaron007]

Ignorance is bliss I guess. "A scientific theory summarizes a hypothesis or group of hypotheses that have been supported with repeated testing. If enough evidence accumulates to support a hypothesis, it moves to the next step—known as a theory—in the scientific method and becomes accepted as a valid explanation of a phenomenon." You are trying to attribute the word "hypothesis" to the word "theory" when they are two different things. A hypothesis is an educated guess, a theory is an educated guess that has proof, evidence, and facts to support it's validity.



Evolution would never come to the conclusion that moths could turn into bluejays. Actually if you could provide an example of this happening you would completely discredit the theory of evolution and it would become void.

Theories are not factual. Many have been broken. My use of theory was not misused. You just misunderstood the usage....it's a common default to a predetermined usage within these arguments.

 

[georg jetson]

And as for evolution, I have an open mind because the Earth has been around for a few billion years.

There is simply no way (yet) to be sure what has happened over that great a span of time, regardless of who invented time.

Keep in mind that the OP did not mention evolution, though others have brought it up. The story of Creation attempts to cover the story of everything where evolution is being used to explain the origin of species.

Unless someone is trying to use an evolutionary explanation for the natural laws... How did gravity evolve?