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Does anyone actually like Mitt Romney?

Freedom First

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Messages
845
Location
Kennewick, Wa.
Being passionate about your beliefs is a great thing, but knowing when its over is part of maturity.

Quitting is not necessarily maturity. Tell the soldiers with Washington at Valley Forge, freezing their butts off, your opinion about maturity... Just a thought.

A man who actually sticks with his beliefs and convictions is to be admired. Which is exactly why many of us support Ron Paul.

Have a good one!
 

Freedom First

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Messages
845
Location
Kennewick, Wa.
Voting is more than winning. We are taught that your vote is your only non-violent means of changing your government. True?

"There are thousands who are in opinion opposed to slavery and to the war, who yet in effect do nothing to put an end to them; who, esteeming themselves children of Washington and Franklin, sit down with their hands in their pockets, and say that they know not what to do, and do nothing; who even postpone the question of freedom to the question of free-trade, and quietly read the prices-current along with the latest advices from Mexico, after dinner, and, it may be, fall asleep over them both. What is the price-current of an honest man and patriot to-day? They hesitate, and they regret, and sometimes they petition; but they do nothing in earnest and with effect. They will wait, well disposed, for others to remedy the evil, that they may no longer have it to regret. At most, they give only a cheap vote, and a feeble countenance and Godspeed, to the right, as it goes by them. There are nine hundred and ninety-nine patrons of virtue to one virtuous man; but it is easier to deal with the real possessor of a thing than with the temporary guardian of it."
"All voting is a sort of gaming, like checkers or backgammon, with a slight moral tinge to it, a playing with right and wrong, with moral questions; and betting naturally accompanies it. The character of the voters is not staked. I cast my vote, perchance, as I think right; but I am not vitally concerned that that right should prevail. I am willing to leave it to the majority. Its obligation, therefore, never exceeds that of expediency. Even voting for the right is doing nothing for it. It is only expressing to men feebly your desire that it should prevail. A wise man will not leave the right to the mercy of chance, nor wish it to prevail through the power of the majority. There is but little virtue in the action of masses of men. When the majority shall at length vote for the abolition of slavery, it will be because they are indifferent to slavery, or because there is but little slavery left to be abolished by their vote. They will then be the only slaves. Only his vote can hasten the abolition of slavery who asserts his own freedom by his vote."
"I hear of a convention to be held at Baltimore,(16) or elsewhere, for the selection of a candidate for the Presidency, made up chiefly of editors, and men who are politicians by profession; but I think, what is it to any independent, intelligent, and respectable man what decision they may come to? Shall we not have the advantage of his wisdom and honesty, nevertheless? Can we not count upon some independent votes? Are there not many individuals in the country who do not attend conventions? But no: I find that the respectable man, so called, has immediately drifted from his position, and despairs of his country, when his country has more reason to despair of him. He forthwith adopts one of the candidates thus selected as the only available one, thus proving that he is himself available for any purposes of the demagogue. His vote is of no more worth than that of any unprincipled foreigner or hireling native, who may have been bought. Oh for a man who is a man, and, as my neighbor says, has a bone in his back which you cannot pass your hand through!"

HD Thoreau

I will never again vote for the "Lesser of two evils" or the "Only one with a chance". Sorry if that offends, but it is MY vote, not yours.

May I suggest that you folks who get bitter and angry about this electoral process do the following? It's something I did a couple years ago and I have learned much since then.

1. Take a deep breath.
2. Close your mouth.
3. Quietly ask yourself the following question: "What election has made me and my family MORE FREE?" As in the election is question resulted in more personal freedom and less reliance on the government?
4. If,as I found, the answer is "None." Don't be disturbed. You have found a truth. These elections are a distraction and a misdirection of our time and energy.
5. Then ask yourself, "Why? Who benefits?"
6. Turn off your TV and start using your brain.

;)
 
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Freedom First

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Messages
845
Location
Kennewick, Wa.
You don't change anything if you vote for a loser.

And you change nothing if you accept that "The only one with a chance to win" is the right person regardless of his character or qualifications... Vote that way and you let someone else make your decision for you. Plus you have just bought the lies fed to you by those who would rule over you. Use your brain, not the media to think with. Come to your own conclusions rather than listening to mouthpieces on TV, radio or online. Never trust, read for yourself.

For a start, you could read this: The legitimacy of true choice in our electoral process by Yours Truly.

It's a good but long read on the time and energy we as a society waste on these so-called elections but I think it's well worth the time. Enjoy!
 

()pen(arry

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2010
Messages
735
Location
Seattle, WA; escaped from 18 years in TX
You missed my point, again. I haven't been "listening to mouthpieces on TV, radio or online". I don't think Paul can't win because of anything someone else has said. I don't think Paul can't win because of his views. I don't think Paul can't win because his positions are wrong. I think Paul can't win because Romney has a mathematical certainty of being the Republican nominee and Paul won't run as a third party candidate. I don't think Paul can win because he doesn't have enough support.

The irony, of course, being that you're missing the point. No one is supposing that Mitt Romney won't be the Republican nominee. We are trying to get you to realize that with your vote-for-the-prognosticated-winner voting strategy, you helped preordain someone like Mitt Romney becoming the Republican nominee. Your work, here, is already done, much to our chagrin. It's irrelevant who you voted for in your state's primary and/or caucus; you had, at the beginning of this nomination process, the same mindset that you have now, namely that you are only willing to vote for someone you think is already likely to win. Because of this, you only allow for yourself the options laid out for you by the Republican party, automatically ruling out anyone like Ron Paul (who not only holds to principles, but holds to principles you pretend to endorse), simply because they fly in the face of the Republican party status quo.

Short version: your analysis of the current situation is irrelevant; the math you bring to the table now is the math you brought to the table at the outset, and it's now because of your way of thinking that Mitt Romney, as we all agree, will be the Republican nominee. So good work. We're terribly grateful.
 

Freedom First

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Messages
845
Location
Kennewick, Wa.
You missed my point, again.

Actually I did get it but thanks for trying. This is an issue that brings up passion and even anger in some but don't let our lack of that same passion bother you.

I don't think Paul can win because he doesn't have enough support.

And I agree. Totally. Paul has served his purpose in this election and this period of time by being a pressure release for the energies of millions of Americans who might have otherwise torn this sucker down by now.

But none of this election really matters. Your guy will run against Obama and regardless of who wins the general election, we as a people collectively will not be one bit more Free for all our efforts. Either man is acceptable to those few in real authority, else they wouldn't have been allowed to run in the first place. So, please, enjoy your victory.

Did you read my longish blog post on real choice in our election process? Freedom First 1775 You might find it a different and useful view on this conversation. Just sayin'. :)
 

KYGlockster

Activist Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2010
Messages
1,842
Location
Ashland, KY
Paul's campaign stops brought thousands of people every time; Romney's stops brought out hundreds. It is obvious our vote no longer matters. Voting is kept in place to make us think we can actually change things. Im speaking for the presidential election of course, not local and state elections. Everyone seems to think voting is a constitutionally protected right, and it certainly is not. We have amendments that say we can't be denied a vote based on sex, color, race, etc., but no amendment that says voting is a right granted to all citizens.
 

Freedom First

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Messages
845
Location
Kennewick, Wa.
Are you suggesting that the primary elections were rigged? In all 50 states? In every precinct? Do you have any evidence or is it just because your candidate lost?

If people are willing to believe what the media tells them they don't have to fix elections. The sheep simply do as they are trained.

Good example of the media effect in action on the left: How Obama got elected. Watch the trailer and think about where you got your opinions...

And just because it's about Obama don't believe it doesn't work with Republicans. Just ask an anti-Paul republican WHY they don't support him. Most of the time the answer is something like this, "I really respect him but I just can't get past his foreign policies..." When asked what those policies actually are they just say, "He's an isolationist!" Like that's a crime or even a bad idea... They are just regurgitating what they heard on tv, the radio and the internet. Not like they've actually done real research on the benefits of non-intervention which are many and valid.
 

Freedom First

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Messages
845
Location
Kennewick, Wa.
Everyone does not have a constitutional right to vote, but most of us in Ky. do. Convicted felons, incarcerated criminals, the insane and others are prohibited. People that have recently moved from another state and have not yet fulfilled a residency requirement and others are not allowed to vote. A person who fails to properly register to vote may not vote.

Section 145 of the Ky. Constitution.

...but the following persons are excepted and shall not have the right to vote.

3. Idiots...

Too easy... :p I knew some folks from Kentucky when I was in the Army. Obviously they couldn't vote...
 
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Freedom First

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Messages
845
Location
Kennewick, Wa.
Hey Now! Be Nice!

I am! I am!... :lol:

Well, ok, it was cheap shot mostly aimed at a goofball hick from deep in the sticks of Ky. whom I had the opportunity of spending several years with on a small post in Germany...

My apologies to all you cool votin' type Kentuckers. ;)
 
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Freedom First

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Messages
845
Location
Kennewick, Wa.
Do you ever answer a question? How about a "YES" or a "No".

Um, occasionally... ;)

Sorry. Yes I do, but I prefer to share ideas and I often ask questions that I hope will let us all think beyond what we understand today.

You'll notice that I have never said that you were wrong, I have been pushing the conversation to places it might not have otherwise gone. I enjoy lively discourse, "Iron sharpens iron."

Thanks!
 

()pen(arry

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2010
Messages
735
Location
Seattle, WA; escaped from 18 years in TX
Where did I ever say that I voted for Romney in the primary? I didn't say it and I didn't do it. Where did I say that I felt Paul couldn't win at the onset? I didn't say it and I didn't do it. All I said was that Ron Paul can't win and that we all have to get over it and move on, now.

It is, of course, necessary at this point in the conversation for you to pretend to have been more circumspect in the unprovable past, in order to save face. We get it. We also know what you have provably espoused in the present.

You freely entered the conversation, with an opening salvo belittling those who support Ron Paul. That you now find yourself on the defensive is no surprise to me.

Pride won't permit you to reconsider, at least not publicly. I have no interest in a public conclusion to this; all I want is for you to reconsider. That can only happen, if it happens, in the privacy of your own mind. You have nearly four years to choose a different path. I hope you do so, for everyone's sake. I'll leave you to it.
 

gobbly

Regular Member
Joined
May 28, 2012
Messages
75
Location
Utah
What's up with all the giant fonts? In all the time I've lurked here, and the time since that I've started posting I never saw anyone feel the need to bold/resize their font to get their point across. Frankly it just makes me think it's a weak point to begin with that needs to be heavily marketed to sell, and as such I scroll right past...
 

PistolPackingMomma

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 1, 2011
Messages
1,884
Location
SC
I believe Gutshot has explained before (several months ago?) that he has bad eye sight, so he uses the large font for visual convenience. He hasn't stated if that's still the case, and I've seen several new members complain about it. I do agree it is annoying, but easier to tolerate then lots of colors or capitalization.
 

SovereignAxe

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
791
Location
Elizabethton, TN
Snip

No liberals or left leaning voters are going to break ranks and vote for Ron Paul. That's reality. Only those who would otherwise not vote for obama will vote for Paul, so realistically speaking, voting for paul simply takes away a vote that would otherwise be against obama. That's the ugly truth

Snip

I'm 26 years old and have been a left leaning voter since I started voting. This time I'll be voting for Ron Paul. Thanks for playing.

Quitting is not necessarily maturity. Tell the soldiers with Washington at Valley Forge, freezing their butts off, your opinion about maturity... Just a thought.

A man who actually sticks with his beliefs and convictions is to be admired. Which is exactly why many of us support Ron Paul.

Have a good one!

I came in here to say something like this. I think too many people are preoccupied with voting for the winner, as if that will bring them some measure of satisfaction. I'll tell you what: it doesn't. You should be voting for who you want to win, not for who you think will win.
 

09jisaac

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2011
Messages
1,692
Location
Louisa, Kentucky
I believe Gutshot has explained before (several months ago?) that he has bad eye sight, so he uses the large font for visual convenience. He hasn't stated if that's still the case, and I've seen several new members complain about it. I do agree it is annoying, but easier to tolerate then lots of colors or capitalization.

Several times. I don't understand why so many people complain about it. As long as I have been here he has only used that sized font. Check the Kentucky forum, about half of the threads that Gutshot has made/replied to someone is complaining about the size.
 
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