got pulled over today for OCing

[devildoc5]

Matt , I see you were trying to be big man with a gun. That cop should have just threw you in jail.
Why do you scare everyone ?

I am hoping this is sarcasm....

 

[phoneguy]

Any way Matt you got back from a machine gun shoot, Am sure you had fun. You did not tell us about it.
If you want to you want to go out to eat tonight? PG

 

[XD45PlusP]

In WA state if you are driving a car then you are required to show your ID to any law officer who asks for it... there is wording in the paperwork when you get your drivers license.

The state can suspend your license for up to a year if you fail to present ID when asked, if operating a motor vehicle on proper roads.

How so? Since it is a Non Moving Infraction. http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.20.015

Now about the Stop. A cop just can't come up to you and say, give me your license, there must be individualized probable cause that a traffic infraction has been committed.

And Only if it is a "Valid" stop, and Not Pretextual. They also must have Probable Cause, that you don't have a license, if you are driving. They can call a "License Check" without actually seeing your drivers license. There must be a "Nexus"

Please read State v Ladson:

Ladson, 138 Wn.2d at 349 ("the reasonable articulable suspicion that a traffic infraction has occurred which justifies an exception to the warrant requirement for an ordinary traffic stop does not justify a stop for criminal investigation").

http://www.mrsc.org/dtSearch/dtisap...rm=E:\mrsc\wa\courts\index_dtSearch_form.html


and

http://www.mrsc.org/dtSearch/dtisap...rm=E:\mrsc\wa\courts\index_dtSearch_form.html

and

http://www.mrsc.org/dtSearch/dtisap...rm=E:\mrsc\wa\courts\index_dtSearch_form.html

XD

 

[amzbrady]

I'm still curious, did this happen on private property or had the OP already pulled out onto the road? If on Private property, is it legal for a cop to ask you for ID?

 

[1245A Defender]

stop

see also florida v. peters
he was being stalked by a cop, stopped on his own, then refused to show DL, cause it was not a traffic stop! he won!!

happened to me too, cop driving ahead of me, kept driving slower and slower, till half the speed limit, i pulled off the road and stopped.
he turned around and passed me going out of sight the other direction..
went on home no prob!!

 

[1245A Defender]

I'm still curious, did this happen on private property or had the OP already pulled out onto the road? If on Private property, is it legal for a cop to ask you for ID?

private property would prob keep it out of court for being drunk, but the RCWs dont make a distinction for
RCW 9.41.050, loaded gun in car with a CPL,!
MAT got screwed, he could of talked his way out., but it is reeeesalllly hard to remember every thing we know when were relaxed.
i think through various scenerios ALL the time, i think i could argue in SCOTUS, in my dreams,,
but i think if i was challanged in the real world, i would loose, giving ID, BUT i would have been at the
very edge of actually being arrested.
at least i would like to think ii could do that good!!
i sit in my monday morning quarter back chair every day and try to tell everyone else how strong and how knowledgable they should be so they can stand up for their rights, But i havent been tested!!
i think that ideally such a small number of us will actually be stopped, that most of us will just go about
our business every day for years at a time, and never have our right to keep and bear a firearm questioned!
Thats A Good Thing!!

 

[Matt85]

i got a call back from the everett PD about 10 minutes ago, turns out that it wasnt them. but they did tell me who it was (they were just as disgusted as i was). turns out it was the southern branche of the snohomish county sheriffs dep.

i will be sending them a letter explaining what happened and asking for an apology.

sorry phone guy, i missed your post. i was at sams from 6pm-8:30pm. (ill shoot ya a pm)

-matt

 

[daddy4count]

Don't ask for an apology, demand one.

And it might not hurt to CC a few administrative offices in your letter... city, county, even state...

 

[j2l3]

Tate and city??

Don't ask for an apology, demand one.

And it might not hurt to CC a few administrative offices in your letter... city, county, even state...

Since it was a county agency whose behaviour is in question, the city has zero authority and the state is not likely to take notice as it is a local training issue.

You can write if you want, but you can be sure you will be spinning your wheels. However, having said that, additional notice to the county executive and county council, along with the sheriff would likely be a good direction to go.

 

[DavidC77]

I heard on TV (so it must be true) that in WA a license plate FRAME is technically an infraction, since it obscures a portion of the plate.

That's pretty much true in any state, you have to be able to clearly see everything on the plate. Sticker, State, Year, ext.. It's anything the State places on the plate you need to be able to see without upstruction.

(sorry my spelling sucks sometimes, upstruction ?)

 

[DavidC77]

I'm getting lost here, RCW's, ID's, CPL's ?????

I thought it was bad in my state, which is about the worst for us being able to just own a gun let alone carry one.

At least here it's spelled out by class, A, you can carry CCW loaded (unless your LTC is limited), B, you can have a gun in your vehicle if it's locked away (again unless your LTC is limited).

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-131.htm

It comes down to you need a lawyer to understand our laws (if your lucky).

 

[oneeyeross]

I'm getting lost here, RCW's, ID's, CPL's ?????

I thought it was bad in my state, which is about the worst for us being able to just own a gun let alone carry one.

At least here it's spelled out by class, A, you can carry CCW loaded (unless your LTC is limited), B, you can have a gun in your vehicle if it's locked away (again unless your LTC is limited).

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-131.htm

It comes down to you need a lawyer to understand our laws (if your lucky).

It's pretty simple for us: RCW is Revised Code of Washington, CPL is Concealed Pistol License, ID is Identification.

We have a classless society out here, and don't have to have a license to open carry, nor a state permit to purchase firearms, nor a license to transport in a vehicle (as long as it is unloaded)....all in all, I'd rather be here than there.

 

[Trigger Dr]

I'm getting lost here, RCW's, ID's, CPL's ?????

I thought it was bad in my state, which is about the worst for us being able to just own a gun let alone carry one.

At least here it's spelled out by class, A, you can carry CCW loaded (unless your LTC is limited), B, you can have a gun in your vehicle if it's locked away (again unless your LTC is limited).

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-131.htm

It comes down to you need a lawyer to understand our laws (if your lucky).

HolyCrap Batman, Thank the Kennedy clan for this.

I just finished reading your "law" It seems more like an excerpt from Dante's Inferno than anything resembling the law.

 

[Leatherneck]

Everett OC training bulletin

So just to clarify...
after reading the training bulletin, it sounds like you can carry a rifle or shotgun, as long as the barrel isn't shorter than the legal limit.

Interesting.

 

[Matt85]

So just to clarify...
after reading the training bulletin, it sounds like you can carry a rifle or shotgun, as long as the barrel isn't shorter than the legal limit.

Interesting.

yes you can. however its not very practical, onley times ive seen it done are at rallies.

-matt

 

[Metal_Monkey]

I heard on TV (so it must be true) that in WA a license plate FRAME is technically an infraction, since it obscures a portion of the plate.

Even though you can still visibly see everything I have been pulled over about 4 times for it. I'm sure you all know, but I will say it again since some cars are sold without them attached. It is also illegal to have a missing front plate. Even if it is in the windshield clearly. My mom had a new Vette that didn't have one because of the front panel that wasn't removed in the bumper. She only got pulled over once and got a very stern warning(if it was someone my age...instant ticket). I have got tickets for this and the frame thing. I even heard an officer tell me "chrome" ones are illegal because they obscure your vision when looking at the plate.........

I guess it all comes down to 1 thing......If they want to pull you over they will.

 

[Matt85]

update

i got a call from the south snohomish county sheriffs department yesterday about the letter. the call went somewhat as predicted... the officer told me that they will continue to stop and harass people who OC if they are called. i made an attempt at explaining the laws on illegally harassing and detaining people but he would hear nothing of it.

my advice to any one in the south everett or north lynnwood area would be to carry a recorder. the onley thing i can see that will stop them is if someone takes them to court.

on that note, would any one recomend an affordable recorder?

-matt

 

[Bill Starks]

Has anyone read RCW 9.41.060 (exemptions)? If he had a sleeping bag & tent in his rig, a CPL is not needed to carry loaded in a vehicle or to conceal about his person while going to or from his lawful outdoor activity.

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.060

 

[gogodawgs]

I Have these...

http://www.amazon.com/Veho-VCC003MU...1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1278626854&sr=8-1


http://www.olympusamerica.com/cpg_section/product.asp?product=1457

The video cam is $65 and the audio is $99. You can pick up a good audio recorder for $39 at Staples, Office Depot, etc....

i got a call from the south snohomish county sheriffs department yesterday about the letter. the call went somewhat as predicted... the officer told me that they will continue to stop and harass people who OC if they are called. i made an attempt at explaining the laws on illegally harassing and detaining people but he would hear nothing of it.

my advice to any one in the south everett or north lynnwood area would be to carry a recorder. the onley thing i can see that will stop them is if someone takes them to court.

on that note, would any one recomend an affordable recorder?

-matt

 

[Bill Starks]

http://www.amazon.com/Veho-VCC003MUV...8626854&sr=8-1
ordered mine from Amazon today. Free 2 day shipping and although its not needed I got 1/2 off on the 8gb storage card.