Meet and Greet to Disarm

[papa bear]

just to go back and say, weather the range wants to discriminate against OCers. even though it is wrong. that is their business. i just will never give my money to such a place

the bigger shocker is that a so called "pro-gun" group would support it and try to get their membership to go along with it. what's next, they will want us to go into other business that discriminate, and give them our money.

if you can't trust me to carry, you can't trust me,or any one else to carry

 

[Wulf.45]

In a perfect world, where everyone knows exactly how to handle a firearm appropriately, and is responsible, then maybe safety precautions would be overrated. Hand your loaded firearm to someone who you think is responsible, and BOOM. They weren't familiar with your firearm type. Whose fault? Yours.

Unfortunately, welcome to reality, the world ain't perfect. It's a simple request that firearms be unloaded upon entering the office, and remain unloaded unless on the firing line. If you're gonna have an AD/ND, do it outside where its much harder to hit anyone else. (Yes, I realize bullets DO go through walls, so if you're using the barrel correctly, hopefully your barrel is pointed down) If you manage to shoot yourself, then don't blame the range for "making you handle your firearm excessively". Sounds like you'd have enough trouble getting dressed to carry in the morning. Plus, if you have issues unloading your gun in a safe manner outside, do you think I feel safe having you handle a loaded firearm on the line next to me?

You guy are accusing a Shooting Range of forcing you to disarm. Dense much?

They're not asking you to "disarm". They're asking you to unload while in non shooting areas. After several legitimate issues with firearms accidentally being discharged in the office. It's not absurd. Unloaded gun in holster, magazine in my opposite pocket. If a threat emerges, (Who's gonna rob a shooting range?) load a mag and shoot. I'm no professional, but I can slap a mag in and put shots on target pretty darn quickly.

If you're arguing about the concept of it, seriously? We're all supposed to be on the same side. Can we quit demonizing each other and realize that we're all supporting the same goal? Or is it a vehicle to attack GRNC? Can we put internal politics aside maybe? I see more attacks against GRNC then I do anti-gunners on this forum. (No, I'm not a member of GRNC, nor NRA)

If someone lets me handle a firearm, I'm gonna check the chamber to verify it myself before handling. 5/6 people that I've ever let handle one of my firearms, haven't done that. And I hand it to them unloaded. You think I want to hand them a loaded one and hope that they're responsible enough to check or handle it appropriately? Or is it my job to unload it and then give it to them? Which brings up the very same point you guys did before, ADs/NDs are more likely when you're handling a firearm. So then you're forced to unload a hot firearm in a common area, increasing the threat.

Biggest problem I see here. Its a Meet and Greet. It's not a trip to the store, or taking your family out to dinner. Firearms are going to be handled and looked at and exchanged to try out and feel out. I don't want to be in the middle of a crowd that is passing out and handling loaded firearms, trusting everyone to be responsible. I don't trust people. Part of the very reason I carry in the first place. This whole thing is blown way out of proportion to the point of absurdity.

 

[WalkingWolf]

It is a unsafe range, it only took me ONE visit to never go back. They violate a primary rule of firearms, all guns are loaded.

 

[bc.cruiser]

I took a count while we were getting the greeting and safety brief taken care of. 21 (maybe the range sign-in sheet had a different number, IDK). I had expected about half again as many.

This horse has been beaten pretty much into paste. How about we bury it and move on?

 

[MAC702]

...Dense much?...

They're not asking you to "disarm". They're asking you to unload ...

Where's that 'rolling eyes' smilie I never use?

 

[Wulf.45]

Where's that 'rolling eyes' smilie I never use?

If your best argument is to purposefully remove the context from my statement, then let's please move out of 3rd grade and come up with a real argument or criticism to be entertained.

If you were truly being disarmed, then your loaded magazine would not be in your pocket, able to be replaced in .25 seconds to address a threat.

 

[XD40sc]

Pretty standard safety rules for a range. There is a reason, not to mention the ranges liability when clueless cowboy tries to show off his gun.

When someone shows up with the attitude demonstrated by the OP, having them unload their weapon sounds like a really good idea for everyone's safety. It's too far away for me to go, but I wouldn't miss their presence at all.

 

[MAC702]

...If you were truly being disarmed, then your loaded magazine would not be in your pocket, able to be replaced in .25 seconds to address a threat.

First, if you read the thread, you will see that the biggest problem is that people are being required to HANDLE their loaded sidearm someplace other than a firing line. This is the most unsafe thing the place can be requesting. It's exactly the kind of behavior that led to any incidents they have had.

Second, I can't believe you really think that a loaded magazine in a pocket is acceptable. Yes, it is pretty damn obvious that it doesn't take very long to load a gun. After all, you have the rest of your life to get it done.

Next, you are assuming everyone carries a magazine-fed semi-automatic.

Also, loading a gun is one of the most common times it can experience a malfunction, ESPECIALLY when being done under any sort of stress, the kind for which is almost impossible to train for most people. Hell, I'll even assume everyone always has two hands free to do so.

I'm pretty damn good with a pistol. But I humbly bow to your 0.25-second magazine-from-pocket-load-gun-address-threat. I had no idea that kind of awesomeness existed. Are you available for hire?

 

[Wulf.45]

First, if you read the thread, you will see that the biggest problem is that people are being required to HANDLE their loaded sidearm someplace other than a firing line. This is the most unsafe thing the place can be requesting.

If you had read my response, you would see my point about how this is a Meet and Greet where firearms will be exchanged to try out, handle, and get the general feel for. That is the advertised purpose of the meeting. The purpose is to handle firearms. And meet people that you don't actually know. Unless you are suggesting we all handle loaded firearms for the fun of it, with people we don't know, cause we're all firearm experts?

Second, I can't believe you really think that a loaded magazine in a pocket is acceptable. Yes, it is pretty damn obvious that it doesn't take very long to load a gun. After all, you have the rest of your life to get it done.

If I were going to the store, or dinner with my family, or out in public, then no, in the pocket would not be in any way acceptable. But we're not in those situations. We're at a business which, according to your theory, that if everyone is a responsible safety minded person, should be immune to ADs/NDs. Yet they've had 3 bullets go whizzing around in their office. Again, look at the environment you're in.

Next, you are assuming everyone carries a magazine-fed semi-automatic. Loading a gun is one of the most common times it can experience a malfunction, ESPECIALLY when being done under any sort of stress, the kind for which is almost impossible to train for most people.

You have a valid point. Wheelgun guys are disadvantaged. I did not account for this as I was obviously emphasizing a situation which would support my side of the argument more. Good call.

I'm pretty damn good with a pistol. But I humbly bow to your 0.25-second magazine-from-pocket-load-gun-address-threat. I had no idea that kind of awesomeness existed. Are you available for hire?

*Disclaimer* I am not good enough to load a firearm in .25 seconds. You have me there.
Again, I exaggerated the time to emphasize the point that if a threat were to emerge, with a lobby full of people with guns, that within 30 seconds, someone, somewhere, can load and fire their weapon. You're not all helpless simply because the rounds are in a separate pocket as the gun. You are not all helpless beings simply because you can't have a round chambered while showing your buddy your latest purchase.

I am on your side in one scenario: Concealed weapons. If you have your EDC, and are not going to be touching or using it at all, then I do agree that you shouldn't have to unload it.

 

[MAC702]

If you had read my response, you would see my point about how this is a Meet and Greet where firearms will be exchanged to try out, handle, and get the general feel for. That is the advertised purpose of the meeting. The purpose is to handle firearms. And meet people that you don't actually know. Unless you are suggesting we all handle loaded firearms for the fun of it, with people we don't know, cause we're all firearm experts?...

I am on your side in one scenario: Concealed weapons. If you have your EDC, and are not going to be touching or using it at all, then I do agree that you shouldn't have to unload it.

Thank you for restoring the levity to our discussion. (I snipped much of it for brevity in the quote)

To your first point, I will admit that my part of this discussion did not take into account the pass-guns-around atmosphere, nor that this was a one-time thing for this particular day. It's been so long since the OP, I have not refreshed myself on the thread for recent posts.

While I have many times been in such a scene, sidearms were loaded and not handled. When someone asks if they can check it out, I tell them to give me advance notice next time and I will pack a different sidearm so that that handgun can be part of the festivities. If such a party is planned, I can see the rule having some merit, though it would not be a party that professionals would need/want to attend unless on the staff.

I make no comment on concealed versus open carry, however. Indeed, open carriers are more likely to carry more safely.

 

[papa bear]

If your best argument is to purposefully remove the context from my statement, then let's please move out of 3rd grade and come up with a real argument or criticism to be entertained.

If you were truly being disarmed, then your loaded magazine would not be in your pocket, able to be replaced in .25 seconds to address a threat.

and that sure did work for CA. look the point is, i don't give my money to anti rights businesses. if you want to go ahead. i just think you ought to be honest and say you don't trust people with fire arms and work to have them taking from good and honest citizens. if you are an anti admit it

Pretty standard safety rules for a range. There is a reason, not to mention the ranges liability when clueless cowboy tries to show off his gun.

When someone shows up with the attitude demonstrated by the OP, having them unload their weapon sounds like a really good idea for everyone's safety. It's too far away for me to go, but I wouldn't miss their presence at all.

wow that was a real and good argument you really set me straight. i will never carry a loaded firearm again. it's just too dangerous. there's that eye roll icon