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Milwaukee Magazine to do open carry story - needs help now

shernandez

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Jun 23, 2008
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, Wisconsin, USA
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i just wanted to say that I am still looking for people to interview for my story. Thank you all for your help over the last couple of days.
 

Gray Peterson

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Samantha,

Are you willing to hear an out of state perspective? Washington State was in a similar situation three or four years ago until we cleaned things up over here.

-Lonnie
 

shernandez

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, Wisconsin, USA
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Are there any women anywhere in Wisconsin who have opened carried? Anyone have a wife/girlfriend/sister/mother/etc who open carries?
 

Mike

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Pointman wrote:
Ms. Hernandez wrote:
Have any of youWisconsin open carriers had any reason to draw your guns while carrying?
No, but guns aren't allowed in art classes in any public schools or universities.

Before an OpenCarry member answers any such questions, they should realize that any statement may be taken out of context and/or present future problems for them.

With all due respect to Ms. Hernandez, there are several levels of editorial staff her article must pass through before it is published, and Milwaukee Magazine is not known as an unbiased publication.

Any OpenCarry member should consider asking for the following before granting an interview in general, unless such information is already understood:

- A complete list of questions that will be asked, in order to prepare appropriately.
- The type of interview that will be conducted, such as e-mail, verbal, audio, video, etc.
- The context in which the interview will be presented.
- A clear understanding ofthe publisher'sposition on the topic.
- The usage rights as related to the interview and any and all comments, images, likenesses, etc. directly or indirectly provided by the person being interviewed.

This is by no means a complete list, but the average person should at least havea full understanding of these points before proceeding, especially when the topic is politically charged. Unless usage rights are restricted, your comments may appear in unexpected places in a context other than one that accurately represents your statements.
This comment is completely uncalled for, and should be ignored - if gun owners do not get into the discussion of gun rights issues, they lose. Anyone with this set of demands will never be interviewed by anybody.
 

shernandez

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, Wisconsin, USA
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Mike and I discussed this very situation today. No one has to speak with me. I am trying to get the most complete picture possible of open carry on both sides of the argument and the laws.
 

bnhcomputing

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Sent the following to Milwaukee County Sheriffs office:

Edward H. Bailey, Deputy Inspector
Adjutant, Office of the Sheriff
Office: 414.278.4647


Dear Mr. Bailey:

I have been in contact with both the La Crosse County Sheriff, and the La Crosse County District Attorney. Both have informed me that open carry of a firearm would NOT result in an arrest or a charge in La Crosse County so long as it was carried holstered and in a non-threatening manner and given no other firearms statute was violated.

I am specifically requesting information regarding Milwaukee County where I happen to travel quite a bit and so there can be no misunderstanding, are you informing me that although legal in La Crosse County, open carry of a firearm would result in a disorderly conduct charge in Milwaukee County should a citizen call law enforcement?

Respectfully submitted,

bnhcomputing

Received the following reply:

Mr. bnhcomputing:
To answer the query, "would open carry of a firearm result in a disorderly conduct charge in Milwaukee County should a citizen call law enforcement," the answer is, of course, only if the conduct tended to cause or provoke a disturbance. Of course charging decisions are the purview of the District Attorney's Office, so only he could definitively state what conduct may result in a criminal charge being issued.
I do note (of dubious interest) that under State v. Schwebke, disorderly conduct does not necessarily require disruptions that implicate the public directly. The statute does encompass conduct that tends to cause a disturbance or disruption that may be private in nature, as long as there exists the real possibility that a subsequent disturbance or disruption would spill over and disrupt the peace, order or safety of the surrounding community as well.

Respectfully Submitted,

Edward H. Bailey, Deputy Inspector
Adjutant, Office of the Sheriff
Office: 414.278.4647
Now as shernandezis a member of the press, I would suggest she immediately contact the AG's office and request an opinion. She may not get it BEFORE her article is due, but there should definately be a followup somewhere.

ADDED:

I think NOW is the time, and if PARA is willing, this information should be used to file for the DJ you all have been bouncing around as this guy has made it CLEAR, they intend to harras and arrest.
 

WIG19

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, Wisconsin, USA
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Ms. Hernandez has previously inquired about Glocktalk where there is an active Carry Issues forum here. I post there quite a bit but there is a moderator for that forum area under the userid RussP who, although from VA, is well-versed in open-carry issues.

One observation that Ms. Hernandez might take away from this endeavor is the obvious skepticism held by law-abiding citizens (who've simply made a decision to take more responsibility for the safety of themselves and their loved ones) that their view will get a fair shake in the press. Perhaps her difficulty in getting material, and why, is worthy of part of the article.

I have open-carried in my small town, with no consequences thus far, but a small western WI city is different than the enclaves of Madison or Milwaukee. When travelling I'm the same person but carry concealed on non-resident carry permit(s).

That a citizen must end up being subjected to becoming a 'test case' to endure outrageous expense and a city's waste of tax dollars to fight for a right, absent any other criminal conduct, is a shame anywhere in America. That should be the take-away for the article.

No, I've never had to present the firearm. Yes, I'm still waiting for the AG and/or Legislature to act to clarify the absolute swamp that is WI firearms law since, as it stands now, any reasonable person has to either deny themselves exercise of the right, or in the blink of an eye suddenly find themselves breaking the law. RE open-carry, the most obvious example is my open-carry into the convenience store to pickup my regular coffee & newspaper, chat with the staff about weather, gas prices, etc., put some pennies in the jar and then... if I simply get in my car I've now broken the concealed carry statute.

Do I think such an article, after making it through the editorial process, would ever call for an examination of such things, as being in the public interest? Not really, although I'd be delighted to be proved wrong by Ms. Hernandez. I truly wish her luck, but I don't think it can be discarded that there is general mistrust in play. When local papers continue to run AP stories citing completely flawed WHO or CDC "studies" as factual, without any further fact-checking save a 1 liner at the bottom that says "gun advocacy groups dispute the survey" then perhaps she will understand the trust issue.

I'm open to answering some reasonable questions (PM or email works), no different than I would be about helping a young student write a paper about concealed-carry on campus... but I remain skeptical.

:cool:
 

shernandez

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, Wisconsin, USA
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-The context in which the interview will be presented.
- A clear understanding ofthe publisher'sposition on the topic.
- The usage rights as related to the interview and any and all comments, images, likenesses, etc. directly or indirectly provided by the person being interviewed.


These lastthree are where it will cause you problems. unfortunatly I hava to go where the story takes me and with so many people not talking it makes it hard to get the entire story out there.

Anything that you say can be used unless you specifically state that it is for off record purposes. As for giving you a copy of the story prior to publication that violates copyright laws and I will not even have the story in my possesion after the 21. I record 98 percentof my interviews and I have never recieved any complaints when it comes to misquoting or taking a quote out of context.

While I understand your reaons for reluctanceI have a job to do.
 

Mike

Site Co-Founder
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WIG19 wrote:
Ms. Hernandez has previously inquired about Glocktalk where there is an active Carry Issues forum here. I post there quite a bit but there is a moderator for that forum area under the userid RussP who, although from VA, is well-versed in open-carry issues.

One observation that Ms. Hernandez might take away from this endeavor is the obvious skepticism held by law-abiding citizens (who've simply made a decision to take more responsibility for the safety of themselves and their loved ones) that their view will get a fair shake in the press. Perhaps her difficulty in getting material, and why, is worthy of part of the article.

I have open-carried in my small town, with no consequences thus far, but a small western WI city is different than the enclaves of Madison or Milwaukee. When travelling I'm the same person but carry concealed on non-resident carry permit(s).

That a citizen must end up being subjected to becoming a 'test case' to endure outrageous expense and a city's waste of tax dollars to fight for a right, absent any other criminal conduct, is a shame anywhere in America. That should be the take-away for the article.

No, I've never had to present the firearm. Yes, I'm still waiting for the AG and/or Legislature to act to clarify the absolute swamp that is WI firearms law since, as it stands now, any reasonable person has to either deny themselves exercise of the right, or in the blink of an eye suddenly find themselves breaking the law. RE open-carry, the most obvious example is my open-carry into the convenience store to pickup my regular coffee & newspaper, chat with the staff about weather, gas prices, etc., put some pennies in the jar and then... if I simply get in my car I've now broken the concealed carry statute.

Do I think such an article, after making it through the editorial process, would ever call for an examination of such things, as being in the public interest? Not really, although I'd be delighted to be proved wrong by Ms. Hernandez. I truly wish her luck, but I don't think it can be discarded that there is general mistrust in play. When local papers continue to run AP stories citing completely flawed WHO or CDC "studies" as factual, without any further fact-checking save a 1 liner at the bottom that says "gun advocacy groups dispute the survey" then perhaps she will understand the trust issue.

I'm open to answering some reasonable questions (PM or email works), no different than I would be about helping a young student write a paper about concealed-carry on campus... but I remain skeptical.

:cool:
Right! That is what she needs to hear from real gun owners - that "presenting" a firearm is serious serious business - and that even handling in a public area is not cool at all and can lead to negligent discharges - that's why we wear modern retention holsters and have gun safes at hoime. Et etc. Let's roll!
 

bnhcomputing

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Another thing shernandez needs to consider: There are many of us who would PREFER to carry, but when we get conflicting replies from LEO, we are put in a precarious position. We cannot afford to have our names and faces all over the paper and television being charged with gun crimes as it will tarnish our reputation and the reputation of organizations we are involved in. We all know the arrest makes the front page, but the "no charges filed" never even gets a mention as there is NO FAIR PRESS in this country.

The REAL problem here is the AG's silence. His inaction, is in itself an action. That is why I have provided two VERY DIFFERENT views from LEO on opposite sides of the state. When presented to the AG, we'll get some PC BS answer like "well we don't..."and that is the problem.
 

WIG19

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Messages
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Location
, Wisconsin, USA
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shernandez wrote:
These lastthree are where it will cause you problems. unfortunatly I hava to go where the story takes me and with so many people not talking it makes it hard to get the entire story out there.
As I said above, PM or email works if you want to set something up, although I've not been victimized by Milwaukee area LE, the far west being almost a completely different state - so what I might say would have little bearing on your readership. Then again, perhaps the disparity in experiences is part of the story as well, pointing to the inconsistency of law as applied.In that sense, it would be interesting to get an idea where the story is taking you but we'll probably have to wait for publication for that. :)

Perhaps some could concede that Ms. Hernandez appears to be gathering info in good faith and, if misquoted or skewed, those here could also agree to politely flame the magazine after the fact, if that happens. Innocent until proven guilty?
 

shernandez

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, Wisconsin, USA
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I have found that people who are not in the milwaukee area are more willing to talk than those in the area. Unfortunatly I am sticking as close to home as possible on this one. Unfortunatly I can not tell you the direction that the story is taking, but I lack local perspective on the pro-open carry side.
 

WIG19

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, Wisconsin, USA
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Well, best of luck. When it's done a link would be nice so that we can all read it and, as will happen onall internet forums, pronounce judgment.

I know you have editors and hoops to jump through but wish for you the resolve to keep it balanced. That's really all anyone can reasonably expect and, frankly, it would be refreshing.

One other aspect you may want to explore, which is sometimes an unintended consequence of open-carry. Those in a state who were so previously adamantly opposed to a concealed carry law, found themselves completely blown away because their sensibilities were offended by seeing polite-but-armed citizens protecting themselves, and they joined the cry for a concealed-carry statute so all those "evil" guns would be tucked away out of sight.

Even Rep. Ron Kind (D-WI) has gone on record recently to say that dire predictions that have gone before passage of states' carry laws have all been found to be completely unfounded (in the 48 other states that have a permit system).

Again, good luck.

:cool:
 

shernandez

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Location
, Wisconsin, USA
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I know that Para does not speak for all open carry individuals, but he is the only person who has come forward to speak openly about his experiences. unfortunately the silence of Milwaukee area open carry individuals will in and of its self slant the article. I encourage those of you who are hesitant to speak call me at the office or email me. I can only make this story as fair as the information that I am given.
 
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