My latest run in at the DMV

[The Big Guy]

I'm screen capping the video and just watched him a little closer. I think he mouthed "a$$hole" right before he walked away.

Coming from a Metro Officer you should wear that title with pride...

TBG

 

[MilitaryMike]

Coming from a Metro Officer you should wear that title with pride...

TBG

Probably the most intelligent thing he could say.

 

[Sabotage70]

He's the one that ran my gun.

He likes to give his opinion while on the job.

He didn't say anything about a search, even though they just ran my gun.

He didn't say much.

And the sarge.

There was others, but I didn't have any interaction with them. At one point you can hear me counting. That was the amount of black and whites that I seen from where I was standing.

 

[ed2276]

He's the one that ran my gun.

He likes to give his opinion while on the job.

He didn't say anything about a search, even though they just ran my gun.

He didn't say much.

And the sarge.

There was others, but I didn't have any interaction with them. At one point you can hear me counting. That was the amount of black and whites that I seen from where I was standing.

Is the cop in the third pic really carrying 5 mags on his duty belt? He must be expecting to go to war, or something! I wonder how many unarmed citizens he is able to kill with that load out B4 he has to resupply his ammo?

 

[28kfps]

Sab, I want to say what a jam up job with the video and posting it. Obviously, you knew you were going to see the wrath of scrutiny and willing to deal with it. Thanks so much for posting it. There is a lot to learn from it. I am a little no, a lot confused by what I thought it took to have an LEO confrontation while in a public building.

I thought in order for a public building not to allow firearms in it had to be clearly posted on all entrances or have metal detectors. There was none on the DMV so good to go in my mind. Is a public building allowed to do as private business that is having the right to refuse serve to anyone if they choose?

In addition, in order to warn of trespassing is when one does not leave. Sab was questioned about the firearm in the building and then met up with METRO outside. However, not completely off the property It would appear to me the fact he did go outside was a pretty good sign of complying with leaving at least the building. Could it be this LEO was allowing his opinions to overwhelm the facts?

 

[ed2276]

I think everyone has pretty much hit on their observations of what you could have done in handling the cops during this situation. I don't know that I would have done much better when surrounded by 6+ metro cops with the reputation this department has. In my opinion, the way this should have gone is:

Metro (to DMV Supervisor): Why did you call us?

DMV: This guy came inside the DMV carrying a gun.

Metro: That is his right. There is no law prohibiting him from openly carrying a firearm into the DMV to conduct business. Was he threatening anyone with the weapon, or otherwise causing a disturbance?

DMV: No. He just came inside with the weapon. But, the security guard and I told him it was a misdemeanor for him to have the gun inside like that.

Metro: You were wrong. You need to brush up on the law, before you try to tell others what it is.

Metro (to SAB70) : I'm sorry for the inconvenience, Sir. Let me reholster your weapon for you and we'll be on our way.

Unfortunately, Metro acted ignorantly and outside the existing law; and in my opinion they acted unprofessionally. I think you have a valid complaint against those officers with whom you interacted, especially the one who mouthed "*******", if that is what he did. That is completely unprofessional conduct. You should also lodge a complaint against the Sgt for failure to supervise.

It is no wonder DOJ is opening an investigation against Metro for a pattern and practice of abuse and excessive force. If this is how Metro addresses innocent, law-abiding residents of Las Vegas and has disregard for enforcing the laws justly this goes to a pattern and practice of abuse and failure to supervise. I don't know if this encounter would be of any value to DOJ in its upcoming investigation, but you might want to contact them and see if it is something DOJ is interested in adding to their evidence.

When I first came to Las Vegas, I went to the DMV on Sahara on the East side of town to get my Nevada license. I was really impressed with the speed, efficiency, and friendliness of the staff. First, the office was to open at 8am. When I got there at 0730, there was already a long line in the parking lot around to the side of the building. DMV staff opened the doors EARLY, at 0740! It only took me about an hour to get through with my business. I was impressed with everything, and I wrote to the director of the DMV to praise that office and the staff.

If you can give me the name of the DMV supervisor and of the security guard, I now have another letter to write to the DMV director; it won't be one of praise this time.

I am also considering writing a complaint letter directly to the Sheriff. Screw the bureaucratic chain-of-command BS. I will especially be complaining against the cop who called you an *******, if you can aver that is what he in fact called you. If he did, that is the height of unprofessional and unethical conduct. I will generally be complaining of the unjust enforcement of law demonstrated by Metro.

 

[Sabotage70]

I was actually out the door when the guard followed me out the door and told me I couldn't carry it. That's when I asked him to bring out the NRS and show me. That's when he went inside and got the supervisor. I asked her the same thing and that's when she said metro was called.

I knew I was right and stuck around after the guard told me that. I could have left right there but I wanted to get them set straight. Then once I found out metro was called I knew I had to stick around.

Sent from the Droid on roids

 

[ed2276]

I was actually out the door when the guard followed me out the door and told me I couldn't carry it. That's when I asked him to bring out the NRS and show me. That's when he went inside and got the supervisor. I asked her the same thing and that's when she said metro was called.

I knew I was right and stuck around after the guard told me that. I could have left right there but I wanted to get them set straight. Then once I found out metro was called I knew I had to stick around.

Sent from the Droid on roids

Well, I would avoid contact with Metro at almost all costs; as you learned, even when you are right that doesn't mean Metro will back you. Metro doesn't exist to help you, as you now know, and most certainly will try to get something on you to take you into custody.

You had done nothing wrong, as you correctly note. But, I think to stick around and interact with Metro was the wrong way to go about it. I would have left and then taken up the matter about the supervisor and the guard with the higher-ups in DMV from home.

 

[Sabotage70]

Well, I would avoid contact with Metro at almost all costs; as you learned, even when you are right that doesn't mean Metro will back you. Metro doesn't exist to help you, as you now know, and most certainly will try to get something on you to take you into custody.

You had done nothing wrong, as you correctly note. But, I think to stick around and interact with Metro was the wrong way to go about it. I would have left and then taken up the matter about the supervisor and the guard with the higher-ups in DMV from home.

If I would have done that. I believe if I would have left once metro was called, they would have performed a felony stop, then for sure I would have been face down on the side of the road. That's why I stuck around and faced the music.

Sent from the Droid on roids

 

[timf343]

Sab-

You played it right. No one can say you did such and such wrong, because at the end of the day, despite a confrontation with Metro, you went home alive and with zero criminal charges. Everyone will handle the situation differently. We know from history, Guns & Metro don't mix, so you were right to be nervous when you knew they were hunting for you.

Now that the situation is over, it's time to take the gloves off. Figure out in your mind what you will do different next time, if anything, get your complaints written while the situation is still fresh in your memory, and keep some good notes. If you want to file a 1983 lawsuit (you have up to 2 years to do so), I'll help you get the ball rolling.

Tim

 

[Sabotage70]

I was hoping for your help. I talked to Dave this morning and he let me know where I should start.

I'll try and not be to much of a pain in the ass.

Sent from the Droid on roids

 

[The Big Guy]

Sab-

You played it right. No one can say you did such and such wrong, because at the end of the day, despite a confrontation with Metro, you went home alive and with zero criminal charges. Everyone will handle the situation differently. We know from history, Guns & Metro don't mix, so you were right to be nervous when you knew they were hunting for you.

Now that the situation is over, it's time to take the gloves off. Figure out in your mind what you will do different next time, if anything, get your complaints written while the situation is still fresh in your memory, and keep some good notes. If you want to file a 1983 lawsuit (you have up to 2 years to do so), I'll help you get the ball rolling.

Tim

I think this is some solid advise. It is a learning experience for all of us. I realize that the way I would handle things with Henderson PD, where I live, is much different then how I would handle the situation when faced with Metro. It is obvious to me that in this situation one is not going to win on the street and the best thing to do is to invoke your 5th and take them on after the fact. It also reminds me how important it is to run audio at all times when going anywhere public. Audio of what happened inside the building would prove that whether legal or not, you were not trespassed and therefore they had no right to call the cops, period.

When are we going to hold the sheriff responsible for his department?

TBG

 

[usmcmustang]

"When are we going to hold the sheriff responsible for his department?"

One more time... Exactamundo !!!

 

[DON`T TREAD ON ME]

After speaking with Sab this am I emailed the contact at the DMV that I had emailed about a year ago when they agreed that the signs were wrong and that they would change them. I got a reply back, and will let Sab share it when he is ready but I will say that the DMV is apolagetic and called trhe situation "very embarrassing" and will be reminding their managers that OC is legal. as far as the way they called the details I will hold off as I do not know the facts. I wish METRO would pull up their "Big Boy" Britches and admit mistakes from time to time, it would do them some public relations good.

 

[ed2276]

If I would have done that. I believe if I would have left once metro was called, they would have performed a felony stop, then for sure I would have been face down on the side of the road. That's why I stuck around and faced the music.

Sent from the Droid on roids

Good point! Your noggin was working sharper than mine would have been.

 

[MilitaryMike]

Well, at least it is a start in the right direction. As long as we all keep fighting for our rights and educating people, things will be good in the end.

 

[Sabotage70]

Anybody up so they can proofread my strongly worded email?

 

[Sabotage70]

Well, here it is.

Mr. DMV

I appreciate the fast response to the incident that happened to me on Sat Dec 17, 2011 at your Flamingo office, however your statements are not what occurred..
Here are the facts that happened the mid morning appr. 11 am..

I went into your location to see about getting a extended 30 day pass for my new Jeep that I had bought prior.. I spoke with an associate at the counter and they asked if I had already obtained a 30 day from the dealership, they then told me I would not be able to obtain another one.. I walked out the exit, when I noticed the security guard following me.. When I exited the building he was behind me, I turned around and he stated that I could not have a gun in the DMV.. I responded " No it is legal for me to carry" At that point he told me it was a misdemeanor, which I responded "NO." That's when he tried to point at the door and show me signs that are no longer there.... That's when I told him to go get the NRS and show me.. He said he would be right back, I waited a few minutes and he returned with the Supervisor who told me that it was illegal to have a gun in the DMV, I again asked her to show me the NRS... She responded with Metro is on their way...

I again told her to get the NRS, and shut up after that..

I waited for Metro to show up... As far as there being another call out for a stolen vehicle, I do not believe.... Metro does not send 7 black and whites rolling code 3 for a stolen vehicle..
And yes Sir it is extremely embarrassing for me as well as you...

Especially when I know my rights and choose to enforce my rights as a law abiding citizen, to have my gun removed from me.. Harassed by Metro and unable to conduct my business in a timely matter.. And as well as putting my life in jeopardy by having Metro called on me for no reason other than ones believe .. Remember Erik Scott? I hope that you do indeed take the time to educate your offices on state and federal laws to avoid this in the future... Maybe this should have been done before you let a new security guard represent you..

I will be attaching the video of my rights being removed due to your associates ignorance of the law..

I was able to start the video after my firearm was illegally removed.

Take a special note at about the 13 minute mark when she tells me how her son open carry's and was thrown out of the DMV.

http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/19208322

Once again thank you for your quick response,

Sabotage70

My phone

 

[OC-moto450r]

2A

 

[28kfps]

Well, here it is.

Mr. DMV


I waited for Metro to show up... As far as there being another call out for a stolen vehicle, I do not believe.... Metro does not send 7 black and whites rolling code 3 for a stolen vehicle..
And yes Sir it is extremely embarrassing for me as well as you...

Sabotage reread the above paragraph. Am I not reading it correct or should "Metro does not send" be replace with something like I do not believe….."Metro would send 7 black and whites”?