Need to kick room mates out ASAP! Question! (Washington State)

[Aaron1124]

That's what we should have done, but it doesn't matter anymore, since it's already a done deal, and my reasons of "why" won't change the current circumstances. It's just an all around crummy situation. I would have never expected them to rip me off, as I gave them the benefit of the doubt as two people legitimately needing some help.

 

[Aaron1124]

I just spoke with a landlord/tenancy attorney this morning, and he confirmed everything that I had already suspected. They CAN make a case that they are residents here, considering they have had a utility bill in their name, and have their personal belongings here. He did warn me that if I were to physically remove them from the premises, and change the locks, that they could sue me for unlawful eviction. It's not a chance I would be willing to take.

Washington State does NOT favor people like me in cases like this.

 

[nonameisgood]

Sorry you live somewhere that you cannot assert your rights. (Jk, but after a convo I'm having with another WA poster on this forum, it seemed fitting.)

I personally would be less concerned about the repercussions than having unwanted guests in my house. Kind of like "judged instead if carried." I would want to address the immediate need and deal with the consequences. After all, will they be able to afford a suit for wrongful eviction?

 

[Bill Starks]

Washington State does NOT favor people like me in cases like this.

You are correct ! Let someone sleep on your couch for the night and they can claim "Residence Domicile" You have to go thru the eviction process to remove them if they won't leave. My step-son had some friends stay over "cause they needed a place to stay for the night." 5 months later I was finally able to get them out of my house.

 

[sharkey]

Sorry you live somewhere that you cannot assert your rights. (Jk, but after a convo I'm having with another WA poster on this forum, it seemed fitting.)

I personally would be less concerned about the repercussions than having unwanted guests in my house. Kind of like "judged instead if carried." I would want to address the immediate need and deal with the consequences. After all, will they be able to afford a suit for wrongful eviction?

The better question is can the OP afford to lose a suit for wrongful eviction? Can he even afford the attorney fees to defend himself?

It's very cheap and easy to sue. I sued one landlord in ID and one in AZ. They both had attorney's. I did not. They both lost.

You know what really hurt them? Their attorney fees.

When I sued the first landlord in Idaho I realized I screwed up and did not ask for enough money to motivate him to fix the problems. I immediately stopped paying rent so he would file an eviction and I could counter sue him for waaaaaay more money. Worked like a charm.

ETA:

Look at all the free legal help his "tenants" are entitled to. How much free legal help can he get?

http://www.tenantsunion.org/rights/section/legal-assistance-guide

 

[sharkey]

Are they interfering with your use of the property?

Using the property for illegal drug activity?

Engaged in gang-related activity?

If so you can give them a 3 day notice to vacate.

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=59.18.510

P.S. I just realized you can't take any action against them at all. If it goes to court all they need to do is state that you do not own the property and have no authority to remove them.

I did that against a property management company (poorly worded lease to my benefit) when I lived in ID to force the slum lord owner to fly out for court hearings. HAHA He lived here in AZ. Does WA allow for trial by jury in unlawful detainer cases?

Yes they do, that pisses lawyers off when you ask for a jury trial in an unlawful detainer case. I did that in both ID and AZ.

http://www.kingcounty.gov/courts/Clerk/Rules/Individuallinks/LCR_38.aspx

http://www.courts.wa.gov/court_rules/?fa=court_rules.display&group=sup&set=CR&ruleid=supcr38

http://www.washingtonlawhelp.org/resource/eviction-and-your-defense#bb

 

[Tawnos]

Are they interfering with your use of the property?

Using the property for illegal drug activity?

Engaged in gang-related activity?

If so you can give them a 3 day notice to vacate.

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=59.18.510

P.S. I just realized you can't take any action against them at all. If it goes to court all they need to do is state that you do not own the property and have no authority to remove them.

I did that against a property management company (poorly worded lease to my benefit) when I lived in ID to force the slum lord owner to fly out for court hearings. HAHA He lived here in AZ. Does WA allow for trial by jury in unlawful detainer cases?

Yes they do, that pisses lawyers off when you ask for a jury trial in an unlawful detainer case. I did that in both ID and AZ.

http://www.kingcounty.gov/courts/Clerk/Rules/Individuallinks/LCR_38.aspx

http://www.courts.wa.gov/court_rules/?fa=court_rules.display&group=sup&set=CR&ruleid=supcr38

http://www.washingtonlawhelp.org/resource/eviction-and-your-defense#bb

Again, marijuana use is not illegal in Washington. Amazing how some on this forum will say "state's rights! state's rights!" until the moment it's for something like marijuana legalization. Then those same people turn around and see if they can complain to the feds.

Basically, the local police can't help with eviction for something that the person is doing legally under state law, and the feds aren't going to help with an eviction (especially for mere possession).

What is legal is not always right, and what is illegal is not always wrong. Eye95 would be well-served to remember that.

 

[sharkey]

Again, marijuana use is not illegal in Washington. Amazing how some on this forum will say "state's rights! state's rights!" until the moment it's for something like marijuana legalization. Then those same people turn around and see if they can complain to the feds.

Basically, the local police can't help with eviction for something that the person is doing legally under state law, and the feds aren't going to help with an eviction (especially for mere possession).

What is legal is not always right, and what is illegal is not always wrong. Eye95 would be well-served to remember that.

Where did I say anything about marijuana?

 

[MKEgal]

He's gotten professional advice from someone in the field, including from a lawyer.
I'd say take it.
Contact the local PD or SO to ask for help evicting some guests who have long overstayed their welcome & whom you are worried will harm your property or possibly yourselves.

references to "at will" tenants still having rights under the law.

At will means that the relationship can be severed by either party at any time.
But it applies to the parties in the contract, not to guests of the tenant.

wouldn't your "tenants" wife be breaking federal law by living in your place? if she's a DV offender and you own firearms?

First, they aren't tenants. The tenant is the person who signed the lease & is legally responsible for payment. The people being removed are guests who have stayed too long.
Second, even if she'd been convicted of DV, simply living in a residence with firearms is not a violation. She would need to have access to the guns. So if they're in a safe or on his person there's no violation.

How about an OC BBQ/Pot luck meet-up at your place while they are there?

I thought of that. Couple it with a "moving their stuff out onto the lawn" party & you'd have a decent afternoon. I doubt they'd cause any trouble.
Or are they regularly away from your house, so you could have the friends over & remove their property while they're gone? Even less fuss. Make sure the landlord OKs changing the locks, in case they've copied your keys.

Take pictures of everything in the house, have your landlord inspect the appartment and write down any serial numbers.

Maybe the landlord can reinforce to them that _he_ wants them gone _now_. His word would probably help immensely with getting the PD/SO to evict the 'guests'.
If you can, move your valuables someplace else until they're gone. Boxes in your office, in a friend's garage, anything to keep it out of their reach.

We figured we'd do it out of fairness, so they can help out with electricity while they are here

Why didnt you just have them pay you with cash or check and then you pay the bill like you normally do?

I wondered that too. No way for them to establish residency (using utility bills to apply for welfare).
But what's done is done.

I personally would be less concerned about the repercussions than having unwanted guests in my house.

+1
She's (apparently) violent toward children, they do not respect your wishes, I'd be concerned about them stealing from you & damaging the property.

Whatever you do, be safe. Good luck.

 

[Aaron1124]

Great follow up posts. Thanks a ton.

 

[Tawnos]

Where did I say anything about marijuana?

Uh, here:

Using the property for illegal drug activity?

When the only drug activity I found mentioned was here:

He started using marijuana out on the back porch, and I told him I did not want that on the property. He complied, but I caught him a few times after that.

 

[eye95]

I just spoke with a landlord/tenancy attorney this morning, and he confirmed everything that I had already suspected. They CAN make a case that they are residents here, considering they have had a utility bill in their name, and have their personal belongings here. He did warn me that if I were to physically remove them from the premises, and change the locks, that they could sue me for unlawful eviction. It's not a chance I would be willing to take.

Washington State does NOT favor people like me in cases like this.

I didn't know WA law, but I have seen enough cases where the law supported property usurpers over property owners to be concerned that tossing the roommates out would leave them legal recourse against you. It seems that your attorney has confirmed my suspicion.

Again, they made a huge mistake doing dope in your house. Ask your attorney about your legal exposure due to their behavior and if you can use the fact that they are breaking federal law to assist you in getting them out. I am not advocating extortion, but if they moved out, you'd no longer need to call the cops to protect yourself. Maybe they should know that.

 

[eye95]

--Edited by moderator-- he's walking away call the police......

Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

Do NOT under any circumstances do this. I strongly suspect that this would be felony. Please check WA law before taking this kind of advice. If this is an illegal suggestion, the quoted post violates OCDO rules!

 

[Aaron1124]

What did the deleted post say? As of right now, it seems they will be leaving on the 1st. They have all of their stuff packed, and mentioned how they're going to use their state money to get out, so if that goes smoothly, then they are out of my hair. If not, I'll continue seeking resources as to what I can do.

 

[sharkey]

Uh, here:

When the only drug activity I found mentioned was here:

I said illegal and even added emphasis. MJ is not illegal there.

I also asked about gang activity and interfering with use of the property.

Those were questions, not statements of fact.

In the end it does not matter, the OP does not own the property and has no legal standing to file an unlawful detainer action.

 

[eye95]

What did the deleted post say? As of right now, it seems they will be leaving on the 1st. They have all of their stuff packed, and mentioned how they're going to use their state money to get out, so if that goes smoothly, then they are out of my hair. If not, I'll continue seeking resources as to what I can do.

I didn't see this mentioned (and it should go without saying), but do not let these people cross your threshold ever again. They will squat again.

Some things I'd make sure I do: Do not help them carry a thing out, lest they claim you threw them out. Carry stuff to the door if they expect help, but make them take the items over the threshold.

Make sure they have everything. You don't want them coming back for anything.

Record your last interaction (being mindful of whatever WA's recording laws are). Make sure the recorded conversation includes their saying that they have decided to move out, that they have everything, and that you have their permission to ship them anything that they forgot or to leave it on the porch for them to pick up. Others might suggest other things to make sure you get on this recording. Anything and everything that a freeloader might claim you did or did not do should be addressed in that final recorded convo.

This is not legal advice, but these are the things I'd do (as a minimum) to make sure that there is no mistaking later what is happening. You want a record of your final agreement that they are no longer living in your home. I they are not required to know that they are being recorded, don't tell them.

 

[eye95]

What did the deleted post say? As of right now, it seems they will be leaving on the 1st. They have all of their stuff packed, and mentioned how they're going to use their state money to get out, so if that goes smoothly, then they are out of my hair. If not, I'll continue seeking resources as to what I can do.

He advocated that you do something that would almost surely get you arrested and charged with a felony. It was a real macbethian post, you know, the kind that advocates some bold, illegal action that the poster himself has never done, but the advocacy for which makes him look like a "real man."

 

[Aaron1124]

I agree with everything you said. I have now faced an interesting situation. Her father was suppose to come over today and get their belongings, to take them to his house, but she is claiming that he is "too busy", so they'll be waiting a couple of weeks. This means, they'll be here another couple of weeks. I served them the "termination of tenancy" which gives them until April 15th to leave, and if they do not leave, then I can file an eviction suit.

Now, my question is, if they stay beyond the 1st, should I start charging them rent? If they fail to pay rent, then I can serve them with a 3 day pay or vacate, and I'd be able to proceed with an eviction notice earlier than the 15th. But then again, if they DO manage to pay, then would that just buy them another full month here? Even though I already served them with a termination of tenancy? Unless I just charged them the pro rated amount...

Crappy situation.

 

[WalkingWolf]

I agree with everything you said. I have now faced an interesting situation. Her father was suppose to come over today and get their belongings, to take them to his house, but she is claiming that he is "too busy", so they'll be waiting a couple of weeks. This means, they'll be here another couple of weeks. I served them the "termination of tenancy" which gives them until April 15th to leave, and if they do not leave, then I can file an eviction suit.

Now, my question is, if they stay beyond the 1st, should I start charging them rent? If they fail to pay rent, then I can serve them with a 3 day pay or vacate, and I'd be able to proceed with an eviction notice earlier than the 15th. But then again, if they DO manage to pay, then would that just buy them another full month here? Even though I already served them with a termination of tenancy? Unless I just charged them the pro rated amount...

Crappy situation.

Do yourself a favor if you have not already, hire a attorney. The attorney will be able to serve you much better than we can. Plus a letter from a attorney will pretty much let them know you are no longer playing. Seems for now they have been jerking you around, that may just end once they are served notice by a lawyer. And if the laws are like laws in some other states, like Florida, you can sue them for the cost of the attorney and seize any property they have if they don't pay up.

 

[Aaron1124]

I finally got them out, but I got the landlord/condo owner involved. I explained the situation to him, and he basically told me that I have every right to remove them from the property, and to inform them that if they are not out by Friday, that he will be forced to serve an eviction notice on all occupants. I made sure they were out THAT night.

I do, however, have one concern. My landlord randomly came over for an "inspection" without any notice. He claimed it was in my lease, which is was.

Then later, I did some research, and noticed that there is an illegal clause in my lease that states "Landlord has permission to enter the premises for inspection at anytime during reasonable hours, with or without consent. Landlord will knock, but if tenant does not respond, landlord has every right to gain entrance to the premises. Landlord is not obligated to give any notice."

Washington State Law says that a landlord MUST give written consent 48 hours before entering for any reason, except for an emergency. Hmm....