Training: Cops vs Citizens on OC

[twoskinsonemanns]

...the cop worship and fetishism in America only bolsters that.

well said.
You know it's is quite alarming how LEOs are portrayed on TV. Running around bullying anyone they choose with absolute immunity. They make threats, become physically violent, spit on the 4th amendment over and over....But and the end of the show they are hero's and you have that warm fuzzy feeling.

Not only is it conditioning for the masses but I wonder also if it rubs off on real life LEOs... bolstering their own brazenness.

I hope more and more lawyers make themselves available to "smaller" cases of 4th-civil rights suits. And I think more and more people need to record their interactions with the LEOs.

BTW I am planning to put one of these in each of my vehicles.
http://www.spytechs.com/Car-Cameras/dual-view-cam.htm

 

[HighFlyingA380]

BTW I am planning to put one of these in each of my vehicles.
http://www.spytechs.com/Car-Cameras/dual-view-cam.htm

That looks like a great device. Although if I were you, I would try to hard-wire it, or at least add another 12V outlet where it's not easily accessed (such as inside a lockable glove box.) This way some corrupt LEO can't just reach in and pull the plug.

 

[twoskinsonemanns]

That looks like a great device. Although if I were you, I would try to hard-wire it, or at least add another 12V outlet where it's not easily accessed (such as inside a lockable glove box.) This way some corrupt LEO can't just reach in and pull the plug.

+1

Quite easy to wire it to the fuse box buss with an in-line fuse.

 

[davidmcbeth]

Let's hope that there are none of those around here.

Only when a guy is carrying a LadySmith. lol

 

[Gil223]

IMHO the issue has nothing to do with training REALLY.
It is about conditioning. The blessed TV has been telling us for ever that only cops can be trusted with a gun. Anyone else with a gun is a crook. I seriously doubt people's attitude toward guns comes from a thoughtful reflection of training programs for cops vs civilians training at a range.

I think you're correct in adding "conditioning" to the mix, but wrong to dismiss the general knowledge that police are "trained". Subliminal messages are powerful, and TV - which carries many of those messages - is the primary means of entertainment for people these days.

“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.” - Joseph Goebbels [Hitler's Propaganda Minister]

This is quite similar to the "Big Lie Theory" attributed to Hitler (one of them is paraphrasing the other). There's also a certain amount of desensitization that goes along with the conditioning (but that's a subject for a completely different forum). Pax...

 

[D.A.D.]

Securing handgun in vehicle

Also consider that, if you have an accident, the gun will get tossed around because it is "unsecured". It could even be thrown clear where anybody could find it.
It would be much safer in your holster.

Thanks for your response. I couldn't agree more, but Nebraska law says that it must clearly visible (I presume to a LEO). I had a conversation with a sheriff at a gun shop one time and we discussed this. He said that when he was off-duty and travelling, he would put his handgun in it's holster up on his dash board so there was no question that it was not concealed. In the winter when you are wearing a coat, it would be concealed if it was on your side so that has its issues, too.

I did see a really good set up that someone had where a holster was strapped to the steering wheel column, but who can say what "clearly visible" would mean to a LEO. Any LEO's out there that want to comment?

As I have stated to others in converstations, I get really tired of the adjectives "open" and "concealed" modifying the word "carry". The "right to bear" should stand on its own merits. To carry however, whenever, wherever, however should not be infringed. But that's what we are all working towards and I am thrilled to see the progress taking place across the nation.

I am grateful that Nebraska is already an open carry state so we don't have to fight that battle. But it must be a concerted effort to exercise that right to do what we can to normalize carrying. That's part of what I am doing now by open carrying in my vehicle, I'm normalizing myself as a starter. I do carry O&C around my farm and area, but now I'm taking it to the city where they have said that, if faced with the situation, anyone carrying open would be cited for disturbing the peace.

Thanks again. I am always interested in the discussion and experiences of others.



If it isn't loaded, what good is it? - me

 

[Ashtonian18]

All about Appearance

I agree with Since9

I really think that one of the biggest reasons that society is OK with LEO's OC'ing is primarily the uniform. I think that when someone sees that uniform it just clicks and an individual might say "well someone said he was ok to wear that gun so It's ok with me." I don't believe its got to do with training. I do notice that i am received better when i dress more professionally. But when i roll through Wally world with OD green cargo pants and boots I get wary eyes and questions. It's really a shame when you have to explain a born and raised citizen of the state im not even from their own laws governing OC because they had no idea that it was even legal.

I have been through LE training, Extensive Military training (still in btw) and plenty of Combatives/Unarmed training. And i really think that If i was in uniform, LE, Military, hell even EMS or Fire and Rescue, People wouldn't think twice about the gun i had on my hip regardless of weather or not i even know how to use it. Maybe a Fireman might get a question or two but they wouldn't second guess him. "oh uh we're rescuing an active shooter out of that building" LOL Thats my .02, A professional appearance make a difference.

 

[Aknazer]

BTW I am planning to put one of these in each of my vehicles.
http://www.spytechs.com/Car-Cameras/dual-view-cam.htm

I've been known to have a bit of a lead foot and would not want something that tracks all that information. But that is a pretty neat device.

 

[twoskinsonemanns]

I've been known to have a bit of a lead foot and would not want something that tracks all that information. But that is a pretty neat device.

That's certainly a point to consider. but I think the security it provides in case of a cop exceeding the law is enough of an advantage to out weigh the slim possibility it could be used against your lead foot. Last I heard they don't need any proof of your lead foot just their word against your.

 

[Aknazer]

The problem with this unit is its size makes it blatantly obvious to the cop. How hard would it be for a crooked cop to pull the power cord out, or the SD card, etc?

When both your feed and his dash cam are magically missing that would make it easier imo to discredit him and thus increase your credibility. Same goes for if his dash cam is missing and you have him on camera unplugging yours. Why would he unplug yours and his go missing (or "corrupted" data) unless he was planning on doing something he shouldn't? Granted it would be more of a fight than if you had the actual feed, but I think it could be used to your benefit.

 

[OC for ME]

Get two....one at the rear of the vehicle to monitor the rear view and the front of the vehicle.

 

[twoskinsonemanns]

It's just a semblance of security.

There's nothing keeping a crooked cop for walking up to you, slinging the door open and pounding you in the face until your black and blue because you "attacked" him when he asked for your license...

It's like a door lock, keep the honest cops honest. The scores of complaints/law suits, that eventually lead to a "time off with pay" will have to suffice for the bad ones. :banghead: