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225th Anniversary of the Bill of Rights

Citizen

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2006
Messages
18,278
Location
Fairfax Co., VA
Whew! I almost forgot! But, made it in just under the wire by a few hours.

Hopefully, readers will discover this thread with just enough time left in their evening for a private, inward celebration.

------------------------------------------

December 15th, 1791. The Bill of Rights is ratified by enough states to bring them into operation.

The history behind the Bill of Rights is well worth learning. I'll touch here on some high points.


Ever notice that the constitution was ratified in 1789, and the Bill of Rights in 1791? Yep. That constitutional convention actually shot down the proposal for a Bill of Rights. Those boys didn't want a Bill of Rights. Not all at the constitutional convention were opposed to a Bill of Rights, but enough were. It wasn't until freedom-minded people raised enough fuss and threatened to derail ratification of the constitution itself that a Bill of Rights was agreed to for a future date.

James Madison is sometimes called the Father of the Bill of Rights. Yeah, right. If he was, it was a shot-gun wedding. He wanted nothing to do with a Bill of Rights. He's on record describing it as an "odious" (his word) affair. He only relented after freedom-minded people demanded it. Then he started cobbling together recommendations of rights from the various state legislatures. George Mason would be better described as the Father of the Bill of Rights. He wrote the bill of rights for Virginia, which Madison took into account when framing his proposed Bill of Rights.

The Bill of Rights is also referred to as the first ten amendments to the constitution. But, did you know that congress sent a single "Article of Amendment" to the state legislatures?* It had twelve articles. The early ratifying states did not all agree on which articles to accept. But, between those early states, there were ten articles that were accepted. That is to say, some states accepted more, others accepted more but different articles. It was the ten articles accepted in common by the first (eleven?) states that brought the Bill of Rights into the constitution. That's a long-winded way of saying two articles received insufficient agreement.

But, here is a fun fact, to me anyway. The twenty-seventh amendment--the latest--was ratified in the 1990's. But, the 27th Amendment was one of the twelve articles submitted to the states originally!!! Yep! The last was among the first. The twenty-seventh amendment has to do with no pay raises for congress until at least one house election occurs after congress votes itself the raise. How did this amendment get added to the constitution? Well, a sharp-witted fellow realized that ratifications never die. That is to say, he realized there is no constitutional expiration date on a state's ratification! Those state ratifications prior to 1791 were still in force! "Hey!! We got a leg up!" So, he started persuading the necessary people and...today congress can vote itself a pay raise, but it doesn't go into effect until after the next House election.

I could keep going, but I have chores and there was a fellow who tells the history of the rights in the Bill of Rights so much better. Leonard W. Levy. He wrote a book about the Bill of Rights. Not so much the fight for ratification of the Bill of Rights, but a history of the rights in the Bill of Rights.

Levy passed away several years ago, but his book is still available: The Origins of the Bill of Rights.

Now, if you are still a little doubtful about buying this book, let me sweeten the pot a little. Levy was a (history?) professor, if I recall. He did win the Pulitzer Prize for a different book: The Origins of the Fifth Amendment: The Right Against Self-Incrimination. So, The Origins of the Bill of Rights was written by a Pulitzer Prize winner. Now, how can you go wrong with that? For sure, you can't go wrong with learning about the history of rights, even if not from Levy.

So, what are you waiting for?



*You can see the original document on the website of the national archives.
 
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Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,331
Location
Valhalla
Yep - It was Bill of Rights Day

I quietly celebrated the day by giving thanks to a host of dead white guys who inspite of their differences gave us a reinforced foundation for much of what I hold dear.

Now if we can somehow get our representatives, judges, and heads of state to do as well as these our forefathers did, our "rights" would be more secure.
 

77zach

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2007
Messages
2,913
Location
Marion County, FL
Amendment 1: Mostly intact. About to be intact as interned has made self censoring MSM irrelevant

2: Highly infringed at the federal level. In some states, it's almost gone.
3. Irrelevant/Intact
4. Almost gone
5. Almost gone
6. Quaint
7. ?
8. Gone
9. Gone
10. Gone

Happy Birthday Bill of Rights, like a windbreaker in Buffalo in January!
 

countryclubjoe

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
2,505
Location
nj
Whew! I almost forgot! But, made it in just under the wire by a few hours.

Hopefully, readers will discover this thread with just enough time left in their evening for a private, inward celebration.

------------------------------------------

December 15th, 1791. The Bill of Rights is ratified by enough states to bring them into operation.

The history behind the Bill of Rights is well worth learning. I'll touch here on some high points.


Ever notice that the constitution was ratified in 1789, and the Bill of Rights in 1791? Yep. That constitutional convention actually shot down the proposal for a Bill of Rights. Those boys didn't want a Bill of Rights. Not all at the constitutional convention were opposed to a Bill of Rights, but enough were. It wasn't until freedom-minded people raised enough fuss and threatened to derail ratification of the constitution itself that a Bill of Rights was agreed to for a future date.


















James Madison is sometimes called the Father of the Bill of Rights. Yeah, right. If he was, it was a shot-gun wedding. He wanted nothing to do with a Bill of Rights. He's on record describing it as an "odious" (his word) affair. He only relented after freedom-minded people demanded it. Then he started cobbling together recommendations of rights from the various state legislatures. George Mason would be better described as the Father of the Bill of Rights. He wrote the bill of rights for Virginia, which Madison took into account when framing his proposed Bill of Rights.

The Bill of Rights is also referred to as the first ten amendments to the constitution. But, did you know that congress sent a single "Article of Amendment" to the state legislatures?* It had twelve articles. The early ratifying states did not all agree on which articles to accept. But, between those early states, there were ten articles that were accepted. That is to say, some states accepted more, others accepted more but different articles. It was the ten articles accepted in common by the first (eleven?) states that brought the Bill of Rights into the constitution. That's a long-winded way of saying two articles received insufficient agreement.

But, here is a fun fact, to me anyway. The twenty-seventh amendment--the latest--was ratified in the 1990's. But, the 27th Amendment was one of the twelve articles submitted to the states originally!!! Yep! The last was among the first. The twenty-seventh amendment has to do with no pay raises for congress until at least one house election occurs after congress votes itself the raise. How did this amendment get added to the constitution? Well, a sharp-witted fellow realized that ratifications never die. That is to say, he realized there is no constitutional expiration date on a state's ratification! Those state ratifications prior to 1791 were still in force! "Hey!! We got a leg up!" So, he started persuading the necessary people and...today congress can vote itself a pay raise, but it doesn't go into effect until after the next House election.

I could keep going, but I have chores and there was a fellow who tells the history of the rights in the Bill of Rights so much better. Leonard W. Levy. He wrote a book about the Bill of Rights. Not so much the fight for ratification of the Bill of Rights, but a history of the rights in the Bill of Rights.

Levy passed away several years ago, but his book is still available: The Origins of the Bill of Rights.

Now, if you are still a little doubtful about buying this book, let me sweeten the pot a little. Levy was a (history?) professor, if I recall. He did win the Pulitzer Prize for a different book: The Origins of the Fifth Amendment: The Right Against Self-Incrimination. So, The Origins of the Bill of Rights was written by a Pulitzer Prize winner. Now, how can you go wrong with that? For sure, you can't go wrong with learning about the history of rights, even if not from Levy.

So, what are you waiting for?



*You can see the original document on the website of the national archives.
Thank you Citizen for the post..

The slavery issue was the elephant in the room at that time and if memory serves me correct, only Joh Adams, Thomas Paine, and Alexander Hamilton
did not own slaves, therefore I hold them in higher esteem than the others.. While Hamilton did not own slaves and many historians claim him to be and abolitionist, however being an ambitious young man, he was an avid defender of property rights and slaves as you know were considered "property." Therefore I rank him number three on the all time founding Fathers list, behind John Adams and number 1, Thomas Paine..
I have often articulated that many of the Founders were actually "slaves to their time"..

Citizen, A good read on Abolitionism is... " Means and Ends in American Abolitionism, Garrison and His Critics on Strategy and Tactics, 1834-1850
By Professor Aileen S. Kraditor-- Typical " old- fashioned intellectual History but very informative..

Regards
CCJ
 
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utbagpiper

Banned
Joined
Jul 5, 2006
Messages
4,061
Location
Utah
To be fair, the strongest argument against the Bill of Rights was:

1-Since the feds could only exercise those powers explicitly delegated it could never infringe rights anyway; and,

2-Enumerating certain rights would leave others in lower standing.

Even with the 9th and 10th amendments, one is hard pressed not to concede that #2 above hasn't come to pass in spades. Of course, the courts invent rights from the penumbra and ignore rights clearly enumerated.

Which is part of the reason that #1 above was wishful thinking.

Thank heaven for a written bill of rights. As the jurist once said of the 1st amendment, let me paraphrase to the entire Bill of Rights:

"Popular rights don't need protection. The Bill of Rights is to protect the unpopular rights, or at least the rights of the unpopular."

Charles
 
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