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Abolish cop unions

77zach

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Feb 5, 2007
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2,913
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Marion County, FL
http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com...ars-bill-gets-heated-public-hearing/80478478/


Why are cop unions so often against the right to bear arms? Here we see the irrationality and despotism and derangement of the political cop mind. Never mind they need only look to Florida or many other states that allow firearms without a permit inside vehicles. In much the same way, Florida cop unions bemoaned open carry when they could look to Alabama or 30 other states! It's scary that we have such puny minded people in positions of power. The scum rises to the top.
 

WalkingWolf

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Jul 31, 2011
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North Carolina
Follow the money. Cop unions do not want people that can defend themselves, never mind that police cannot, their is an illusion of safety. Responsible people who find they can take care of themselves may demand that we need less police, which means less dues.
 

PistolPackingMomma

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 1, 2011
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1,898
Location
SC
Not only that, but he who holds the gun holds the power, and guns are only equalizers if the people can carry them too.

Some segments of society don't like that...
 

Citizen

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Joined
Nov 15, 2006
Messages
18,283
Location
Fairfax Co., VA
http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com...ars-bill-gets-heated-public-hearing/80478478/


Why are cop unions so often against the right to bear arms? Here we see the irrationality and despotism and derangement of the political cop mind. Never mind they need only look to Florida or many other states that allow firearms without a permit inside vehicles. In much the same way, Florida cop unions bemoaned open carry when they could look to Alabama or 30 other states! It's scary that we have such puny minded people in positions of power. The scum rises to the top.
I would argue that police officer members of such unions should be fired on the spot. We have fundamental rationale on this point from the Founders. The only legimate* reason for government is to protect rights. Don't believe me? Check out what the Founders had to say:

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it,...(emphasis added by Citizen)
Any government agent who argues against an enumerated right should be fired from his government position on the spot. We're not talking about recognizing a "new" right, like gay marriage or abortion. We're talking about long-standing, long-recognized, hard-won, expensively-won enumerated rights. Out on their ear, and they can thank us for not summarily imprisoning them for their treasonous disregard of their only legitimate* purpose.



*Asterisk because I personally hold that not even a government that claims to be dedicated to protecting rights is legitimate insofar as it inflicts itself on peaceful individuals (and taxes them) without their express individual consent. But, hey. Government claims legitimacy--its their argument. Not mine. I have no problem using their own argument against them.
 

Citizen

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Nov 15, 2006
Messages
18,283
Location
Fairfax Co., VA
Abolish all public sector unions. We should all understand that tax payer funds are funding these thug unions.
Good point.

What is the old philosophical argument? The tyrannized pay for the swords used to threaten them?

Abolishing public sector unions wouldn't stop paying for the swords, but it would be a baby step in that direction.
 

WalkingWolf

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Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,912
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North Carolina
Qualified immunity needs to go to the trash bin. When ever a dept keeps an incompetent officer on the payroll they should suffer greatly, those superiors should be open to criminal charges as well as civil charges. The same goes for the union, they get a incompetent officer reinstated, or protect them from discipline for their behavior they need to be held both criminally, and civilly responsible.

In the case of Darren Wilson he was clearly incompetent, yet his behavior was encouraged until he endangered officers, and caused massive unrest. Being justified is no excuse for incompetence, it is legal to be stupid. But the decision to keep an idiot on the streets with a gun, and badge is criminal.
 

solus

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Aug 22, 2013
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here nc
qualified immunity protecting nice LEs, DAs, Judicial officers, ad nausea needs to be evaluated and everyone who is incompetent needs to be removed from office. if their actions were egregous, then punitive damages as well as incarceration is warranted.

ipse
 

WalkingWolf

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Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,912
Location
North Carolina
Darren Wilson was a typical cop, that can be found all across the country.

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/08/10/the-cop
NO! Most cops are not as stupid as he is, not surprising he has been turned down for employment.

From his own GJ testimony, he saw that Brown was oversize, not alone, was verbally profane, and combative, fit the description of an armed robber. Yet this mental giant drove right up to him, and rolled down his window. He is lucky to be alive, as well as responding officers, but this idiot should never work for the public again.

If being stupid is a hero, then every idiot would qualify.
 

OC for ME

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Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,344
Location
White Oak Plantation
NO! Most cops are not as stupid as he is, not surprising he has been turned down for employment.

From his own GJ testimony, he saw that Brown was oversize, not alone, was verbally profane, and combative, fit the description of an armed robber. Yet this mental giant drove right up to him, and rolled down his window. He is lucky to be alive, as well as responding officers, but this idiot should never work for the public again.

If being stupid is a hero, then every idiot would qualify.
I'll clarify. Wilson did what many cops do (before he learned of Brown being the suspected c-store robber), yell at kids walking down the middle of the street. Kids have been walking on/playing in residential streets since the invention of residential streets. Cops yelled at my kids and my neighbor's kids for playing in our cul-de-sac. Kids were back in the street after he left.
 

SFCRetired

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Joined
Oct 29, 2008
Messages
1,754
Location
Montgomery, Alabama, USA
Not only should the cop unions be abolished, but the legislators of this great state (Yes, I am a native Alabamian) need to review the history of the present law which requires a permit. The original law was, as I understand it, repealed. But, in 1956, at the heart of the Montgomery Bus Boycott, the law was reinstituted. Why? Because the black community had started carpooling to keep from taking the buses.

Cue those three cousins, Ku, Klux, and Klan, starting to threaten and attempt to intimidate these folks. The black folks rightfully proceeded to arm themselves for protection. Hence the law. Guess who the sheriffs at that time would not issue a pistol permit to. I have heard a sheriff in one county tell a very well-respected black man that it would be a cold day in Hell before he would give a (racial epithet deleted) a permit.

In the present day, the ASA, Alabama Sheriffs' Association, is driven more by the sheriffs' fear that they will lose the permit money than any other concern.
 

SFCRetired

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Joined
Oct 29, 2008
Messages
1,754
Location
Montgomery, Alabama, USA
They, ASA members, are high ranking minions of the CC Industrial Complex.
More that they are struggling desperately to gain and retain as much control over the citizenry they are supposed to serve as they possibly can. Keep in mind that these sheriffs are, first and foremost, politicians rather than law enforcement professionals.

There are many stories I could tell that would demonstrate that fact; to include stories that show both the past and present bigotry of some, thankfully not all, of those same politicians. I will, however, spare the delicate sensibilities of the OCDO membership.
 

Kirbinator

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2010
Messages
902
Location
Urban Skeet City, Alabama
Follow the money. Cop unions do not want people that can defend themselves, never mind that police cannot, their is an illusion of safety. Responsible people who find they can take care of themselves may demand that we need less police, which means less dues.
Simply put, it's good for business.

The ASA is an entity that should not exist in the capacity that it does. Through some hook, crook, and legislative act, the dues of the members of ASA may be paid using public monies from the sheriff's office funds the local county commission, or another source spelled out in the Title 45: Local Laws. However, ASA acts as a lobbyist or retains a lobbyist, and frequently opposes anything to do with changes to pistol licenses or permits (an all important source of revenue for sheriffs) as well as other measures in a decidedly anti-gun, anti-citizen manner. Properly applied, since the permits are effectively issued by the state, the state should be printing them, managing the information database associated with them, and the funds for said permits should flow into the General Fund of the state treasury. If the sheriffs require more money than they are apportioned from the various funds and sources of the state, they should talk to the legislators to see about getting apportioned more money or apply for and receive grants or donations.

The essential bias of the ASA and FOP are that there are three classes of people: The people who hire LEOs or have money, power, or influence that can get things for LEOs, the LEOs, and people who aren't LEOs. Never forget that the people in the first set are in the third set. For further reference, look at the recent Bentley scandal, how Spencer Collier fit into the debacle, and how he -- a manager who was once an APOST-certified front-line officer -- effectively has done no "police work" since he was promoted to management. Yet, he carries a badge and a gun, and will likely keep them in retirement.

This follows remarkably closely to the feudal era, where "The Knights Of The Roundtable" enjoyed a right to bail and to be released into the comfort of six of their peers following an arrest. They didn't have means, but they had physical strength, armor, and arms.
 
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