Important new open carry info!

[HearseGuy]

So sunday i was at my LGS and a local LEO stopped to browse and make small talk. A friendly debate ensued, as I like to think I'm pretty d@*n sharp when it comes to firearms laws in VA, but here are a few things this LEO told me.

No open carry in a vehicle. If you have your sidearm holstered on your hip,in your vehicle, and he can not clearly see it, you will be cited for CCing without a permit. (When he walked in I was strong side to the wall, he couldn't have seen it...was I carrying concealed?)

No firearms in console or glove box. Must be out in the open or the ammunition must be seperate and firearm must be locked. (He later shifted to glove box was OK but it must be locked.)

No open carry in VA Beach. Due to having more than 100,000 people. (When I said I open carry in VB weekly, I was told I am breaking the law. As is anyone else. He was a bit befuddled why a business would offer a discount for open carry in VB...since its illegal...)

Then the whole why I'm going to have my sidearm stripped from me and be killed with it for OCing...not getting into that one.

Just thought you guys should know these important changes in OC :banghead:

I will be emailing him a copy of the letter from the AG concerning glove box carry, and the VA state police website where it clearly states its legal in glove box and it does not have to be locked, as well as the case law. This cat is a lawsuit waiting to happen.

 

[Esanders2008]

Oh for a second there I thought you thought that a LEO was actually a good source for the law.

 

[TFred]

Wow, that is one extremely ignorant law enforcement officer.



TFred

 

[paramedic70002]

Let me guess. He is an LEO in VB or Chesapeake, and hasn't attended an inservice or roll call in 20 years, or is long retired.

 

[wrearick]

That is just plain scary!

 

[skidmark]

Let me guess. He is an LEO in VB or Chesapeake, and hasn't attended an inservice or roll call in 20 years, or is long retired.

IIRC HearseGuy is on the Eastern Shore. I was pretty sure they did not marry their cousins out that way, but one might have snuck past.

A letter to this LEO's chief/sherrif should produce all sorts of giggles. Too bad you will not be able to be there when the LEO steps on the asbestos carpet.

If you do write that letter, please share any response you receive.

stay safe.

 

[wrearick]

I like to always look ahead and be prepared. If my path and this officer's should cross, what is the best thing I can/should do (outside having my recorder running)? Ask for a supervisor to be summoned?

 

[SouthernBoy]

I like to always look ahead and be prepared. If my path and this officer's should cross, what is the best thing I can/should do (outside having my recorder running)? Ask for a supervisor to be summoned?

If he hassles you, yes that would be a good idea. This guy is clueless and unfortunately, he could make someone's life a little miserable. Best to make it his if he breaks the law and tries to make an illegal arrest.

 

[lil_shawn1990]

I wish that i had the finances and time to not cooperate with law enforcement officers like this, so that i could take them to court. However i do not have neither, so i would have to simply cooperate, record, and write a letter to the chief.

 

[sidestreet]

His name didn't happen to be...,

Officer Rumplestiltskin did it? That guy needs to seriously wake up and get informed.

sidestreet

Jeremiah 29 vs. 11-13

we are not equal, we will never be equal, but we must be relentless.

 

[skidmark]

Officer Rumplestiltskin did it? That guy needs to seriously wake up and get informed.

sidestreet

Jeremiah 29 vs. 11-13

we are not equal, we will never be equal, but we must be relentless.

Umm. Rip Van Winkle maybe?

This LEO's fairy tale involves straw that has been pre-used by the horses.

stay safe.

 

[Esanders2008]

Also I just thought of something:

You OC in car and he gives you citation for CC w/o permit.

Fast forward to court date.
Defense attorney: officer smith, how did you discover that my client was carrying a handgun?
Officer: I saw it.
Defense attorney: well it must not have been concealed...

 

[sidestreet]

Dang, you're right again, Skid...,

Umm. Rip Van Winkle maybe?

This LEO's fairy tale involves straw that has been pre-used by the horses.

stay safe.

thinking one, said the other, knew it started with "R", had a lot of syllables, oh well. I gotta get some rest, maybe 20 years worth, just call me..., uh, what's that name again?

sidestreet (yawn)

Jeremiah 29 vs. 11-13

we are not equal, we will never be equal, but we must be relentless. (just as soon as I've had a nap.)

 

[user]

A girl I knew in high school used a phrase that I have adopted - she didn't like the fact that I made fun of people - she said, "It's not funny, it's sad."

I don't know, the cop may be dumb, or he may be from New Jersey. Or he may be trying out his technique for what I call, "dust in the eyes". That's my technical term for telling people legal-sounding cow excrement with the purpose of getting them to believe it's really true.

But like my cousin, Vinny, said, "Everyt'ing dat guy said is bulls*. Thank you."

However, there is this: " § 18.2-287.4. Carrying loaded firearms in public areas prohibited; penalty."

It shall be unlawful for any person to carry a loaded (a) semi-automatic center-fire rifle or pistol that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material and is equipped at the time of the offense with a magazine that will hold more than 20 rounds of ammunition or designed by the manufacturer to accommodate a silencer or equipped with a folding stock or (b) shotgun with a magazine that will hold more than seven rounds of the longest ammunition for which it is chambered on or about his person on any public street, road, alley, sidewalk, public right-of-way, or in any public park or any other place of whatever nature that is open to the public in the Cities of Alexandria, Chesapeake, Fairfax, Falls Church, Newport News, Norfolk, Richmond, or Virginia Beach or in the Counties of Arlington, Fairfax, Henrico, Loudoun, or Prince William.
...

 

[HearseGuy]

However, there is this: " § 18.2-287.4. Carrying loaded firearms in public areas prohibited; penalty."

That's exactly what I said. The wording on that confused me when I first read it. Perhaps he skimmed it and is confused. I told him that almost word for word (he was a bit surprised).

Needless to say Dan, with this cat on the loose, your number is on my ICE contact list in my phone.

 

[kord]

how does this guy keep his job

I speak with several LEO's from the Tidewater area every week and have never been told OC was illegal, was even introduced to a to a Captain a couple of months ago while OC'ing. I'm not saying I never hear bad advise or the "I support your right to OC but I wouldn't if I were you". Years ago it was a Norfolk cop saying "you should carry a gun because we can't be everywhere" that made a huge impact on my decision to carry. Now they all agree in being responsible and taking as much training as you can, but never has any LEO I met ever told me I couldn't carry in VA Beach, etc.

 

[skidmark]

....
However, there is this: " § 18.2-287.4. Carrying loaded firearms in public areas prohibited; penalty."

So you are saying that the 33-round Glock magazine may not be the best loadout? I can live with that.

stay safe.

 

[SouthernBoy]

English is a beautiful language but can be confusing at times. However one thing remains a constant. It is hierarchical in that what precedes something takes precedence unless otherwise corrected. For example, this is one sentence;

"It shall be unlawful for any person to carry a loaded (a) semi-automatic center-fire rifle or pistol that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material and is equipped at the time of the offense with a magazine that will hold more than 20 rounds of ammunition or designed by the manufacturer to accommodate a silencer or equipped with a folding stock or (b) shotgun with a magazine that will hold more than seven rounds of the longest ammunition for which it is chambered on or about his person on any public street, road, alley, sidewalk, public right-of-way, or in any public park or any other place of whatever nature that is open to the public in the Cities of Alexandria, Chesapeake, Fairfax, Falls Church, Newport News, Norfolk, Richmond, or Virginia Beach or in the Counties of Arlington, Fairfax, Henrico, Loudoun, or Prince William."

Note the first part which I have bolded. These are the conditions for which the rest follows and to which the rest must adhere. And the conjunction "or" is used which means any one of them applies. Had the word "and" been used, all must apply for any to be true (effective). So if your firearm does not fit any of the "or" conditions, you are perfectly safe. Me thinks the LEO in question cannot read English. Words do have meaning.

 

[Grapeshot]

So you are saying that the 33-round Glock magazine may not be the best loadout? I can live with that.
stay safe.

§ 18.2-287.4. Carrying loaded firearms in public areas prohibited; penalty.
It shall be unlawful for any person to carry a loaded (a) semi-automatic center-fire rifle or pistol that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material and is equipped at the time of the offense with a magazine that will hold more than 20 rounds of ammunition or designed by the manufacturer to accommodate a silencer or equipped with a folding stock or (b) shotgun with a magazine that will hold more than seven rounds of the longest ammunition for which it is chambered on or about his person on any public street, road, alley, sidewalk, public right-of-way, or in any public park or any other place of whatever nature that is open to the public in the Cities of Alexandria, Chesapeake, Fairfax, Falls Church, Newport News, Norfolk, Richmond, or Virginia Beach or in the Counties of Arlington, Fairfax, Henrico, Loudoun, or Prince William.


The provisions of this section shall not apply to law-enforcement officers, licensed security guards, military personnel in the performance of their lawful duties, or any person having a valid concealed handgun permit or to any person actually engaged in lawful hunting or lawful recreational shooting activities at an established shooting range or shooting contest. Any person violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.

The exemptions set forth in § 18.2-308 shall apply, mutatis mutandis, to the provisions of this section.

 

[skidmark]

Boy, are you ever poking the edge of the envelope. I can almost hear peter nap starting up his perks for permits rant.

stay safe.