No open carry or concealed carry while exercizing free speech in Whitefish

[onus]

http://www.kpax.com/story/34280911/...be-carried-in-any-march-by-white-supremacists

•No "concealed" or "open carry" weapons will be allowed during the march.

 

[solus]

interestingly, since the news didn't provide a cite on state statute referenced...

45-8-351. Restriction on local government regulation of firearms. (1) Except as provided in subsection (2), a county, city, town, consolidated local government, or other local government unit may not prohibit, register, tax, license, or regulate the purchase, sale or other transfer (including delay in purchase, sale, or other transfer), ownership, possession, transportation, use, or unconcealed carrying of any weapon, including a rifle, shotgun, handgun, or concealed handgun.

(2) (a) For public safety purposes, a city or town may regulate the discharge of rifles, shotguns, and handguns. A county, city, town, consolidated local government, or other local government unit has power to prevent and suppress the carrying of concealed or unconcealed weapons to a public assembly, publicly owned building, park under its jurisdiction, or school, and the possession of firearms by convicted felons, adjudicated mental incompetents, illegal aliens, and minors.

(b) Nothing contained in this section allows any government to prohibit the legitimate display of firearms at shows or other public occasions by collectors and others or to prohibit the legitimate transportation of firearms through any jurisdiction, whether in airports or otherwise.

(c) A local ordinance enacted pursuant to this section may not prohibit a legislative security officer who has been issued a concealed weapon permit from carrying a concealed weapon in the state capitol as provided in 45-8-317.

http://leg.mt.gov/bills/mca/45/8/45-8-351.htm


1) the question to ask is does a permit for a specifically organized 'march' meet criteria for public assembly etc., outlined in the statute's 2(a) provision.

2) could an injunction be granted to prevent the city manager's firearm carry prohibition mandate?

since i am not attorney, nor care to be...

ipse

 

[Fallschirjmäger]

Makes me glad we Finally got rid of that "public gathering" clause in our code. It was nothing except a racist catch-all meant to only affect one segment (nudge, nudge, wink) of the population,

 

[color of law]

Article II
Section 12. RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS.
The right of any person to keep or bear arms in defense of his own home, person, and property, or in aid of the civil power when thereto legally summoned, shall not be called in question, but nothing herein contained shall be held to permit the carrying of concealed weapons.

45-8-351(2) (a) For public safety purposes, a city or town may regulate the discharge of rifles, shotguns, and handguns. A county, city, town, consolidated local government, or other local government unit has power to prevent and suppress the carrying of concealed or unconcealed weapons to a public assembly, publicly owned building, park under its jurisdiction, or school, and the possession of firearms by convicted felons, adjudicated mental incompetents, illegal aliens, and minors.

The Montana constitution doesn't authorize the government authority to regulate the open carry of firearms.

 

[onus]

So would this apply to only the people participating in the march ? What about all residents and pedestrians in the city during the march ? Are they required to disarm even if they are walking nearby ?
What about a reporter who is simply in the area to cover the event ?

 

[solus]

So would this apply to only the people participating in the march ? What about all residents and pedestrians in the city during the march ? Are they required to disarm even if they are walking nearby ?
What about a reporter who is simply in the area to cover the event ?

again, if the city manager believes they can, they will and only the courts can keep everyone on the straight and narrow...but unless they intervene...seems everyone is bound by the city manager's invocation of the statute prohibiting firearms.

ipse

 

[color of law]

Let me add, "public assembly" is synonymous with "public meeting." A public assembly is not a parade.

 

[color of law]

But, is a parade a "public assembly"?

No...

In legal parlance a "public assembly" is a meeting of officials. In old English law, a public assembly is at which the king presided, and which comprised men of all degrees met for consultation about the great affairs of the kingdom. Also, a Disturbance of Public Meetings was/is considered or classified as a misdemeanor at common law of being guilty of conduct which tended to disturb a public assembly.

 

[Fallschirjmäger]

D'ya get the idea that just maybe.... politicians are occasionally using the undefined vagueness of certain words or phrases in their favor?

 

[countryclubjoe]

No...

In legal parlance a "public assembly" is a meeting of officials. In old English law, a public assembly is at which the king presided, and which comprised men of all degrees met for consultation about the great affairs of the kingdom. Also, a Disturbance of Public Meetings was/is considered or classified as a misdemeanor at common law of being guilty of conduct which tended to disturb a public assembly.

No mention of " public assembly" in black's law ninth edition and a quick search of " public meeting" sends one to " sunshine law"..

Bureaucrats like to feed the naive with the notion that " public safety" trumps the "Federal Constitution".. And in my opinion that is exactly what is happening in this case.. Governments rely on naive sheeple to achieve their goals.

So we need to ask ourselves, do we support public safety or the United States Constitution or more importantly " Natural Law""..

Regards
CCJ

 

[color of law]

No mention of " public assembly" in black's law ninth edition and a quick search of " public meeting" sends one to " sunshine law"..
.....
Regards
CCJ

You need to get a BLACK'S LAW DICTIONARY sixth edition or earlier. After the sixth they removed the case law. I have the 4th. - 5th. and 6th. And you are correct that "public assembly" is not defined, but it is used to define other legal terms. Example: RESOLUTION. A formal expression of the opinion or will of an official body or a public assembly, adopted by vote; as a legislative resolution. "Public assembly" is used to describe legislative and judicial proceedings in Blacks Law Dictionary.

 

[countryclubjoe]

You need to get a BLACK'S LAW DICTIONARY sixth edition or earlier. After the sixth they removed the case law. I have the 4th. - 5th. and 6th. And you are correct that "public assembly" is not defined, but it is used to define other legal terms. Example: RESOLUTION. A formal expression of the opinion or will of an official body or a public assembly, adopted by vote; as a legislative resolution. "Public assembly" is used to describe legislative and judicial proceedings in Blacks Law Dictionary.

Great info Sir, however' Resolution" occurs more in 17th century Parliamentary Law.. Not much precedence in 21st century jurisprudence regarding " resolution"..

The government can and will throw many ambiguous terms or quasi " resolutions" at the people.. What we need for defense thereof is simply.

FEDERALIST NO # 49--- TO WIT

' The people are the only legitimate foundation of power, and it is from them that the constitutional charter " is derived"..
" Government is and should be the servant of the people, and it should be fully accountable to them for the actions which it supposedly takes on their behalf"...

Viewing federalist number 49, in light most favorable to " the people' , would imply that the local Government must advise the citizens/people of why the government feels the need to violate the Constitution and Natural law... Until " we the people" challenge the governments quasi ordinance/resolutions etc, they shall escape and continue with their agenda.. Government espouses " public safety" to the masses and or safety for the protection of its citizens.. Most citizens feel they need the protection of their Government.. Public safety and individual liberty will always be at odds..
tyrants use different terms, modern tyrants use " public safety" antiquated tyrants use " the children or the child" to wit..

" The state must declare the CHILD to be the most precious treasure(s) of the people.. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the CHILDREN, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of " liberty" and almost any deprivation." Adolph Hitler..

Now we in 21st century, could substitute Child/Children for ' PUBLIC SAFETY, and reach the same conclusions..

Public safety is a government term used so as to deprive people of their natural rights.. The terms may change and the tyrants names may also change however their meaning remains the same... Don't let the terms or the tyrants fool you, their goal is to enslave the people.

My .02

CCJ

 

[countryclubjoe]

http://www.kpax.com/story/34280911/...be-carried-in-any-march-by-white-supremacists

•No "concealed" or "open carry" weapons will be allowed during the march.

Onus

I am familiar with all of your work in holding LEOS and Government actors accountable, keep up the great videos and keep us posted both here and on youtube.. Your work is essential and educational to all liberty minded folks..

Post more here on leo accountable and hopefully you shall not be sanctioned for leo BASHING,, the Truth is not Bashing... MY .02

Regards Sir!

CCJ

 

[countryclubjoe]

You need to get a BLACK'S LAW DICTIONARY sixth edition or earlier. After the sixth they removed the case law. I have the 4th. - 5th. and 6th. And you are correct that "public assembly" is not defined, but it is used to define other legal terms. Example: RESOLUTION. A formal expression of the opinion or will of an official body or a public assembly, adopted by vote; as a legislative resolution. "Public assembly" is used to describe legislative and judicial proceedings in Blacks Law Dictionary.

I actually donated all my early editions of Blacks to the local universities and libraries.. LOL I always assumed newer was better, MY BAD!

Keep up the good work Sir!

Regards
CCJ

 

[countryclubjoe]

It doesn't matter what any book says about anything. Until there appears to be someone that will confront the City, either on the street, at a city government meeting or in the courtroom, this is just a lot of rhetoric. So far, no one seems to be stepping forward to do this. So, the meaning of a "public assembly" is not important. The City can make it mean anything they want, until someone challenges them.

INDEED, the more the merrier..

Regards

CCJ

 

[color of law]

It doesn't matter what any book says about anything. Until there appears to be someone that will confront the City, either on the street, at a city government meeting or in the courtroom, this is just a lot of rhetoric. So far, no one seems to be stepping forward to do this. So, the meaning of a "public assembly" is not important. The City can make it mean anything they want, until someone challenges them.

Your correct in that no one from Montana has even joined in this discussion.

 

[Ezek]

No mention of " public assembly" in black's law ninth edition and a quick search of " public meeting" sends one to " sunshine law"..

Bureaucrats like to feed the naive with the notion that " public safety" trumps the "Federal Constitution".. And in my opinion that is exactly what is happening in this case.. Governments rely on naive sheeple to achieve their goals.

So we need to ask ourselves, do we support public safety or the United States Constitution or more importantly " Natural Law""..

Regards
CCJ

if we really supported public safety, wouldn't we also support the exercise of the 2nd amendment?

 

[countryclubjoe]

if we really supported public safety, wouldn't we also support the exercise of the 2nd amendment?

Exercising your 2A does not necessarily support public safety it does however support your own individual safety. The antis want the government to support your individual safety...

We could actually start another thread topic on your query.

My .02

Regards