Anti - Gun . . . ' Aims at Health Care Plan '

[thx997303]

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Negative Styles, I would prefer not to get any farther in to this.

 

[marshaul]

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WheelGun wrote:

The only kids (especially boys) that I have known, that did not rough around on bicycles, with BB guns, wrestle in the mud, go exploring in the woods, grow up to be frustrated, awkward young adults.

Whether a kid does this is completely irrelevant to the use of corporal punishment. It's good for kids to be kids, and not be overprotected, but physical punishment is not related to "kids being kids".

AWDstylez wrote:

SFCRetired wrote:

Let's start with the fact that parents are not allowed to apply corporal punishment.  If they do punish the child by spanking, it is a very good bet that the child will, as it has repeatedly been encouraged to, report it to a teacher as "abuse".  Add to that the lamebrains who say that spanking a child will make it violent. 

It's pretty common sense, in addition to proven fact, that violence breeds violence.  Positive reinforcement when a child does good is what's needed to promote good behavior.  Punishment is highly ineffective.  The idea is to focus on and increase good behavior, which, in itself, will stiffle out the bad.  When and if the bad behavior needs to be addressed, eliminating something the child likes is sufficient (no tv, no outside, no friends, no desert, etc) and carries none of the side effects of punishment.  Violence is never the answer with children.

Spanking a child is like kicking your dog because he doesn't roll over when you say, "roll over."  It's a hell of a lot more effective to reward the dog when he DOES roll over, instead of beating the @#$% out of him when he DOESN'T roll over.

http://allpsych.com/psychology101/reinforcement.html

 

Oh and I can't wait to hear you say, "spanking isn't violence."  It's not?  Do you hit your wife when she does something wrong?  It's not violence.  Go ahead and do it.  Call her a "lamebrain" if she reports you to the police.

I'm going to have to agree with this. Physical punishment doesn't work with adults, and it isn't likely to work with kids either.

My parents were kind of on the cusp: I was spanked occasionally, but before I was done growing up my parents had decided to abandon corporal punishment.

As a person who experienced both, I can affirm that I never learned a valuable lesson through corporal punishment. I may have learned as a practical matter not to repeat certain behaviors in such a way so as to get caught, but any truly formative lessons were all learned the hard way, through experience. That's how life is.

Overprotecting your children will definitely hinder that learning process, but corporal punishment will not further it.

 

[compmanio365]

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WTF does spanking your kids have to do with OC....at ALL?

 

[marshaul]

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smoking357 wrote:

Deanimator wrote:

I know a guy who is unable to understand cause and effect relationships.

He posts on the internet with an H&K logo as his avatar.

Remember, violence never solves anything... except

[font="verdana,arial,helvetica"][font="verdana,arial,helvetica"]Those who cling to the untrue doctrine that violence never settles anything would be advised to conjure up the ghosts of Napoleon Bonaparte and of the Duke of Wellington and let them debate it. The ghost of Hitler could referee, and the jury might well be the Dodo, the Great Auk, and the Passenger Pigeon. Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor, and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst. Nations and peoples who forget this basic truth have always paid for it with their lives and freedoms.[/font][/font]

[font="verdana,arial,helvetica"][font="verdana,arial,helvetica"]-Robert A. Heinlein[/font][/font]

OK, if your child is Hitler, you'd best start with the corporal punishment early.

None of this will ever change my own experience: that being, a feeling that I learned common sense and responsibility through experience, with no need of corporal punishment.

Honestly, I was a kid, not Hitler. Most of the "bad" things I did were more annoying, I was rarely (if ever) inclined to commit acts of aggression as a child, or an adult.

 

[Batousaii]

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AWD, why do you throw insults all the time ?

- just curious...

 

[Brass Magnet]

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compmanio365 wrote:

WTF does spanking your kids have to do with OC....at ALL?

Nothing; nothing at all.

The only reason I even got involved in this thread is because I'm sick and tired of the King of strawmen calling everyone else one.It's one ofthe best examples of the pot calling the kettle black that I've ever seen He had manyholes punched into his stated "facts" (and Iuse that term loosely)and neverrebutted a single one of them.



AWDstylez wrote:

thx997303 wrote:

Hah, this thread is funny.

Styles, you are acting like a child.

Strawman
Strawman
Strawman

I guess everything contrary to your position is a strawman.

I believe that you styles are a strawman.

No, I'm just calling it how it is. It isn't my problem that these people have the reading comprehension skills of a kindergartener and the debate skills of a rock.

You think I'm the one that's wrong? Do me the favor I asked I ask awhile ago and show me here I said that violence is NEVER the answer.

No your highness;King Strawman, you are calling it like you THINK it is. It's all about you. You don't give a hoot what someone elses ideas are and you areamong those that have thedebate skills of a rock. Once again, you call on someone to rebut your "fact" (used loosely again) when you haven't rebutted others.

Batousaii wrote:

AWD, why do you throw insults all the time ?

- just curious...

To use his own words: because he has the debate skills of a rock.

Debating is arguing pleasantly and with rules, AWD is just arguing.

 

[Batousaii]

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compmanio365 wrote:

WTF does spanking your kids have to do with OC....at ALL?

heya Camp,

- it doesnt have anything to do with OC or firearms now ... AWD has fully derailed the thread. <i am just entertaining myself here is all [bad bat has found a new chew toy...]-lol->.

Bat

 

[marshaul]

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You guys are as bad as AWDstylez (no offense stylez).

The thread was derailed by everybody slinging @#$% as they always do when it's "argue with AWDstylez time".

No reason the issue can't be discussed in a reasonable fashion. I attempted to do so. Address my points instead of the bickering.

Or, we could accept that it is off topic and just all STFU entirely.

 

[Deanimator]

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marshaul wrote:

You guys are as bad as AWDstylez (no offense stylez).

The thread was derailed by everybody slinging @#$% as they always do when it's "argue with AWDstylez time".

No reason the issue can't be discussed in a reasonable fashion. I attempted to do so. Address my points instead of the bickering.

Or, we could accept that it is off topic and just all STFU entirely.

Do you agree with his attempts to equate ADULT women with children?

If you can't can't spank your child because you can't hit your wife, does that mean that you can't make your child stand in the corner because you can't make your wife stand in the corner?

Styleless is a perfect example why the rest of AHSA is so pathetically ineffective.

 

[AWDstylez]

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Deanimator wrote:

marshaul wrote:

You guys are as bad as AWDstylez (no offense stylez).

The thread was derailed by everybody slinging @#$% as they always do when it's "argue with AWDstylez time".

No reason the issue can't be discussed in a reasonable fashion. I attempted to do so. Address my points instead of the bickering.

Or, we could accept that it is off topic and just all STFU entirely.

Do you agree with his attempts to equate ADULT women with children?

If you can't can't spank your child because you can't hit your wife, does that mean that you can't make your child stand in the corner because you can't make your wife stand in the corner?

Styleless is a perfect example why the rest of AHSA is so pathetically ineffective.

And you're a perfect example of the state of the American public school system. NO WHERE did I make the argument that you cannot spank a child because you cannot hit your wife. NO WHERE did I equate a child to an adult. NO WHERE did I say that violence is never the answer to anything. Those points are a result of your complete lack of reading comprehension.

What I actually said is that VIOLENCE is not an effective corrective measure and learning tool.

I said that VIOLENCE against your wife (or anyone else) IS AS WRONG AS violence against your child, -nothing more, nothing less.



The thread went to @#$% because you refused to address my ACTUAL point, and instead tried to replace it with your easily defeated strawman.

 

[AWDstylez]

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marshaul wrote:

I'm going to have to agree with this. Physical punishment doesn't work with adults, and it isn't likely to work with kids either.

My parents were kind of on the cusp: I was spanked occasionally, but before I was done growing up my parents had decided to abandon corporal punishment.

As a person who experienced both, I can affirm that I never learned a valuable lesson through corporal punishment. I may have learned as a practical matter not to repeat certain behaviors in such a way so as to get caught, but any truly formative lessons were all learned the hard way, through experience. That's how life is.

Overprotecting your children will definitely hinder that learning process, but corporal punishment will not further it.

This is spot on, and I can agree with it from a personal standpoint in addition to the fact that it's backed by research. Corporal punishment results in anger, not learning. It teaches the child little-to-nothing, other than to avoid the behavior (or, as pointed out,to avoidgetting caught)simply to avoid the pain. That result is worlds away from construtive parenting that results in the child having an understanding of why something is wrong, and not doing it because it's the wrong thing to do.

Remember, when punishmentis removed (child is away from the parents) the behavior that was supposedly extingushed by the punishment quickly returns because there is no threat of pain. This is when it becomes important to have a child that is taught to do the right thing for the right thing's sake, not to simply avoid doing bad things in order to avoid punishment.

 

[Deanimator]

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AWDstylez wrote:

Deanimator wrote:

marshaul wrote:

You guys are as bad as AWDstylez (no offense stylez).

The thread was derailed by everybody slinging @#$% as they always do when it's "argue with AWDstylez time".

No reason the issue can't be discussed in a reasonable fashion. I attempted to do so. Address my points instead of the bickering.

Or, we could accept that it is off topic and just all STFU entirely.

Do you agree with his attempts to equate ADULT women with children?

If you can't can't spank your child because you can't hit your wife, does that mean that you can't make your child stand in the corner because you can't make your wife stand in the corner?

Styleless is a perfect example why the rest of AHSA is so pathetically ineffective.

And you're a perfect example of the state of the American public school system. NO WHERE did I make the argument that you cannot spank a child because you cannot hit your wife. NO WHERE did I equate a child to an adult. NO WHERE did I say that violence is never the answer to anything. Those points are a result of your complete lack of reading comprehension.

Funny, I went to Catholic school. As a victim of the public schools, you're unqualified to speak about anyone else's education.

You neither know nor CARE what you're talking about. As an AHSA troll, your only goal is to disrupt pro-gun discussion.

 

[Batousaii]

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AWDstylez wrote:

The thread went to @#$% because you refused to address my ACTUAL point, and instead tried to replace it with your easily defeated strawman.

YOUR point was Off Topic and that threw the thread into the tangent that you created..... i have noticed your M.O. is to simply derail threads and create strife.

--- This is A-Typical of a closed minded approach, you do not have the ability toconsider or comprehendsome oneelse's others viewpoint so you derail others and create hysteria.


P.S. RE: Spanking; "It teaches the child little-to-nothing, other than to avoid the behavior " .... isnt that the desired result ?: to have the child not repeat the behaviour, i.e. learning "I better not do that again". (not that i am going to agree or disagree with spanking, just pointing out your concept is flawed, probably due to hysterics).

 

[R a Z o R]

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AWDstylez wrote:

marshaul wrote:

I'm going to have to agree with this. Physical punishment doesn't work with adults .

My parents were kind of on the cusp: I was spanked occasionally, but before I was done . . .

As a person who experienced both, I can affirm that I never learned a valuable lesson through corporal punishment.

This is spot on, and I can agree with it from a personal standpoint in addition to the fact that it's backed by . . .

AWDstylez * * * marshaul ......... TAG TEAM

 

[AWDstylez]

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Batousaii wrote:

--- This is A-Typical of a closed minded approach, you do not have the ability toconsider or comprehendsome oneelse's others viewpoint so you derail others and create hysteria.

You must have gone to catholic school too. Atypical is one word and means the exact opposite of how you're using it.

a·typ·i·cal
play_w2("A0513600")


(

-t

p

-k

l) also a·typ·ic (-

k)

adj.
Not conforming to type; unusual or irregular.

 

[Batousaii]

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Again, you use avoidance in an attempt to not face the actual charge or question.

- You never answered my first question either... Why do you come here and insult people ?

 

[Deanimator]

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Batousaii wrote:

Again, you use avoidance in an attempt to not face the actual charge or question.

- You never answered my first question either... Why do you come here and insult people ?

You didn't actually expect him to contribute anything requiring intellect, DID you?

Intelligence, lucidity and honesty are NOT qualities found in AHSA trolls.

 

[Batousaii]

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Deanimator wrote:

Batousaii wrote:

Again, you use avoidance in an attempt to not face the actual charge or question.

- You never answered my first question either... Why do you come here and insult people ?

You didn't actually expect him to contribute anything requiring intellect, DID you?

Intelligence, lucidity and honesty are NOT qualities found in AHSA trolls.

I figured his silence would exactly prove my point

-- Sorry, troll hunting is a hobby.... i thrive on the thrill of the hunt <shhhh.. wabbits>

:lol:Bat.

:uhoh.s. My State mates will find me here at some point and make me drop my chew toy, at that time i will crawl back to my rug by the fire and go to sleep.

 

[AWDstylez]

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You are teh lulz.

 

[Batousaii]

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AWDstylez wrote:

You are teh lulz.

Delicious, the troll lives....

- the troll still has not stood withstood the integrity test to answer a direct question.

- Why do you come here and simply sling insults and derail threads ?