I emailed Mike Davis this morning, informing him I was a previous staffer of FoNRA, as well as a top donor in the past. I respectfully but specifically told him I was not sorry that I could not attend at this venue. This is a shame, as it's a great event for donating firearms classes, which are more donated time than anything else. I still WANT to donate (it's actually very good advertising,) but I'm having a serious problem with the gross negligence (IMO) that caused this venue to be chosen.
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Friends of NRA dinner and OC and NVFAC
- Thread starter Vegassteve
- Start date
Vegassteve
Regular Member
Just got this email from him.
Steve,
I am the right person to contact and I appreciate you doing so. Actually the venue was chosen by the local Nevada chairperson and she was told by them that they were carry friendly - perhaps she was misled. You may wish to contact Sandra Eifealdt at CCS Guns for more information on this.
I hope that you will join us for the event as the cause is bigger than the local hotel - raising as much money as possible to support the shooting sports in Nevada. Further, I would welcome you to personally join me in choosing and qualifying a more appropriate venue for the Las Vegas area next year, ensuring that this error is not repeated and participation is maximized.
Thanks again for your concern,
My response that I sent.
Sorry we will not be attending. As a NRA member and NVFAC member this is not acceptable. And I am going to make sure I do all I can and let my fellow members know that it is not acceptable. Due diligence was not done here. As one of a growing community in Nevada of the open carry movement, we have worked hard to find meeting places and dining halls that welcome us. I would have hoped the NRA did the same. Just as the NRA picks anti gun establishments to hold its conventions this is par for the course as far as I can see. And I am in no way surprised.
If the cause is truly bigger than the hotel then you would change it. It seems the cause is more about money and less about what is right or our rights. There will be no shooting sports, without those of us who actually stand up for our rights.
Steve,
I am the right person to contact and I appreciate you doing so. Actually the venue was chosen by the local Nevada chairperson and she was told by them that they were carry friendly - perhaps she was misled. You may wish to contact Sandra Eifealdt at CCS Guns for more information on this.
I hope that you will join us for the event as the cause is bigger than the local hotel - raising as much money as possible to support the shooting sports in Nevada. Further, I would welcome you to personally join me in choosing and qualifying a more appropriate venue for the Las Vegas area next year, ensuring that this error is not repeated and participation is maximized.
Thanks again for your concern,
My response that I sent.
Sorry we will not be attending. As a NRA member and NVFAC member this is not acceptable. And I am going to make sure I do all I can and let my fellow members know that it is not acceptable. Due diligence was not done here. As one of a growing community in Nevada of the open carry movement, we have worked hard to find meeting places and dining halls that welcome us. I would have hoped the NRA did the same. Just as the NRA picks anti gun establishments to hold its conventions this is par for the course as far as I can see. And I am in no way surprised.
If the cause is truly bigger than the hotel then you would change it. It seems the cause is more about money and less about what is right or our rights. There will be no shooting sports, without those of us who actually stand up for our rights.
After mispelling my name, he wrote me a nearly identical reply. I replied:
I have given it more thought, especially as I wanted the advertising that comes with donations. I must decline.
I completely disagree that the 'cause is greater than' the venue. Using an anti-gun venue is a betrayal to the cause, though I admit not a malicious one in this case.
If our organization was misled, we have five weeks remaining to find an appropriate venue. It just won't have as nice of a wallpaper job on the walls. Believe me, I know exactly how much hard work it would be to move the venue. I can only wish enough of us had caught the mistake in time to make it easier.
I have given it more thought, especially as I wanted the advertising that comes with donations. I must decline.
I completely disagree that the 'cause is greater than' the venue. Using an anti-gun venue is a betrayal to the cause, though I admit not a malicious one in this case.
If our organization was misled, we have five weeks remaining to find an appropriate venue. It just won't have as nice of a wallpaper job on the walls. Believe me, I know exactly how much hard work it would be to move the venue. I can only wish enough of us had caught the mistake in time to make it easier.
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The Big Guy
Regular Member
My note to Mike.
Mike
As it does not appear that the venue will be changing for the upcoming dinner, my wife and I will not be attending. Instead I will be sending a check to GOA in that amount.
As a life Member and member for 35 years I feel that the NRA does not represent my views. It has become abundantly clear over the years that the NRA is more concerned about its image as the 300 pound gorilla of the firearms movement than actually doing something of significance for gun owners. I thought seriously about resigning my membership when the organization began its campaign for the establishment of the conceal carry system rather than sticking up for our rights without government approval and interference. It was at this time that I quit donating funds to the ILA. It is obvious to many of us that the NRA is absolutely anti open carry and believes in “reasonable restrictions” rather than sticking up for the US Constitution and that of the state of NV.
Further, it is my experience, and that of many I have been in contact with, that the NRA is almost totally unresponsive to the membership.
I will be asking others not to support this event or any in the future where our funds are spent with anti firearms venues.
Regards
Mike
As it does not appear that the venue will be changing for the upcoming dinner, my wife and I will not be attending. Instead I will be sending a check to GOA in that amount.
As a life Member and member for 35 years I feel that the NRA does not represent my views. It has become abundantly clear over the years that the NRA is more concerned about its image as the 300 pound gorilla of the firearms movement than actually doing something of significance for gun owners. I thought seriously about resigning my membership when the organization began its campaign for the establishment of the conceal carry system rather than sticking up for our rights without government approval and interference. It was at this time that I quit donating funds to the ILA. It is obvious to many of us that the NRA is absolutely anti open carry and believes in “reasonable restrictions” rather than sticking up for the US Constitution and that of the state of NV.
Further, it is my experience, and that of many I have been in contact with, that the NRA is almost totally unresponsive to the membership.
I will be asking others not to support this event or any in the future where our funds are spent with anti firearms venues.
Regards
wrightme
Regular Member
Throw out the baby with the bathwater. You two are choosing to not support the good. That is your choice, but I feel it is a shortsighted one, especially given the response. The cost to move would come out of funds raised from the event.
Vegassteve
Regular Member
NO what was short sighted was the NRA. This is just another example. They could have done the work and found a location. They did not. So just as they ask us as members to boycott and write and call anti gunners, we will do the same to them.
I think there were more than two of us. And you are one of those who know that a vocal minority often represent the interests of many silent supporters.
The good being holding a pro-gun event that prohibits possession of firearms by paying attendees. Did I miss something?
Given the response? Do you mean this one: "the cause is bigger than the local hotel." Because he's asking us to believe something the staff doesn't believe. Or did you perhaps mean this response: "Even though we respect the rights of gun owners, we do not allow weapons to be carried open or concealed on our property." They both made about the same amount of sense.
Cost to move? You have already figured this out? You are assuming there are nonrefundable costs associated with leaving a venue that misled us? We are five weeks out. Did we already spend a ton of money moving in furniture or something? Perhaps you can share some numbers with us since you know them. Or is it somehow better to hold it at a well-known fancy wallpapered hotel's banquet room regardless of the betrayal? I'm a donor, too, not just a dinner and possible raffle ticket buyer. Don't forget to figure those like me into your math.
wrightme
Regular Member
The cause IS bigger, no matter what you hold as opinion. And, the response was fair.
An event that is already planned WILL be very likely to have non-refundable costs for a short notice withdraw.
I have said it before. Either you believe in and support the programs that the FofNRA funds, and are willing to donate, or you are not. You have chosen to not support those programs.
Vegassteve
Regular Member
Well from the about web page of the friends it seems the 2nd Amendment is not of the highest priority anyway. I think they mention it one time.
http://www.friendsofnra.org/national.aspx?cid=7
wrightme may have missed it, but I was a volunteer organizer for FoNRA events in the past. I can tell you guns were allowed at all the ones I was a part of. I've also donated more to them than modesty would find prudent in this thread. In their defense, they are not legislative in purpose, they are education and safety and training oriented, getting ranges built and funding school programs where they can; stuff like that.
He's also sticking to his story that he knows we will lose money if we move it. I'm simply asking how he KNOWS that to be the case, even when it appears we were directly misled about the firearms. But it's better to just assume wrightness and press on with defending all things NRA.
Yet I might assume he is one of those who tells gun owners to vote with their wallets when choosing which department store to shop at. Yet, we must support an anti-gun FoNRA event? I donate a lot of time and money to NRA and local training events without needing their help; so this year I will continue to vote with my wallet who organizes my donations as well. Makes sense.
We said our peace to the NRA rep, and we were respectful in making sure he understood our views. In reality, we did what we should have done. And the FoNRA can make their decisions with that information. No one is a bad guy here. But not all good guys have to saddle up together when some of them are making what others consider to be bad compromises that hurt our cause in other ways.
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He lives on the other side of the state. But I will offer him an OC lunch at a gun-friendly bar & grill if he ever makes it down here. I can even find some with available banquet facilities if he is really hungry.
He may not realize what a serious fight we wage with trying to get hotels to realize their anti-gun policies are unproductive. Buying their banquet facilities with a check from the NRA basically cancels out a year of our efforts.
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You do realize that your comments are nothing more than opinion also, right?
One can actually support programs that the FoNRA funds without being a part of the FoNRA.
wrightme
Regular Member
Maybe it would help to focus upon what they DO have as their highest priority, and then if you support THEIR highest priorities, support them. It appears that pointing out the venue has grown fruit, and also, that assistance has been asked of those who pointed it out. To me, that IS a success. To expect them to change a banquet venue on short notice is a bit overarching.
wrightme
Regular Member
Who said a thing about being a part of the FoNRA? This is about either attending the banquet to support, or not attending the banquet to support. And, at least one person here is going to actively tell others to NOT support by attending. What does that do to support the programs of the FoNRA?
wrightme
Regular Member
Good. If you still support them, supporting this banquet would be proper.
I am sticking to my view of it, where a major banquet is likely to have up-front costs that are not refundable, and that shifting to another venue on short notice may be more expensive. Maybe you have information to refute that view, but you have not presented any yet.MAC702 said:
Yes, it does appear that the coordinators were misled about firearms. It is up to them to evaluate how that can, or even if, that can be addressed.
??? The organization indicates that they do NOT want future events at unfriendly venues, right? Why would you withhold support? It makes sense to withhold support from the Santa Fe, but not from the FoNRA.MAC702 said:
The only people 'saddling up' here is by those who are choosing to boycott the event and also who are actively seeking to get others to boycott the event.MAC702 said:
wrightme
Regular Member
I have not planned a 400+ mile trip to attend.
The cause IS bigger [than FoNRA], no matter what you hold as opinion. And, th[is] response was fair.
When I am told to leave a store because I am armed, should I ask for permission to finish shopping, or in any way beg and plead with them to GIVE THEM MY MONEY first? Yeah, same thing.
Maybe half a ticket price goes to FoNRA. The rest goes to the venue for the meal, etc. FoNRA makes their real money at these events with the raffles, donations, and auctions. I can donate to the cause without supporting the venue. NRA is more aware than ever that they need to pay attention to such matters. If we all went anyway, they will plan next year's event with the attitude: "But Hotel Anti- is bigger, nicer, and they are going to give us this great deal. And remember that all the true firearms-freedoms guys showed up anyway..."
I don't know if you've ever been down here or not, but we have banquet facilities up the yin-yang here. 4-1/2 weeks out is nothing when it comes to finding one, especially in this economy. I've planned an entire FoNRA banquet in less than a month. They already have everything planned and merely need change the venue. I'm not so easily going to assume they can't move it. It is FAR more likely that they just won't.
The point is to make the point - if you believe in carrying a gun (open or concealed), there is no reason to patronize an anti-carry establishment.
If my daughter were to propose holding her reception in such an establishment, I would convince her of the folly of that decision (she shoots). If she insisted, I would not contribute any funds to pay for the reception.
FoNRA and their "local Nevada chairperson" dropped the ball.
mbogo470
P.S. Although I am new here, I discovered that the 'ignore list' is a great place to relegate our local contrarian.
If my daughter were to propose holding her reception in such an establishment, I would convince her of the folly of that decision (she shoots). If she insisted, I would not contribute any funds to pay for the reception.
FoNRA and their "local Nevada chairperson" dropped the ball.
mbogo470
P.S. Although I am new here, I discovered that the 'ignore list' is a great place to relegate our local contrarian.