I was arrested by El Cajon PD today...

[NMHasOpenCarry]

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backthebadge wrote:

a real (SEASONED VETERAN OFFICER) carries concealed and doesn't want the public to know he's an off duty officer.

I am a "seasoned, veteran off-duty" Stuckey's waiter and, even though permitted to open carry, I'm alwaysconcealed, except when out in the wilderness (or among a group who are all carrying open).

Element of surprise is always in my favor, and I am the one to decide how the situation escalates (or doesn't).

With all due respect to my Kalifornia friends, carrying open/unloaded is suicide if you ask me.

 

[elsensei]

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NMHasOpenCarry wrote:

backthebadge wrote:

a real (SEASONED VETERAN OFFICER) carries concealed and doesn't want the public to know he's an off duty officer.

I am a "seasoned, veteran off-duty" Stuckey's waiter and, even though permitted to open carry, I'm alwaysconcealed, except when out in the wilderness (or among a group who are all carrying open).

Element of surprise is always in my favor, and I am the one to decide how the situation escalates (or doesn't).

With all due respect to my Kalifornia friends, carrying open/unloaded is suicide if you ask me.

If our dickhead legislators would get out of our way, we'd all be carrying concealed. We don't OC because we want to, but because that's the only option available.

 

[NMHasOpenCarry]

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elsensei wrote:

If our dickhead legislators would get out of our way, we'd all be carrying concealed. We don't OC because we want to, but because that's the only option available.

Move! I did (and I was one of few who had a CCW permit in San Diego). Wouldn't go back to Kalifornia if you bought me a house on the beach filled with hookers and jello hot tubs.

Let all the dirty hippies, militant tree-huggersand non-gun whacko's have the entire state. Much easier to go where you're appreciated. Fighting gun laws in CA is like pee-ing up a rope (while juggling cats).

 

[grumpycoconut]

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Giaking70,

Your story seemslegit on its face to me. Some concerns though.

#1 If you ain't apeace officeras defined in PC830 et seq. stay away from calling yourself an "officer" unless you qualify it with words like security, military, etc. As soon as you use "officer" people will assume that you are a police and you will lose all credibility when the quailifiers are brought to light. Yourvague description makes me think that you are actually a non-sworn security officer who works for the Sheriff or the Marshall. If this is the case I would strongly recommend againsteven thinking of yourself as a LEO. If you do it's likely to result in a peepee spanking one of these days. The fields may be related but there is a big hard divider between them.

#2 As soon as they moved you from inside the mall to outside the mall they arrested you no matter what they said about it still being a detention. While the Supremes never prescribed just how much movement it takes to createan arrest out of adetention, I'm thinking that your particulars could easily equal an arrest if you choose to make an issue of it.

#3 When they unarrested you theydid so underPC849(b)(1). 849(b)(1) gives police the authority torelease someone rather than taking them before a magistratewhen insufficient grounds to make a criminal complaint against you exist. I'm hoping that ECPD gave you some document showing this. Don't ever go screaming "false arrest" because the way you describe it the cops arrested you because they believed they hadprobable cause based on their knowledge of the law. They then sought out wiser and more learned heads who schooled them on the current state of the law. Based on the new information they properly unarrested you, gave you back your toys and put you back where they found you. No harm, no foul on either side.

#4 Police don't need to read you Mirandajust becausethey arrest you.They only need to tell you of your rights if you are arrested and they are going to question you about the circumstances surrounding your arrest or another criminal matter. They also don't need to invoke the magical Miranda admonishment word for word to get the job done. As long as you get the point that you can shut up if you want to and you can talk to a lawyer before you spill your guts the job is done.

#5 If you are going to play this game you need, I'll type it again in bold, YOU NEED to make sure that you have all your little ducks in a nice neat row so that any issues can be resolved at the curb side rather than in the station. You NEED to know the law. Your posts show you have some idea of what the laws are but you don't really KNOW the law. You NEED to keep a copy of relevant laws on you if you are going to go strapped. You NEED to keep fresh batteries in your recorder. YouNEED to know the terminology.Words in the law are like scalpels. Theyare very specific things and can cut you if missused.Misusingthe vocabulary is just as much an indicator of potential interweb BS as not knowing how the police do what they do after letting folks think you are a police.

#6 Don't ever assume that just because you know some cops they know you back.

#7 Your story needs to be spread far and wide in California so that OCers can see that things can work out right even if the OCer screws up a bit. You story also needs to get into police ears so that they can learn that UOC is legal and that they can resolve man with a gun calls at the curb. Of course the more your story spread, the more likely it is that it will get back to your bosses. When it gets back to your bosses you can be sure that you will be standing tall and answering some questions. Who knows, maybe you will win the unlawful termination law suit with a tidy judgement. Kind of a hard way to gain another winfor the open carry movement don't you think.

Please don't take this post as me ripping on you. I mean it with the best of educational intentions. I'm glad things worked out right but damnit man, if you are gonna play the game make things easier on everyone andplay it right.




Hey! even if this guy is a lying troll some of you are still acting like dicks.

 

[giaking70]

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ok, pardon my usage of every term I used in my story of being arrested, maybe you would like to get arrested for something you technically did not commit a crime for.

One I was frigging pissed at them for even saying my gun was loaded when it was NOT.

Two, the officer was implying because the ammunition and weapon are in such close proximity that the weapon was indeed loaded in his eyes.

Third off, from my understanding, Penal Code 12031 (e) says something to the extent of demanding inspection of the weapon to ascertain that the weapon is unloaded. Therefore, I guess its ok for them to just come up and out-right ******* take it from you without even asking or "demanding" like its worded. Then, after they take my firearm, they dont even give it back to me once they deem its unloaded, like its worded in PC 12031 (e) and let me go about my goddamned lawful business. They are supposed to by law return the weapon, not keep it for over an hour and a half.

Fourth off, yes I am a security guard and damned proud of it. No, I dont work security at a mall if you are so inclined to want to know.

Fifth off...I never once said I was a LEO, I was just trying to protect the fact that because of where I work, it should not come into play once they found out what I do. They did give me a little more courtesy than I have seen them give most. Just for your information, I work as a Transit Enforcement Officer.

Sixth off....some of them are a laughing stock for officers because some of them had no clue what they were doing. Sorry, not making fun of LEO in general for those of you here that are. I think you know what I mean when you are around officers that just don't seem to get it. Again, please forgive my typing at that remark, I honestly don't mean no harm with it, just still pissed off about this whole ordeal. I sit here and listen to my recording over and over and visualize the whole incident and how some of them honestly just did NOT know what they were doing.

Seventh off...Blackhawk SERPA Holster...there you happy?? Its black in color kinda small, fits my Glock nice and snugly...anything else you want me to tell you about it aside that I miss-spelled the actual name of the model of it? Oh, it comes with a small paddle attachment as well.

Eight off...any time you would like to hear the recording, I would love to share it with you...now if I can only find that darned CD it came with. You wouldn't believe the crap they were saying on it anyways.

You know, I wasnt really all that mad about it after it happened. But now that I have had time to let it sink in, I am pissed....lol. Please forgive me guys....and gals if I am offending anyone here. I am just venting and I dont really have anyone here to talk to about it. Most of my friends are all anti-guns anyways. They would just laugh and tell me I was lucky they didnt kill me. So much for compassionate friends eh? I cant sleep so thats why I am on here.

 

[tuna quesadilla]

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NMHasOpenCarry wrote:

elsensei wrote:

If our dickhead legislators would get out of our way, we'd all be carrying concealed. We don't OC because we want to, but because that's the only option available.

Move! I did (and I was one of few who had a CCW permit in San Diego). Wouldn't go back to Kalifornia if you bought me a house on the beach filled with hookers and jello hot tubs.

Let all the dirty hippies, militant tree-huggersand non-gun whacko's have the entire state. Much easier to go where you're appreciated. Fighting gun laws in CA is like pee-ing up a rope (while juggling cats).

You gonna hook me up with a job that pays the same as where I'm working now? If you haven't noticed, it's just a little bit hard (read: Impossible) to find employment right now. So stop that tired "move from California" argument. We OC because we have no better alternative, and we're not going to give up our jobs to go live in some other state with a horrible climate.

It's people like YOU that are responsible for the gun laws we have here in CA anyways. We need every last activist to stay in the state and FIGHT just like the rest of us. How many letters and phone calls have you written to California legislators? How many people's minds have you changed about gun laws? I'm guessing few to none. You just tucked tail and left the rest of us to suffer. We need people to stay behind enemy lines and slow down and eventually stop California's transition into a liberal cesspool.

So thanks for your suggestion, but no, we're not going to abandon our homes and give up on California and let it turn into a filthy haven for gun-hating liberals. We need people to stay here to fight and educate. I guess you weren't up to the task.

 

[NMHasOpenCarry]

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giaking70 wrote:

Just for your information, I work as a Transit Enforcement Officer.

OK. You're basically a meter maid. Fair enough.

Eight off...any time you would like to hear the recording, I would love to share it with you...now if I can only find that darned CD it came with. You wouldn't believe the crap they were saying on it anyways.

Once again: How did you reach in to your pocket to turn the recorder on while you had your hands in the air/handcuffs? The cop grabbed your arm while you were trying on sunglasses. No time to hit "record/play"...? What is the make/model of the recorder? DLL's and OS's for ANY modern product are widely/easily available on the 'net.

 

[giaking70]

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the recorder was active before I entered the building...the recorder is a digital voice recorder...made by Olympus..think I spelled it right...

 

[NMHasOpenCarry]

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tuna quesadilla wrote:

NMHasOpenCarry wrote:

elsensei wrote:

If our dickhead legislators would get out of our way, we'd all be carrying concealed. We don't OC because we want to, but because that's the only option available.

Move! I did (and I was one of few who had a CCW permit in San Diego). Wouldn't go back to Kalifornia if you bought me a house on the beach filled with hookers and jello hot tubs.

Let all the dirty hippies, militant tree-huggersand non-gun whacko's have the entire state. Much easier to go where you're appreciated. Fighting gun laws in CA is like pee-ing up a rope (while juggling cats).

You gonna hook me up with a job that pays the same as where I'm working now? If you haven't noticed, it's just a little bit hard (read: Impossible) to find employment right now. So stop that tired "move from California" argument. We OC because we have no better alternative, and we're not going to give up our jobs to go live in some other state with a horrible climate.

It's people like YOU that are responsible for the gun laws we have here in CA anyways. We need every last activist to stay in the state and FIGHT just like the rest of us. How many letters and phone calls have you written to California legislators? How many people's minds have you changed about gun laws? I'm guessing few to none. You just tucked tail and left the rest of us to suffer. We need people to stay behind enemy lines and slow down and eventually stop California's transition into a liberal cesspool.

So thanks for your suggestion, but no, we're not going to abandon our homes and give up on California and let it turn into a filthy haven for gun-hating liberals. We need people to stay here to fight and educate. I guess you weren't up to the task.

"Horrible climate"?!? LOL. I guess you haven't been to Southern NM lately.


I made $50k/yr. in CA. I make $250k a year in NM. Not a lot of "techhies" here, so if you're talented, you can write your own ticket.

Before I was issued my CCW (San Diego), I carried concealed for almost 20 yrs. How many times was I stopped/frisked in CA during those 20 yrs.? Zero.

When I left CA, all my guns were legal. If I were to go back today, I would have to leave all of them behind except one. That's progress? Sorry if I hurt your feelings, but I know a losing fight when I see it.

Oh...and my state's budget is balanced, too... (and I can carry what I want, where I want).

Good luck! You're gonna need it. You're the one living in an over-regulated, over-taxed hell-hole, not me!

 

[grumpycoconut]

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Giaking70,

Ease off the throttle there hotrod. You started off by telling a good story and you are letting folks twist your tail. This is the interweb and lots of folks revel in picking nits and casting aspersions. Transit enforcement is honorable work and you should be proud of it. All the more reason for you to be extra well prepared when you OC. You don't want to throw it away all for lack of preparation.

Third off, folks need to understand that police will keep sneaking up on OCers and laying hands on and taking guns from holster and keeping guns until they are satisfied that things are Code 4 until OC is so common that it stops being notable. You know that you are not going to draw down on them but they don't know you from Adam. It's gonna take time and effort but you will get to the OC mountain top someday.

Until thatday comes you can either eat yourself upwith being pissed off or you can drink a beer, take a nap and look at this thing with freshun-pissed off eyeslater.

 

[NMHasOpenCarry]

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giaking70 wrote:

the recorder was active before I entered the building...the recorder is a digital voice recorder...made by Olympus..think I spelled it right...

So you had the wherewithall to activate the recorder before you entered the mall in anticipation of a confrontation?

Google search, 1.2 sec:

http://www.olympusamerica.com/cpg_section/software_results.asp?id=1126

 

[giaking70]

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my recorder was active before I walked into the building, its a digital voice recorder by Olympus...pretty nice actually...

 

[giaking70]

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oops...sorry bout the second post, I didn't see the first one and thought it didn't go through...my bad

 

[NMHasOpenCarry]

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grumpycoconut wrote:

Third off, folks need to understand that police will keep sneaking up on OCers and laying hands on and taking guns from holster and keeping guns until they are satisfied that things are Code 4 until OC is so common that it stops being notable. You know that you are not going to draw down on them but they don't know you from Adam. It's gonna take time and effort but you will get to the OC mountain top someday.

No, what's going to happen is "Thelma & Louise" (Boxer/Feinstein) are going to get their panties in a wad by seeing so many OC'ers that they'll pass legislation to make it illegal. And, with all the limp-wristed, bed-wettinganti-gunners in the state, any vote will be severely lopsided in their favor (cough, cough...assault weapons ban, cough).

Stay alive...carry concealed in the interim while petitioningfor CCW laws (or vote with your wallet and leave that sinking ship of a state). Rubbing it in their faces ain't going to make it better.

 

[giaking70]

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to be honest with you, I don't look at it as a "confrontation", I look at it as a liability. Confrontation as you are referring to would mean that I am just looking for a fight. I know you didn't come out-right and say the word fight. But generally, confrontation would lead up to it if I am correct on that wording. Maybe depends on how you view confrontation.

I keep the recorder with me because what if they say something that really didn't happen, or who's to say that when they inspect my weapon they aren't in fact putting a live round in it to just take me in and arrest me. Believe it or not, digital recorders can pick up quite a bit. My weapon was almost twenty feet away when I saw the officer closing the slide. The recorder actually picked that sound up and you can hear the slide being dropped clearly as if you were standing next to it...and inside a busy retailer as well.

I could say something to myself like..."Oh my god he just put a live round in my gun" and if that point were argued later, I have audio proof...make sense?

 

[giaking70]

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NMH...believe me, if I could just pack up and leave this state, I would, but I am not in that position where I can...

 

[NMHasOpenCarry]

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giaking70 wrote:

to be honest with you, I don't look at it as a "confrontation", I look at it as a liability. Confrontation as you are referring to would mean that I am just looking for a fight. I know you didn't come out-right and say the word fight. But generally, confrontation would lead up to it if I am correct on that wording. Maybe depends on how you view confrontation.

I keep the recorder with me because what if they say something that really didn't happen, or who's to say that when they inspect my weapon they aren't in fact putting a live round in it to just take me in and arrest me. Believe it or not, digital recorders can pick up quite a bit. My weapon was almost twenty feet away when I saw the officer closing the slide. The recorder actually picked that sound up and you can hear the slide being dropped clearly as if you were standing next to it...and inside a busy retailer as well.

I could say something to myself like..."Oh my god he just put a live round in my gun" and if that point were argued later, I have audio proof...make sense?

Makes sense. Now...I've given you the link to Olympus software. Upload the audio and make all us naysayers eat crow, mm-kay?

 

[NMHasOpenCarry]

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giaking70 wrote:

NMH...believe me, if I could just pack up and leave this state, I would, but I am not in that position where I can...

Really? How the hell do you afford to live there on the salary of a transit ticket taker?

 

[giaking70]

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there was about twenty five minutes of recording before the recorders batteries went dead. The last roughly 6 minutes is where they came in and arrested me. I am will to get this uploaded as soon as I can...another problem, gotta find the tiny usb cable it came with now...

 

[giaking70]

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I live here carefully....lol