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"Man With A Gun" Incident at UVA
- Thread starter leprechaun117
- Start date
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Everyone I think had some sort of part in the reasons why this stuff goes on. Whether its the video games like in Grand Theft Auto, state of emergency, you can shoot people at random and get points for killing them... or the lack of parental supervision to say yes this is fun, but its not real.
I blame the media, for glorifying these people... If you don't believe im right, think to yourself and see if you can remember the nuts who shot up columbine? Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold. Those are 2 for the history books. But now, this new guy has a top score right? So my guess is, they are going to paste this guy all across the screen until a new guy emerges. Which is rather sad, that the media outlets don't even share a hint of responsibility in what goes on here. Would be shooters, see all of this media circus as "this could be me, across the TV, in history books forever" you know? CNN just wants a story, but they drag it out past the point of human decency.And we have all summer once school lets out to start the finger pointing game over who's responsible, because after all, they are never going to find out why that guy didwhat he did- here in america someone has to pay though right?After all, making a rule that limits the airtime ofschool shooters would be limiting freedom of speech right, theres no respect towards victims families here? If someone really wants to do something constructive it would be nice maybe at the end of May to start a concealed carry class over at the university. I guarantee people will sign up.
Everyone I think had some sort of part in the reasons why this stuff goes on. Whether its the video games like in Grand Theft Auto, state of emergency, you can shoot people at random and get points for killing them... or the lack of parental supervision to say yes this is fun, but its not real.
I blame the media, for glorifying these people... If you don't believe im right, think to yourself and see if you can remember the nuts who shot up columbine? Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold. Those are 2 for the history books. But now, this new guy has a top score right? So my guess is, they are going to paste this guy all across the screen until a new guy emerges. Which is rather sad, that the media outlets don't even share a hint of responsibility in what goes on here. Would be shooters, see all of this media circus as "this could be me, across the TV, in history books forever" you know? CNN just wants a story, but they drag it out past the point of human decency.And we have all summer once school lets out to start the finger pointing game over who's responsible, because after all, they are never going to find out why that guy didwhat he did- here in america someone has to pay though right?After all, making a rule that limits the airtime ofschool shooters would be limiting freedom of speech right, theres no respect towards victims families here? If someone really wants to do something constructive it would be nice maybe at the end of May to start a concealed carry class over at the university. I guarantee people will sign up.
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Actually, the media could be part of the problem. Not because things didn't get reported in the past, but instead because they get covered endlessly now. Some of these types are looking for their version of "fame" and they now know how to get it. Look at the difference between the two shootings last week. One killer releases a video and a press kit, while the other just acts on an office grudge.
Actually, the media could be part of the problem. Not because things didn't get reported in the past, but instead because they get covered endlessly now. Some of these types are looking for their version of "fame" and they now know how to get it. Look at the difference between the two shootings last week. One killer releases a video and a press kit, while the other just acts on an office grudge.
acrimsontide
Regular Member
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This whole idea of OCing at VT right now just doesn't make sense to me. I think common sense should apply after a tragedy. Hell if someone had been setting fires on campus would you walk around with a can of gasoline. There is a time and place for everything and out of respect for the families and for the students on campus, this is not the time for a civilian to be walking aroung with a firearm on VT's campus.(or any other campus right now) Just my opinion.
This whole idea of OCing at VT right now just doesn't make sense to me. I think common sense should apply after a tragedy. Hell if someone had been setting fires on campus would you walk around with a can of gasoline. There is a time and place for everything and out of respect for the families and for the students on campus, this is not the time for a civilian to be walking aroung with a firearm on VT's campus.(or any other campus right now) Just my opinion.
44Brent
Regular Member
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LEO 229:
Your presumption that students will be "traumatized" by seeing someone openly carry a pistol in a holster for self defense is not supported by any studies. It is simplyyour unsupported opinion.
Your notion that it is acceptable foryou to openly carry pistols, but that it is not acceptable for citizens to openly carry pistols near or on a campus is nothing more than bigotry and elitism at its worst.
LEO 229:
Your presumption that students will be "traumatized" by seeing someone openly carry a pistol in a holster for self defense is not supported by any studies. It is simplyyour unsupported opinion.
Your notion that it is acceptable foryou to openly carry pistols, but that it is not acceptable for citizens to openly carry pistols near or on a campus is nothing more than bigotry and elitism at its worst.
HankT
State Researcher
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acrimsontide wrote:
I think "the whole idea of OCing at VT right now" is atrociously simplistic and very stubbornly self-righteous.
And counterproductive. And, possibly, tragic.
acrimsontide wrote:
I think "the whole idea of OCing at VT right now" is atrociously simplistic and very stubbornly self-righteous.
And counterproductive. And, possibly, tragic.
acrimsontide
Regular Member
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44Brent Again I have to respectfully disagree. I don't think the students would feel threatened by an LEO carrying on campus considering that they are probably used to the increased security. On the other hand, it would be quite possible, actually PROBABLE that a student would be concerned with a civilian walking around with a firearm. Open carry at thistime would, in my opinion be disrepectful and unwise and it certainly would not help the cause of gun owners after what has just happened there. In fact, open carry on campus right now just mightcause some pro gun legislators to vote for anti gun measures. Timing is everything and in my humble opinion, NOW AIN't THE TIME. I am as pro gun as can be, but at this time, I think it would be ridiculous to open carry on VT's campus!!!
44Brent Again I have to respectfully disagree. I don't think the students would feel threatened by an LEO carrying on campus considering that they are probably used to the increased security. On the other hand, it would be quite possible, actually PROBABLE that a student would be concerned with a civilian walking around with a firearm. Open carry at thistime would, in my opinion be disrepectful and unwise and it certainly would not help the cause of gun owners after what has just happened there. In fact, open carry on campus right now just mightcause some pro gun legislators to vote for anti gun measures. Timing is everything and in my humble opinion, NOW AIN't THE TIME. I am as pro gun as can be, but at this time, I think it would be ridiculous to open carry on VT's campus!!!
leprechaun117
Regular Member
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67GT390FB:
I am not a student, nor have I ever been. I'm commenting based on what I've been told over the many years that I have known UVA students. I was under the assumption that the reasons for being refered to the honor board were fairly wide sweeping... it seems I was incorrect.
acrimsontide:
As I have said before, I have been carrying on a college campus since the VT incident and have had nothing but good experiences... on a much more frequent basis than before the incident. Students seem to be genuinely interested in the fact that they are allowed to protect themselves, and few seem to have any clue that guns are legal to carry.
I will continue to carry near the UVA campus. Any one who has been to Charlottesville knows that the campus is almost unavoidable if you plan on having dinner or going out. I am not actually on campus all that frequently, but I do not hesitate to carry on it.
If I were in the Blacksburg area I believe that I would refrian from carrying on the VT campus, for fear of unwanted LEO attention/hassling. Several of my VT friends have asked to go shooting with me... including a girl that i used to date :shock:I might just have to start calling her again....
67GT390FB:
I am not a student, nor have I ever been. I'm commenting based on what I've been told over the many years that I have known UVA students. I was under the assumption that the reasons for being refered to the honor board were fairly wide sweeping... it seems I was incorrect.
acrimsontide:
As I have said before, I have been carrying on a college campus since the VT incident and have had nothing but good experiences... on a much more frequent basis than before the incident. Students seem to be genuinely interested in the fact that they are allowed to protect themselves, and few seem to have any clue that guns are legal to carry.
I will continue to carry near the UVA campus. Any one who has been to Charlottesville knows that the campus is almost unavoidable if you plan on having dinner or going out. I am not actually on campus all that frequently, but I do not hesitate to carry on it.
If I were in the Blacksburg area I believe that I would refrian from carrying on the VT campus, for fear of unwanted LEO attention/hassling. Several of my VT friends have asked to go shooting with me... including a girl that i used to date :shock:I might just have to start calling her again....
danbus
Regular Member
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I OC'd at NSU last week, 3 days after the shooting. The response I received from students was "THAT'SWHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT, PROTECTION!".
IMO, it's a matter of personal choice. I have the RIGHT to OC anywhere legally at anytime. It's nota sensitive thing to do as people are emotional over said events, however that event just reaffirms my reasons for carrying. And like I've always said, I refuse to be disarmed over someone's feelings.
I OC'd at NSU last week, 3 days after the shooting. The response I received from students was "THAT'SWHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT, PROTECTION!".
IMO, it's a matter of personal choice. I have the RIGHT to OC anywhere legally at anytime. It's nota sensitive thing to do as people are emotional over said events, however that event just reaffirms my reasons for carrying. And like I've always said, I refuse to be disarmed over someone's feelings.
72Malibu
Regular Member
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danbus wrote:
Coming from some of the places I've lived,that would bea surprise for me to hear. Granted, we're in Virginia. I wonder what the response would be had the shooting occurred somewhere in Maryland or California (and, hypothetically, if OC were allowed there).
danbus wrote:
Coming from some of the places I've lived,that would bea surprise for me to hear. Granted, we're in Virginia. I wonder what the response would be had the shooting occurred somewhere in Maryland or California (and, hypothetically, if OC were allowed there).
Hawkflyer
Founder's Club Member
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44Brent wrote:
I can only suppose that you believe that telling sex jokes in front of rape victims is ok just to break the tension, compassion be damed. After all people are rarely "traumatized" by humor.
I suppose you also believe that VDCL should set up a tables at the funerals for these victims. Certainly these families will want this message distributed and timing is not really important, right?
NO!! LEO229 was (is) not wrong.
This is not the time to be pushing your PERSONAL firearms agenda on the survivors of this shooting incident. This is the time to provide them some space and time to come to peace with what they have experienced. You certainly have rights, but you also have responsibilities. Among those responsibilities is knowing WHEN and WHERE it is appropriate to carry openly. Shoving your gun in the face of these people at this time is just wrong. If you cannot see that then you are part of the problem, not part of the solution.
I agree with LEO229's opinion on this. If you would actually read what he wrote, his opinion also included a PRO-OC position, at the right time and place. He specifically stated that in his original statement. You would have to be a complete idiot not to see the difference in comfort level for these survivors when they see a LEO with a weapon as opposed to an armed non-LEO. After all the shooter in this incident was an Armed non-LEO. Right now the difference between an armed murderer and an armed lawful citizen is a distinction without a difference, and that distinction is lost in the fog of terror and grief of the recent events in these peoples lives.
Regards
44Brent wrote:
I can only suppose that you believe that telling sex jokes in front of rape victims is ok just to break the tension, compassion be damed. After all people are rarely "traumatized" by humor.
I suppose you also believe that VDCL should set up a tables at the funerals for these victims. Certainly these families will want this message distributed and timing is not really important, right?
NO!! LEO229 was (is) not wrong.
This is not the time to be pushing your PERSONAL firearms agenda on the survivors of this shooting incident. This is the time to provide them some space and time to come to peace with what they have experienced. You certainly have rights, but you also have responsibilities. Among those responsibilities is knowing WHEN and WHERE it is appropriate to carry openly. Shoving your gun in the face of these people at this time is just wrong. If you cannot see that then you are part of the problem, not part of the solution.
I agree with LEO229's opinion on this. If you would actually read what he wrote, his opinion also included a PRO-OC position, at the right time and place. He specifically stated that in his original statement. You would have to be a complete idiot not to see the difference in comfort level for these survivors when they see a LEO with a weapon as opposed to an armed non-LEO. After all the shooter in this incident was an Armed non-LEO. Right now the difference between an armed murderer and an armed lawful citizen is a distinction without a difference, and that distinction is lost in the fog of terror and grief of the recent events in these peoples lives.
Regards
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44Brent wrote:
So what your saying... is if there has been no study.. what has been saidcannot be true.
I am not sure many studieshave been done dealing with a record mass murder at a school. I am speaking from personal experience and from life experience. If you think victims do not feel scared for a while after the event... your kidding yourself.
Since studies are required to back up what you say.... I have not been studied so you have nothing to support your allegation that I ama bigot and an elitist.
Have a nice day.
44Brent wrote:
So what your saying... is if there has been no study.. what has been saidcannot be true.
I am not sure many studieshave been done dealing with a record mass murder at a school. I am speaking from personal experience and from life experience. If you think victims do not feel scared for a while after the event... your kidding yourself.
Since studies are required to back up what you say.... I have not been studied so you have nothing to support your allegation that I ama bigot and an elitist.
Have a nice day.
Hawkflyer
Founder's Club Member
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44Brent wrote:
Yea, His opinion and the the specific statements of a number of people interviewed on the VT campus.
Moreover, there have been studies on Officer involved shootings, that have shown the need for significant post incident recovery periods. These studies have shown that people involved in shooting incidents become overly sensitive to loud noises, have nightmares, and generally have difficulties adjusting to normal life after the incident.
An informed person might recognize and call this "Post Traumatic Stress Disorder" (PTSD). In particular the Students at VT are displaying symptoms of "Acute PTSD".
Wiki definition
If you must have an actual cite try this one selected at random from the thousands available on the subject of PTSD.
Office of veterans affairs - PTSD
In case you want a less authoritative source than the US Military you might try -
Mental Health Channel
44Brent - You really need to get out more, and while you are out, you might try looking at the world through the eyes of others. You might be surprised at what you see. It is obvious from your posts that you have never actually b been involved in an incident where you were certain you were about to die. I don't mean an incident where you COULD have died, I mean one where you KNEW you would die, and afterward you were shocked and surprised that you did not. You are indeed fortunate in that regard, but it has made you very insensitive to the issues confronting those that have.
No LEO229 is not wrong about this. But he is confronted by a lot of resistance from insensitive sots who have obviously never been where he and others have been.
Regards
44Brent wrote:
Yea, His opinion and the the specific statements of a number of people interviewed on the VT campus.
Moreover, there have been studies on Officer involved shootings, that have shown the need for significant post incident recovery periods. These studies have shown that people involved in shooting incidents become overly sensitive to loud noises, have nightmares, and generally have difficulties adjusting to normal life after the incident.
An informed person might recognize and call this "Post Traumatic Stress Disorder" (PTSD). In particular the Students at VT are displaying symptoms of "Acute PTSD".
Wiki definition
If you must have an actual cite try this one selected at random from the thousands available on the subject of PTSD.
Office of veterans affairs - PTSD
In case you want a less authoritative source than the US Military you might try -
Mental Health Channel
44Brent - You really need to get out more, and while you are out, you might try looking at the world through the eyes of others. You might be surprised at what you see. It is obvious from your posts that you have never actually b been involved in an incident where you were certain you were about to die. I don't mean an incident where you COULD have died, I mean one where you KNEW you would die, and afterward you were shocked and surprised that you did not. You are indeed fortunate in that regard, but it has made you very insensitive to the issues confronting those that have.
No LEO229 is not wrong about this. But he is confronted by a lot of resistance from insensitive sots who have obviously never been where he and others have been.
Regards
Hawkflyer
Founder's Club Member
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HankT
State Researcher
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He comes back with a BANG!!
Welcome back, Hawkflyer.
He comes back with a BANG!!
Welcome back, Hawkflyer.